People who give up on life

I’ve seen it happen to women - but I come from an Irish Catholic background and there was always one daughter left as a “spinster” to take care of mammy and daddy and be a general dogsbody so I don’t think it’s solely a male thing.

This is why I find it so hair-tearingly frustrating when people tip up on here and post how they "don't need friends" and are "happy with my little family".

There is a recent tendency at the moment to celebrate limiting one's world just to the nuclear family and avoiding social contact beyond your spouse and children (because friends create "drama", don't you know). It goes hand in hand with the celebration of "introversion" (which actually isn't really introversion at all, its social anxiety) and this fearful and suspicious approach to everyday social interactions with people outside the family. There's always been an element of this in society at the margins but historically with people living in more communal situations everyone, to some extent, had to develop some social muscle. Over the last 50 years people have lived a more atomised life and then COVID turbo charged this so it's now seen as normal and almost encouraged for people to eschew non-essential social contact.

Relying on just one other adult for all your emotional and social needs is a really unhealthy and dangerous way to live. There's tons of evidence that social isolation damages health and even shortens life and you're so vulnerable if you rely on just one other person. Some people do find socialising difficult and that deserves compassion but its an essential life skill to be able to build networks outside your family.

I really worry about the fact that this retreat into people's own little units has become so normalised. If we want to support people like this in later life we really need to recognise how unhealthy this is.

Oh dear, that does sound a potential disaster in the making - I have a friend, likewise lived with DP until they both recently died.

He works (teacher) intelligent chap, nice guy, now suddenly worth just over a million - has just announced that after 50 years on the shelf, he's getting married - to someone he's never met off the web - how can this possibly go wrong I ask myself.

Its not enough just to say “this is what this person is like, they are a loner/dysfunctional/introvert”. Why isn’t society enabling people to participate? How can we change it?

So basically all the people who are just introverted, perfectly happy leading their atypical lives, or have no interest in participating in other people's ideas of what they should be doing, can't just be left to do their own thing, and this is something that needs changed whether they want it to change or otherwise?

Sure, there are people who are "trapped" or have been denied opportunities through no fault of their own, and yes, society needs to think about how to help these people give themselves a leg up, but society also needs to respect the fact that some people choose to live what is perceived to be an "atypical" life and leave them in peace to get on with it.

This is why I totally understand why some people bristle at terms like "failure to launch", because it reinforces this idea that there is only one acceptable way to "do" life, and school - university - career - mortgage - marriage - children is the only permitted and acceptable path, otherwise you are somehow living your life to the detriment of wider society. It's outdated nonsense, and frankly it's highly offensive.

Which people? why is it their business?

As time goes on, as costs go up, more and more of the younger generations will stay living at home.

Yes he has and is. It’s making several of us extremely uneasy around him. Primarily this has been caused by his lack of awareness over how he can behave and come across in interacting with others. There are no ND or other reasons for it. It purely stems from him not having had a life outside of his parents for 40 years. Neither of his parents are to blame for this, they actively push for him to join other groups outside of work and without them going with him. They’ve always encouraged him to keep up with old school friends, encouraged relationships etc. He simply refuses. The recent loss of a parent has really highlighted just how unprepared he is for the reality of life, from interacting with individuals socially, communicating with business (and g setting up gas and electric bills), running a house, budgeting, maintenance, general life stuff like dentists etc. All essential life skills you would have expected someone at nearly 50 to have mastered. We’ve tried to help when asked, and then we have to watch as he decides he either isn’t going to do xx or he does something he’s been advised not to do, and it goes wrong. There’s only so much stepping in a literally doing it for him we are prepared to do!
it’s quite sad, as he is genuinely a nice person, who is going to be left with no one and no skills to be able to rebuild his life. But as he won’t meet modern society even half way…..

He sounds like me, same scenario, slowly bought out my parents equity years ago - thing is, why do you think he needs help, you say he's used up the goodwill, but is he looking for goodwill and help?

Similar to you here @CoolherShakeher

Yes, but do you get my point as well? She could have done everything the 'right' way, but still ended up lonely in retirement.

Put your notion of "launch" into context, then it can be discussed.

I'm not sure how you compel people to comply with your idea of what a successful life looks like anyway. Parents can do all they like, or as little as they like, it's not a guarantee of anything and if their children refuse to play ball, or choose to go in a different direction, then that's their choice and not a reflection on the parents.

What are people going to do about the ones who don't want to launch, despite their parents best efforts

What are people going to do about the ones who don't want to launch, despite their parents best efforts

Its not enough just to say “this is what this person is like, they are a loner/dysfunctional/introvert”. Why isn’t society enabling people to participate? How can we change it?

So basically all the people who are just introverted, perfectly happy leading their atypical lives, or have no interest in participating in other people's ideas of what they should be doing, can't just be left to do their own thing, and this is something that needs changed whether they want it to change or otherwise?

Sure, there are people who are "trapped" or have been denied opportunities through no fault of their own, and yes, society needs to think about how to help these people give themselves a leg up, but society also needs to respect the fact that some people choose to live what is perceived to be an "atypical" life and leave them in peace to get on with it.

This is why I totally understand why some people bristle at terms like "failure to launch", because it reinforces this idea that there is only one acceptable way to "do" life, and school - university - career - mortgage - marriage - children is the only permitted and acceptable path, otherwise you are somehow living your life to the detriment of wider society. It's outdated nonsense, and frankly it's highly offensive.

Yes, plenty of single women who are active and social - I’m not saying there aren’t!

I can only speak about her situation and wonder what might have helped her - or help her now - as she’s full of regrets and anger and tells me often that it was a life wasted. So it’s worth thinking about.

Very sad. On the other hand, there are plenty of single women who are active and social and still don't find a husband and have friendships that don't last. There's no guarantee that anyone will be in a good place in their old age.

The trouble is though, there is so little support available, it's entirely left up to parents to deal with autism, mental health problems etc unless they're really severe. And parents on their own can't tap into the systems and resources that the professionals can. So they muddle along, spending money on whatever private support they can find, with no guidance as to whether that's the best thing for their child. The system is so stretched the professionals can't provide the needed support, but they also won't even tell you what type of private provision would be useful if you have the money for it.

No! You are assuming that everything is fine and we are judgemental. We are talking about problematic situations- people becoming homeless, people lying injured with no one noticing because they never leave the house anyway.

Of course where people are happy and self sufficient it isn’t a problem.

Agree - It’s not giving up but in some cases being a victim to your upbringing and not knowing how to break out and live independently. There’s also this big push to conform to societal norms and if you’re not out there working, socialising, living independently then you’re a problem and need intervention.

This thread has a very judgemental tone about it.