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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder how the UK will look in 3 years time?

905 replies

Labradorlover987 · 11/08/2025 13:19

I was inspired to write this after reading the UC post that was just reported - the govt’s welfare bill has passed but was watered down so unlikely to make any real savings.

I earn 40k, have a school age child and just feel like I am living hand to mouth 😩 I 100% think there should be a welfare systems that supports people on low incomes but I wonder how the current system will be sustained in the long run?

Just wondered what other people thought.

I actually wouldn’t mind paying more in taxes if we could be guaranteed more in services etc - for example my council tax just went up and the services seem even worse this year than usual.

OP posts:
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Araminta1003 · 12/08/2025 19:01

If you want a wealth tax, don’t come up with a ridiculously high rate that nobody will pay like 2%.
If you have a 100 and put it in the bank at 4% as an additional rate tax payer. You will already be paying 45% on the 4 you get back. If you tax another 2% of that, there is literally 0.2 left. Nobody will stay back for 0.2 return on a 100.

Try 0.5% max wealth tax.
The Norwegians did 1.1% and a lot of rich people left. Even the Swiss absolute max in a canton is less than 1% and there are a lot of deductions and that canton loses a lot of people to other cantons. Hence Federer left canton Basel quite recently to go to Wollerau - and he is meant to be a goodie goodie two shoes.

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 18:59

OneCoralCat · 11/08/2025 22:47

I have a similar income to you, I also wouldn’t mind paying more tax. Even 10% more, people would grumble of course but really I wouldn’t notice it in the end. And I’d trade that for better public services all day long!

People on a higher salary would absolutely notice it, it would be a much bigger chunk and I would 100% not pay 10% higher taxes.

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 18:56

Alexandra2001 · 12/08/2025 10:04

Its 10,000 out of 2.8million..... hardly 75%......

But what did having all these millionaires do for us? and many will still be paying tax in the UK, on property and businesses still here.....

Why would they be paying tax in the UK? You only pay tax in the UK if you are a UK tax resident and if they leave the UK due to taxes it would be primarily to make sure they are no longer a UK tax resident. Sure, if they have property here they will pay council tax and a few other small things, but income tax? Nope. CGT? Nope. Corporation tax? Nope.

tissuesand · 12/08/2025 18:52

Maia77 · 12/08/2025 18:38

Wealth tax is not about taxing high-earning working people. It's about taxing the super wealthy - people whose wealth exceeds 10 million. It's about taxing wealth, not work to prevent the transfer of wealth from ordinary people (low and high earners) to the super rich. The working people are being completely squeezed out.

But those people put all their wealth off shore. HMRC needs to stop persecuting people who make small mistakes in their tax returns while ignoring certain people with knighthoods and TV personalities who stash all their millions in the Cayman Islands, for example. One of the biggest fraudsters I ever met put all his money into offshore property, using forged passports. He had a very respectable job in the insurance industry. His fraud was exposed in the family court during his divorce, but no further action was taken regarding his financial dealings.

NettleTea · 12/08/2025 18:48

floormats · 12/08/2025 10:45

There's a solution to all of this. Tax wealth not work.

Older generations won't go for it though so we are stuck in this downward spiral

The older generation wont be taxed. Their 'wealth' is so far down the radar that it doesnt even figure.

I think alot of people dont get how far far FAR above everyday people, even high six figure earners, the real wealth horders are.

My parents, both pretty staunchly Tory in their day, nice final salary pensions and a decent home, approve of this.

The banks are not in charge. The super rich LEND to the banks now. All our amenities are in the hands of private companies who have been allowed to run rife on prices, absolutely scraping every last penny for shareholders and refusing to do the minimum of standards of care.

There was an interesting program on R4 a while back, talked about how we are here, how has the edconomics of business ended up here, and it came from the US, the push to change the responsibility of companies to be responsible and accountable to the stakeholders (ie anyone who had an interest in a company - so for a water company, for example, there was a responsibility for the environment, for the local community, for the customers, and the workers) to the main drive and importance being to the shareholders.

The consequences should have been clear, but Im guessing freeing up the economy and growth seemed politically more important to government at the time when this shift happened. (Im looking at you, Thatcher)

And once that did happen, well corporation and unregulated capitalism just did what it did, and did it well. It was always designed to make the most money as possible, even if it drained it away from everyone else, destroyed community, destroyed governments, destroyed the services, in its process.

As a result a huge proportion of the money and the assets are being hoarded, they are not in circulation, so they cant be used for doing the stuff that government needs to do to support the services that the population needs. So things are cut to the bones and since Austerity, the governments have been rearranging the deckchairs on a sinking ship which is rapidly running out of fuel.

The far right, like Farage, (and the super wealthy) see this as a great opportunity to mop up everything else. Farage is a twat. He is brownnosing the billionaires who he has courted to fund his party, and is spouting the popular line to do it.

He is keen on riling people up - and when people are scared, and people are scared, because they can see the impact of living on the crumbs, and they are scared of what little resources they have being taken by someone else, and he is getting everyone pointing and blaming each other. Thats easier to manage, it makes them angry and angry mobs dont think too hard, but they can cause chaos and distruction. They are certainly causing destruction to the current government, forcing them to address all sorts of stuff that shouldnt be happening, if the REAL people to blame were identified and forced to pay their share.

So yes. Tax wealth not work. Wealth like huge parts of London which are owned by the super rich. They cant take those assets with them, they are bricks and mortar. They are not talking about my parents house, or someone with a couple of buy to lets to pad out their pension. But thats what Farage wants you to think 'tax wealth' means. He wants people who have anything to align themselves with 'being rich' so that their fear of super tax on wealth (and tbh I dont think anyone has suggested super tax, Ive only ever seen low single digits) is going to hit them, and object to it.

Its going to be the ONLY way to get money back into the system, to equalise things a bit. To ease up the pressure on working people, and I dont know why the fuck this supposed labour governemt wont do it and are buying in to the pointy finger 'its that vulnerable persons fault' farage game.

Maia77 · 12/08/2025 18:38

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 17:35

It's responses like this that make me so glad we are leaving the UK. Let me guess, you are a low rate tax payer with no assets? You must be, otherwise why would you advocate for more taxes on what are already high taxes?

Wealth tax is not about taxing high-earning working people. It's about taxing the super wealthy - people whose wealth exceeds 10 million. It's about taxing wealth, not work to prevent the transfer of wealth from ordinary people (low and high earners) to the super rich. The working people are being completely squeezed out.

mydoglovescucumber · 12/08/2025 18:22

labtest57 · 12/08/2025 07:42

Where I live care home staff and community carers ( I was one) are 99% white. Im so sick of this lazy white British trope! The nature of care work with unsociable hours, zero hour contracts, the need for car ownership in the case of community carers, makes it almost impossible for women with young families. African immigrants who come here on carers visas usually are single or have families back at home. There is nothing about them that makes them more intrinsically suited to the job than anyone eelse. The care sector needs a complete overhaul. I know plenty of women with children who had to give up as there was no work life balance.

Yes I did it as a young mum without a car and it was bloody hard. Now the companies have got greedy and have cut all the times allocated down to each service user. It's shocking and poor practice. So care staff are expected to have their own car, serviced and ready to go to each job on what is normally minimum wage or not much off it. Very difficult for someone with young children from a working class background to do that job. I could not afford driving lessons when I was a single parent and I am sure many single parents can't these days.

DrizzleMemory · 12/08/2025 18:16

The UK may be one of the few tolerable places to live temperature and climate-wise compared to many countries over the next decade or longer. It’s getting hotter here of course. But I would not want to live in southern Europe now, never mind anywhere else further. In three years time I would thus rather be here I think.

YellowZebraStripes · 12/08/2025 18:15

I want the future generations to have opportunties.

Assets over £15 million? Tax them. Is that really a controversial thing to do?

We need more economically productive people who work and pay basic rate tax, but to get there we need investment in the economy.

Assets of the ultra rich I.e. above £15 million can contribute more to that.

If they then decide to leave after we have taxed their assets- let them. Let them leave. We need economically productive people, with long bright working futures ahead of them, from backgrounds who are hungry for change, to become the country's next multi millionaires 😊, which will be achieved through investment.

If we are to accept the shit status quo - we need hope of change for the next generation. Or we all just try and leave.

MyNameIsX · 12/08/2025 18:13

Maia77 · 12/08/2025 18:07

They can't take all of their assets with them. This is about preventing the flow of wealth from the working people (low and high earners) and the government to the richest. The situation we're in today is a consequence of wealth inequality. Ordinary people find it harder to afford a home, access decent healthcare, or get a good education without taking on heavy debt because the wealth is concentrated at the top. The super rich outcompete ordinary people for housing, education, and other resources and that's because they can afford to pay more, move faster, or access things others can’t.

Economics for dummies.

MyNameIsX · 12/08/2025 18:12

Let’s at least try to be honest with ourselves.

The next major milestone is the budget - Labour will soon start the process of drip feeding potential fiscal policy to the media etc. in order to gauge reaction. They will again talk about black holes, broad shoulders, the Tory legacy etc. They will redefine ‘working people’. All of this, and more.

But they are coming again - any sane person knows this. Maybe Reeves will not survive this time, because Starmer will not hesitate to run her over if he needs to, as we have seen.

So, we don’t need to wait three years, simply because I believe this budget will prove seminal for the rest of this torrid Labour government.

Maia77 · 12/08/2025 18:07

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 17:30

Will that "wealth" tax be worth the risk of losing the other much higher taxes that he does pay? Don't you understand that taxing people more will just prompt them to leave? What about the people who just take from the system and never pay in to it?

They can't take all of their assets with them. This is about preventing the flow of wealth from the working people (low and high earners) and the government to the richest. The situation we're in today is a consequence of wealth inequality. Ordinary people find it harder to afford a home, access decent healthcare, or get a good education without taking on heavy debt because the wealth is concentrated at the top. The super rich outcompete ordinary people for housing, education, and other resources and that's because they can afford to pay more, move faster, or access things others can’t.

Bambamhoohoo · 12/08/2025 18:06

DrizzleMemory · 12/08/2025 18:00

How does it work with healthcare when you emigrate? Do you have to pay anything extra or do you pay tax in Spain so you get free healthcare? I’m just interested in how it works. And if you came back to the UK, would you be eligible for NHS care?

Nah that go over and take it for free after never paying any tax in Spain. Like reverse boat people. The Spanish must hate them, it’s not a wealthy country.

you should lose nhs entitlement here but it’s not straightforward there are ways to keep
it.

edited to say: I think you pay a minimal contribution in Spain for healthcare

Bambamhoohoo · 12/08/2025 18:04

DrizzleMemory · 12/08/2025 17:27

My friend owns a café in central London. She said that Labour has ruined her business. They can’t afford the staff now so life is harder for existing staff and she may have to close. She’s a lifelong Green voter and says she will be voting for reform next. That was a surprise to me, but I’m sure she has her reasons as a business owner.

Did she explain what labour have done to her cafe? The NI increase has been very difficult for many but depending on how many staff she has it’s hard to imagine how it has finished a successful cafe off? On minimum wage it is unlikely to cost say an extra £1k a year. It must’ve had other problems?

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 18:03

BIossomtoes · 12/08/2025 10:51

Why wouldn’t they? The suggestion of a wealth tax would affect multi millionaires, not a couple living in a million pound house.

I'm not of an older generation but I would not support a wealth tax. A wealth tax would affect anybody with assets. I already pay such high taxes, why would I support them taking even more? What is the benefit of working hard and doing well if everything is taxed so much? The uber wealthy will always be able to hide what they have and laws like this will just affect the upper middle class. Pass.

MyNameIsX · 12/08/2025 18:03

BIossomtoes · 12/08/2025 17:54

I said where I am on the spectrum. I’m really tired of the assumption that you must be on the bones of your arse if you can see how unfair the current taxation model is.

For once, we agree (that the current ‘taxation model’ is unfair).

DrizzleMemory · 12/08/2025 18:00

MyMauveWasp · 12/08/2025 11:54

Absolutely fine ☺️.. I’m a full time resident immigrant (I don’t like being called an ‘expat’ because an immigrant is what I am) Integration is key.

Edited

How does it work with healthcare when you emigrate? Do you have to pay anything extra or do you pay tax in Spain so you get free healthcare? I’m just interested in how it works. And if you came back to the UK, would you be eligible for NHS care?

EasternStandard · 12/08/2025 17:55

DrizzleMemory · 12/08/2025 17:27

My friend owns a café in central London. She said that Labour has ruined her business. They can’t afford the staff now so life is harder for existing staff and she may have to close. She’s a lifelong Green voter and says she will be voting for reform next. That was a surprise to me, but I’m sure she has her reasons as a business owner.

It’s so bad Labour have hit SMEs like this.

BIossomtoes · 12/08/2025 17:54

MyNameIsX · 12/08/2025 17:49

Wrong! I am guessing that you speak from the opposite end of the spectrum to those potentially impacted.

You ignore human behaviour. Labour have proven themselves to have a flexible relationship with the truth. GBP 10mn today, 2mn tomorrow. A ‘one off’? Pull the other one.

I said where I am on the spectrum. I’m really tired of the assumption that you must be on the bones of your arse if you can see how unfair the current taxation model is.

Bumblebee72 · 12/08/2025 17:54

I think in three years time it will we will have a zombie government with Reform ready to for a landslide. Labour have borrowed against future growth to benefits and that growth is not going to come. They have just wasted their opportunity to fix the system. Reform will come in with sweeping cuts.

YelloDaisy · 12/08/2025 17:53

It’s fucked now so in 3years it will be more fucked

Bambamhoohoo · 12/08/2025 17:53

Tbf, I don’t think wealth tax can be a one off. The fabled Norwegian tax only accounts for 1% of their annual tax revenue, it barely does anything. commentators seem to think it doesn’t make any real difference for distribution of wealth but does provide a bit of welfare, and is seen as an important policy for the type of society they want to be.

that said I agree additional rate taxpayers pretending it’ll impact time are tiresome. I still want my lord stripped though 😂

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 17:51

MyMauveWasp · 12/08/2025 11:32

I moved from the UK to Spain 6 years ago. Life is so much better here. Not just the weather, but the lack of entitled attitude of people, road congestion, fresh produce from markets, social life, house prices, etc etc. I’ve seen all the Changes in the UK over the last year and I certainly don’t aspire to live back there right now!

Is it similar in portugal?

MyNameIsX · 12/08/2025 17:49

BIossomtoes · 12/08/2025 17:46

Unless you have assets in the region of £10 million you wouldn’t be affected by the kind of wealth tax advocated. Of course if you fit into that category you wouldn’t really miss a one off 2% tax on your the portion of your assets above the baseline.

There’s no such thing as low rate tax, incidentally. There’s basic rate which you pay on the portion of your income above £12570 up to £50k, then higher rate which you pay on the next £100k.

You’re wrong to assume everyone is like you, by the way. Not everyone with a comfortable income and assets begrudges every penny of tax they pay. We’re comfortably off and could easily pay more tax but we’re not close to point of liability for a wealth tax.

Wrong! I am guessing that you speak from the opposite end of the spectrum to those potentially impacted.

You ignore human behaviour. Labour have proven themselves to have a flexible relationship with the truth. GBP 10mn today, 2mn tomorrow. A ‘one off’? Pull the other one.

BIossomtoes · 12/08/2025 17:46

ChildFreeAndOhSoHappy · 12/08/2025 17:35

It's responses like this that make me so glad we are leaving the UK. Let me guess, you are a low rate tax payer with no assets? You must be, otherwise why would you advocate for more taxes on what are already high taxes?

Unless you have assets in the region of £10 million you wouldn’t be affected by the kind of wealth tax advocated. Of course if you fit into that category you wouldn’t really miss a one off 2% tax on your the portion of your assets above the baseline.

There’s no such thing as low rate tax, incidentally. There’s basic rate which you pay on the portion of your income above £12570 up to £50k, then higher rate which you pay on the next £100k.

You’re wrong to assume everyone is like you, by the way. Not everyone with a comfortable income and assets begrudges every penny of tax they pay. We’re comfortably off and could easily pay more tax but we’re not close to point of liability for a wealth tax.