To think feminism has started excusing bad behaviour in women the way patriarchy used to excuse men?

I think that does occasionally happen, but not particularly associated with feminism. More with a sort of hyper-individualistic philosophy, probably coming from a certain American therapy-speak. 'No one owes anyone anything in this life!' (sometimes used to imply that we don't even owe others basic consideration) and '(Any help that I give you) is a gift and not a right!' I think the biggest difference between this and ordinary boundary-setting is that the latter is usually clear and consistent- 'I am happy to do X but not Y' - while the former is often used to justify capriciousness and letting people down at the last minute: 'Yes, I know I agreed to do it at that time, but now I don't want to any more, and it should be my choice!' But I don't think it's commoner in women than men, or that it's a new phenomenon: the most extreme examples that I remember were in the 90s.

Do I think feminism has started excusing bad behaviour in women the way patriarchy used to excuse men?

Oh, yes, absolutely 💥

Feminism is the cause of everything aggressive, assertive, authoritative, confident, criminal, disobedient, ignorant, ill-mannered, independent, individual, strong, successful, raucous, rude, powerful, unattractive, unladylike or unsubtle done by any woman.

Patriarchy used to be the cause of men's bad behaviour until it was called out (by feminists). After that, it stopped making men behave badly. Some men have continued to misbehave, however, and it is now unclear what causes this. It will probably turn out to be feminism.

Glad you've brought this to our attention, OP!

💯

What are you talking about? You really need to provide examples op.

I think that’s just your confirmation bias.

Plenty of fitness account on social media of men showing off their “gains” (cue multiple topless shots of them flexing various muscles.)

I think it is limited to women (mainly young women) with regards to openly flaunting this narcissistic self-obsession with their looks. Eg. Shamelessly setting up ‘photoshoots’ where they get their boyfriend to snap a million photos of them in different poses, which is of course, driven by social media. It’s rare you see men doing this. And maybe young men are obsessed with their looks too, but it’s not socially acceptable for them to be open about this. So why is it not shameful for women to be this self-obsessed? This isn’t about feminism, I’m a feminist. I care deeply about equality, ending DV & sexual assault by men against women etc, but this is a misinterpretation of feminism imo. Also, I don’t think anyone can deny the fact that 99% of people you see doing these self-obsessed photoshoots are women. It might be social media that’s driving this but the reason young women are no longer embarrassed to spend half an hour posing with a selfie stick in public, is because they’ve been sold a false idea of feminism imo

Quite. Reading some posts on here is depressing.

No, I think that's utter bullshit. Patriarchy still gives men a pass for pretty much everything. Which is not to say that all women are all sweetness and light all the time, but it's an illustration of how the smallest pushback against an oppressor class is seen as making the oppressed "worse than the worst of them".

That’s cultural nothing go do with feminism. In some cultures being humble is not seen as a virtue particularly. In yours, it is.

Neither is right or wrong.

That's very subjective and depends on perspective. Can you give an example of selfishness?

YABVU.

In a world where misogyny is at a high, young men and old are watching porn that makes them thinking choking girls and anal sex is the norm, inbreds like AT have millions of followers, VAWG is a scandal, people are calling girls who’ve been groomed and raped by male gangs, prostitutes, we need to support women.

We recently had to go through a SC case to confirm in law that yes, yes only biological women Are women, and only biological men are men.

Women need to support women and good men to need to support women.

When VAGW is reduced, and maybe when 2 women a week aren’t killed by males, we can look at the details of ‘feminism’.

I still have no idea what you mean as there are no examples and unclear what any of that has to do with feminism?

It would help if you could give a specific example of something you think is genuinely “rude” which the person described as “setting a boundary”.

It’s hard to know what you mean when you are so vague.

It sounds like you are a man who has experienced this from women?
I think when women assert their boundaries and put themselves first they are often seen as rude and selfish whereas men doing exactly the same get away with it because of the way society has been structured up until now.

Who defines rudeness as “setting boundaries” and where does feminism push this?

Ok now link that to "feminism"

By using a:
" Jane beleives she is a feminist
because of ABC and
as a result if that she carried out XYZ bad act
and
then said "trust me its feminism not a bad act"°""

kind of example?

Except it hasn’t, has it.

Probably sometimes, but not in general There are people who use 'But at least they know what a woman is!' to excuse support for hard-right-wingers but I wouldn't really call that feminism.

Also there is no “used to”. Society still excuses poor male behaviour and blames women for it.

And setting a boundary is not poor behaviour.

Please give examples

I can't say I have particularly noticed this, but I work in a male-dominated role, so just don't come across so many women, and the ones I do meet are mostly fine.

Someone (and I can't remember who just now,) said something along the lines of, we know when we will gave achieved true equality, when mediocre women can get into positions of power as easily as mediocre men do .

But there have always been people who are rude and selfish- nothing new there. However, we are socially conditioned to find poor behaviour more unacceptable in women than in men, so I'd question myself whether I am judging women more harshly for behaving in ways I'd let go lf it were a man.

YABU.

Individual women may excuse bad behaviour in women but feminism does no such thing.

"Boys being boys" excused violence, hooliganism, vandalism, sexual crimes and even pedophilia. I'm nearly 60, I lived through those times.
Does any examples of female boundaries or truth compare to what men used to be excused for?

There are many feminisms. Some excuse and promote horrendous behavior and some don’t. Here on MN the specific form that feminism (sometimes seems to) take is very hyper, aggressive, and often flashes to the surface with railing against #bekind as though the dicta to be compassionate and think about others were not millenia old.

Its not feminism that talks of boundaries however: its pseudo psychology that does and both men and women talk about doing so. Perhaps you have only noticed it when women fo so because historically female boundaries havd been set by others (society, husband, the church, sentimental notions) and the very idea of a woman choosing and enforcing her own boundaries was seen as novel and transgressive.

Knowing snd setting clear boundaries, deciding on one’s own commitments, is not inherently abusive or rude.

In that case you are unreasonable to blame feminism for it. Call it by the cheekyfuckery that it is. If it's unreasonable behavior then it's just as unreasonable for a man to do it as for a woman to do it, and feminism has nothing to do with it.