Flags..

But with respect, you are not listening to them, you are drawing your own lines about who is worthy of being listened to. The group of individuals you are not willing to engage with are the ones who are frustrated about not being listened to. Then someone like Tommy Robinson comes along and listens to them, makes them feel heard. The issue will never be solved if you are only willing to listen to a select group

Interesting that starmer has finally had his say on the flags today. He approves and believes them to be an expression of patriotism.

. Can we all agree that people shouting hate speech and using violence are absolutely wrong and move the conversation along then in that case?. What are some of your concerns about immigration?

I am willing to listen and to engage because I do think there are genuine concerns around immigration and how immigration has been managed I do not label everyone who has concerns as racist

but these people putting up flags shouting you are not welcome here etc are not wanting to engage they feel they have a right to now loudly spout their racism and it’s hidden behind being patriotic

same as the NF thugs in the 70’s that my family had to deal with

This is my take too.

I’ll have a sensible discussion about immigration, of all types and not just asylum seekers, all day long with whoever.

But if you’re spending your Saturdays shouting at hotels, or your answers are “I just don’t want to live near brown people” or “sometimes they stand on my local high street” or “well Islam doesn’t respect women so we’re all gonna die” … I probably don’t want to hear it.

If your opinion is a list of sound bites about how immigrants get phones from the government, when they don’t, or get loads of money, that they don’t… I don’t want to hear it.

Happy to discuss actual facts and actual situations, but nonsense lies and people who advocate pushing Filipinos over in parks need not apply.

I am willing to listen and to engage because I do think there are genuine concerns around immigration and how immigration has been managed I do not label everyone who has concerns as racist

but these people putting up flags shouting you are not welcome here etc are not wanting to engage they feel they have a right to now loudly spout their racism and it’s hidden behind being patriotic

same as the NF thugs in the 70’s that my family had to deal with

I am willing to listen and to engage because I do think there are genuine concerns around immigration and how immigration has been managed I do not label everyone who has concerns as racist

but these people putting up flags shouting you are not welcome here etc are not wanting to engage they feel they have a right to now loudly spout their racism and it’s hidden behind being patriotic

same as the NF thugs in the 70’s that my family had to deal with

And this is based on what precisely? Maybe if you actually stopped writing people off and started listening you might learn something, people would feel listened to and they would be less likely to seek out extreme views.

Your kind of rhetoric is an integral part of the problem.

So, you view all working class people as violent, abusive, vandals and aggressive? Great. Noted.

They’re objecting about the very existence of other races, ethnicities, nationalities, non-binary genders, homosexuals, and supranational organisations as far as I can tell.

They’re objecting about the very existence of other races, ethnicities, nationalities, non-binary genders, homosexuals, and supranational organisations as far as I can tell.

See, there you go. You're a prime example of the problem. Rather than think ' let's take a look at what people in these communities are objecting about and critically analyse it to see what could be done,', you've gone straight on the blame train. I'm not talking about the far right antics, no ones excusing violence or hate speech, but rather the silent, peaceful majority who live in these areas who have justifiable concerns but are not allowed a say without a label attached to them.

Well no because that’s imaginary. Working class people are allowed a say they’re not allowed to paint abuse on Chinese takeaways, shout at immigrants and demolish our local areas.

They can say all they like. Loudly if they want. But violence and or aggression isn’t going to be listened to.

See, there you go. You're a prime example of the problem. Rather than think ' let's take a look at what people in these communities are objecting about and critically analyse it to see what could be done,', you've gone straight on the blame train. I'm not talking about the far right antics, no ones excusing violence or hate speech, but rather the silent, peaceful majority who live in these areas who have justifiable concerns but are not allowed a say without a label attached to them.

Maybe the left are doing the same - pushing back against right wing people living in their own bubbles, who label them “woke” (in the new derogatory sense), “snowflakes”, “blue haired”, “hysterical”, “don’t know what a woman is”, “alphabet people”, “terrorist apologists”, “virtue signalling”, “antisemitic”, “tree huggers”, “naive”, “anti-white”, “unpatriotic”, “anti-British” and “traitorous” - among others.

Is name calling really the reason the far-right are illegally co-opting public infrastructure for their flag displays, vandalising roads, homes & businesses, yelling at hotels and planning to vote for ultra-capitalist oligarch billionaires who plan to exploit them and make their lives even worse ?

I absolutely agree with this. I loathe reform, they'll be catastrophic in power, but the left are driving this and pushing people that way. The dehumanizing language to describe working class folk is abhorrent and absolutely rife on here. How can calling people gammon, thickos, scum, knuckle draggers possibly help? It's vile. equally, the complete dismissal of voices living within multicultural poor majority ethnic cities are drowned out with cries of racist should they ever dare to say these fragmented communities are not inclusive or integrated. The absolute hypocrisy of the m/c elite living in bubbles who are whipping up this hatred through their name calling and privileged observations, they're the problem! I would dearly love for them to spend a year living in alum rock or small heath or bordesley green and then come back with an opinion on whether immigration on this scale is really benefiting anyone.

I’m sorry, but you’re incorrect. When people are obsessing about Britains involvement in the slave trade, they miss out the global context. Britains leading role in ending it, Britains colonialism is looked at anachronistically and one sided. There is zero balance. The Lefts view of history is often very far from “correct”. The fact you think there is a “correct view” says everything.

The Left deny people their views and often people are left feeling unheard of, telling people they’re “thick” underlines this. So is it any surprise people are drawn to people who listen and understand.

The Left have driven the increase in popularity of the far right. We need to move back towards the centre. The Left are as abhorrent as the right

Facing up to slavery and colonialism isn’t “hating Britain,” it’s telling the full story. Abolition doesn’t erase the exploitation that came before.

And the far right didn’t grow because the left was dismissive, it grew because extremists exploit fear and inequality. Blaming the left just excuses the far right’s violence.

I expect we'll be told these men putting up flags are doing it because their masculinity has been vilified.

Nobody is arguing that historical slavery gives people the right to arrive here without the requisite permissions though.

I expect we'll be told these men putting up flags are doing it because their masculinity has been vilified.

But just because Britain like many other countries, has been involved in slavery hundreds of years ago btw, doesn’t mean you can just allow untold amounts of young men to come here illegally does it ? What nonsense is this ? !