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To not see the appeal of Reform

421 replies

Reallyneedsaholiday · 01/09/2025 15:57

Sure, I can see the appeal of “reform” (with a lower case “r”), noone is under any illusion that the country is in a great way, at the moment, but not the appeal of the Reform political party. And I genuinely want to understand what it is that has so many people in thrall to them. All I’m hearing is “sToP tHE bOAtS”, but Reform will not do this, no matter what they are saying now. Simply returning anyone who arrives here on a boat, without following due process and considering their application, would see the country subjected to international sanctions, that we cannot afford. The only viable way to actually stop the boats, is to address why people are using them in the first place. WE have decreed that no one can apply from anywhere other than on our soil, and so have left them with little choice. France offered the opportunity to have a centre in Calais, Rwanda would have also worked, as a base where asylum seekers could apply without risking their lives on the channel. Those who are successful could be brought here safely, and anyone using unauthorised routes, could THEN be legally removed without appeal. It’s not a difficult solution, so you have to ask yourself “why” politicians turned down the opportunity. The only logical reason for this, is that they WANT the boats to continue. Again, you have to ask yourself “why”, and the reason for THAT is simply that they want the distraction, they need the scapegoat.
We’ve all seen the headlines, claiming that asylum seekers are living in the lap of luxury, with free phones etc, which is simply not true. Asylum seekers actually cost the country less than we lose through tax avoidance, every year.

But if we put immigration aside, as the distraction that it is, what appeals about Reform? I’ve asked many people and really struggle to find any Reform supporter who can even tell me what any of their policies are. Why are they so keen to sign away our human rights, leaving us to the whim of successive governments? Why are they so keen to introduce a private health care system (good luck getting any cover if your have any pre-existing medical conditions in your family)? Why are they so keen to introduce fracking? Or to scrap “net zero”? Tbh, I’m not completely sold on “net zero” myself, but overall, being more environmentally friendly strikes me as a positive move. Less pollution, less plastics, cleaner water, cheaper, safer energy etc, etc. you could scrap the title “net zero”, while keeping the important bits that would generally improve our quality of life, without throwing what we have achieved, to date, away.

I could go on, but I’d just like to ask anyone who is thinking of voting Reform, at the next opportunity, why? And how you see your own life improving IF they won a GE?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
pilates · 02/09/2025 06:00

A protest vote for what is on offer atm.

doubleshotcappuccino · 02/09/2025 05:57

The problem is that some will look away under the “I don’t do politics” and then slowly this hate spreads. It is obvious that the majority of these protestors look like they’re not working and don’t have much to do - they’re easy targets for reform to manipulate .

IwasatClaines · 02/09/2025 05:54

VashtaNerada · 02/09/2025 02:15

People feel disenfranchised and forgotten. For most of us, the people to blame for our situation are invisible in our daily lives. We just don’t see the super-rich-and-powerful who have screwed us over but we do see people with brown skin in our towns whose names we don’t know yet. Reform sells the lie that they’re to blame for what’s gone wrong and it’s a much easier story to understand than the truth. Facism has always done this but if you don’t know your history you may not realise the dangers posed by people like Farage until it’s too late.

I think you are right.

But what surprises me is that people still believe in Farage even after his empty promises during Brexit and then disappearing after it was voted in (along with Cameron) not staying around to do the dirty work of trying to make it administratively work.

why do people believe he is going to be a fresh change from Labour and Conservative?

3tumsnot1 · 02/09/2025 04:28

blueclip · 01/09/2025 22:13

Indeed this. It really is that simple. I don’t want to vote in con or lab next time. They are utterly appalling.

I think most people would agree with you….

but everyone should remember what happened at brexit. It’s so easy to turn up and spout a load of sometimes insane solutions that promise the world. Then in reality none of those things work or happen as promised but the damage is done.

this party have sod all experience of actually running anything. It’s so so easy to talk the talk…

VashtaNerada · 02/09/2025 03:58

cocoonscriticupgrading · 02/09/2025 03:04

If it is good enough for Ann Widdecombe, it is good enough for me. Sick of career politicians who care nothing for this country.

I hope that’s a joke! 😁

Gladysknightjustwalkinmyshoes · 02/09/2025 03:20

Anne Widdecombe..the voice of reason 🤯🤣🤣🤣🤣

cocoonscriticupgrading · 02/09/2025 03:04

If it is good enough for Ann Widdecombe, it is good enough for me. Sick of career politicians who care nothing for this country.

IShouldNotCoco · 02/09/2025 02:24

Cluborange666 · 01/09/2025 21:30

Simple answer: our lives wouldn’t improve. They promised us all that guff with Brexit.

And yet here we are 🤦🏻‍♀️ with so much support for a joke of a party that would make marital rape legal.

People never learn. In fact, ironically, Reform voters are pissed off because they’ve seen their quality of life go down the pan since Brexit and price -rises (which they probably voted for!) and instead of realising they made a big mistake they blame everyone else!

AnneOnAMoose · 02/09/2025 02:15

sleepwouldbenice · 02/09/2025 01:55

Again, other than immigration ( which i doubt will be solved but just 4 now assume is desktop with) in what way have they been clear on policies and solutions?

I don't tend to pay much attention to the policies of ANY party...

That's all just window dressing designed to win votes and throw their opponents off the scent of whatever they have in mind.

(First rule of business - don't let your competition know what you're planning before you're ready to go live with it - otherwise the competition will either steal your ideas or throw obstacles in your path)

None of them ever stick to their policies once they're in power.

It's what any party actually do once they're in power that counts - Actions speak louder than words, etc.

We've seen the ConLab actions over the past decades - And look at the mess we're in!

Time for a new broom.

VashtaNerada · 02/09/2025 02:15

People feel disenfranchised and forgotten. For most of us, the people to blame for our situation are invisible in our daily lives. We just don’t see the super-rich-and-powerful who have screwed us over but we do see people with brown skin in our towns whose names we don’t know yet. Reform sells the lie that they’re to blame for what’s gone wrong and it’s a much easier story to understand than the truth. Facism has always done this but if you don’t know your history you may not realise the dangers posed by people like Farage until it’s too late.

sleepwouldbenice · 02/09/2025 01:55

AnneOnAMoose · 02/09/2025 01:21

I like the fact that they don't mince their words when it comes to many of the issues. Whether that will translate to them rolling up their sleeves and actually fixing the problems if they get in - None of us knows.

But with ConLab, you can be sure that they will waste months and millions of pounds just kicking the can down the road.... cabinet reshuffle... Some new laws (that were already covered by existing laws, but because they can't even enforce those - they create new ones to make it look like they're doing something)... another cabinet re-shuffle... Endless days out playing fancy dress with a shiny high-viz and hard hat... another cabinet re-shuffle....Maybe setup a committee for something-or-other... Ohh - Not forgetting opening new Pork markets!

In the last 30-40 years, I can't think of anything that either of the two main parties have done which has really endeared me to them.

By contrast, Reform aren't afraid to call a spade a spade.

I don't believe everything they say - Without a doubt, there's a lot of standard corporate marketing spiel which will never come to fruition - same with all of them.

Only time will tell.

If they do get in - They'll only have that one chance to prove themselves.

If they turn out to be all mouth and no trousers - that'll be the end of them.

But that could also be the carrot that spurs them into taking action and proving the doubters wrong.

The cat is well & truly among the pigeons, so I think it's going to be an interesting few years to come...

Again, other than immigration ( which i doubt will be solved but just 4 now assume is desktop with) in what way have they been clear on policies and solutions?

sleepwouldbenice · 02/09/2025 01:53

blueclip · 01/09/2025 22:13

Indeed this. It really is that simple. I don’t want to vote in con or lab next time. They are utterly appalling.

But you can't answer why reform ? Rather than why not labour/ conservative
As the OP says, what are their other policies, what will they actually do?

TooBigForMyBoots · 02/09/2025 01:34

Reallyneedsaholiday · 02/09/2025 00:58

I'm still not getting the feeling that anyone really knows what they actually like about the party. What do you think they would achieve? How would they improve your own life? Or the lives of your children?

They like "owning the libs". That's it. 🤷‍♀️

Its been a successful strategy in the past. Just look at Brexit. The poorest in the UK voted to make their lot worse.

Jess13224 · 02/09/2025 01:31

I don't support Reform or Nigel however I believe 1 benifit in voting Reform is to scrap the 2 party system this country currently has which could lead to better parties and policies in the future.

OonaStubbs · 02/09/2025 01:30

My dad likes Farage because "he seems like a proper bloke, he's always got a pint and a fag".

A lot of regular politicians do not come across well when they interact with normal people.

AnneOnAMoose · 02/09/2025 01:21

Reallyneedsaholiday · 02/09/2025 00:58

I'm still not getting the feeling that anyone really knows what they actually like about the party. What do you think they would achieve? How would they improve your own life? Or the lives of your children?

I like the fact that they don't mince their words when it comes to many of the issues. Whether that will translate to them rolling up their sleeves and actually fixing the problems if they get in - None of us knows.

But with ConLab, you can be sure that they will waste months and millions of pounds just kicking the can down the road.... cabinet reshuffle... Some new laws (that were already covered by existing laws, but because they can't even enforce those - they create new ones to make it look like they're doing something)... another cabinet re-shuffle... Endless days out playing fancy dress with a shiny high-viz and hard hat... another cabinet re-shuffle....Maybe setup a committee for something-or-other... Ohh - Not forgetting opening new Pork markets!

In the last 30-40 years, I can't think of anything that either of the two main parties have done which has really endeared me to them.

By contrast, Reform aren't afraid to call a spade a spade.

I don't believe everything they say - Without a doubt, there's a lot of standard corporate marketing spiel which will never come to fruition - same with all of them.

Only time will tell.

If they do get in - They'll only have that one chance to prove themselves.

If they turn out to be all mouth and no trousers - that'll be the end of them.

But that could also be the carrot that spurs them into taking action and proving the doubters wrong.

The cat is well & truly among the pigeons, so I think it's going to be an interesting few years to come...

AcquadiP · 02/09/2025 01:10

Nigel Farage presents himself as the working man's friend and offers simple solutions to complex problems. He's also an eloquent speaker who promises the land of milk and honey. So if all the boats stop for example, all that is wrong with this country will magically disappear and all will be well once again. He did it with the Brexit campaign and he's doing it again now. Unfortunately, both the Conservatives and Labour promised X, Y and Z and haven't delivered so Reform, as the only viable alternative, are gaining traction.

Lunalara · 02/09/2025 01:02

@Reallyneedsaholiday The message is all focused on illegal immigration. But I am pretty sure that he cannot actually do anything to stop them from arriving. Also, it ignores the other things he would do to widen the gap between the poor and wealthy.

AnneOnAMoose · 02/09/2025 00:59

StiffAsAVicar · 02/09/2025 00:44

They are a party for the low IQ’s, sadly of which there are many.

Insulting a fellow member of the electorate just for having different political views to your own shows a pretty low IQ. I'm sure Nige will be grateful for your vote.

Reallyneedsaholiday · 02/09/2025 00:58

I'm still not getting the feeling that anyone really knows what they actually like about the party. What do you think they would achieve? How would they improve your own life? Or the lives of your children?

OP posts:
Lunalara · 02/09/2025 00:57

As for what the answer is I do not know. Labour as they stand are not the answer. I hope that they pull their act together in the last half of their term. However, what I do know is that Farage manipulated us about Brexit, and that he cannot be trusted. I deeply worry about it a privatised NHS that follows the US model if he gets in. That would set us back much further than where we are now.

Lunalara · 02/09/2025 00:47

StiffAsAVicar · 02/09/2025 00:44

They are a party for the low IQ’s, sadly of which there are many.

While I understand how you feel, I feel like we do need to engage with the opposite side in a more charitable way in general. Politicians like Farage argue that the left hates them, and that the left is making their concerns sound like nothing.

CharlotteRumpling · 02/09/2025 00:45

JazzyJelly · 01/09/2025 23:09

The politician's syllogism, also known as the politician's logic or the politician's fallacy, is a logical fallacy of the form:

We must do something.
This is something.
Therefore, we must do this.

In this context:

'I want something different.
This is something different.
Therefore, I will vote for this'.

I have my doubts as to whether Reform would be any different, but they say they would be, and that's enough for some people.

I couldn't express it better.

StiffAsAVicar · 02/09/2025 00:44

They are a party for the low IQ’s, sadly of which there are many.

Lunalara · 02/09/2025 00:43

MissedItByThisMuch · 02/09/2025 00:37

The appeal is the same as the appeal of any fringe party. Broadly the same as Donald Trump.

People are fed up with the mainstream parties and feel their viewpoint is not being represented. They feel ignored and disregarded and shamed for their concerns. They are worried for their future and don’t see anyone addressing those worries. Someone comes along and says “I’m different to them, I care, I represent you” and they feel heard and they don’t look too closely at the detail.

The rise of these “extreme” political movements is due to a failure of the mainstream to acknowledge and address people’s concerns as valid. That leaves the field wide open for extremists of various stripes.

I pretty much agree with the sentiment here. The only thing I would add is that in America there is a religious element to voting for Trump. A lot of Christians felt as though Trump represented them personally, so voted for him. What got him the win in the borderline states was probably what you said here though.

Here it is 100% the case of being disillusioned with the mainstream parties. Unless anything major changes, Reform will be the protest vote in the next election. I hope people don’t fall for Farage and his lies though. He isn’t the answer that everyone is seeking.

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