Page 4 | On phone in stationary traffic

Charttopper · 2025-08-05T20:37:34+00:00

NC for this. I'm wondering if any legal folk have advice or whether you all think IABU. A few weeks ago I was stopped at traffic lights for some time in standstill traffic so I briefly picked up my phone to look at a message that had come through. I was on my own with my baby in the back. Suddenly I was aware of something to my right and when I turned, there was a man in a high vis jacket on a bicycle, stopped right next to my door, and bending down to stare at me through my window. He didn't engage, just stared straight at me for what felt like an age. His position meant that I couldn't get out of the car and it felt very intimidating. I didn't know what his intentions were, or what he'd do next. He then cycled off ahead and stopped by the windows of one or two other drivers and did the same thing. I felt quite shaken by the experience. I later learned that he either reported me or was an undercover policeman as he had filmed me on my phone with his helmet camera. I have now received 6 points and a £200 fine. I accept that the law states that checking your phone including when stationary is an offence so I am not disputing that there should be a consequence. However, I can't help but feel that 6 points is a disproportionate punishment given that I was stationary and not actually causing risk. If I was moving it would be a different matter but I was not driving without due care and attention, i was stationary with the break on. Secondly, the method of capturing this footage - a man staring into a woman's car, on her own with a baby, and instilling fear and blocking her in surely is not acceptable? Can I challenge any of this?

Original poster

Charttopper · 06/08/2025 08:56

IShouldNotCoco · 06/08/2025 08:51

I’ve just been googling this - are you in London @Charttopper ? There is a well known cyclist there who apparently does this. Apparently, he’s caught celebrities and got them fined as well.

But from what I’ve read, cyclists who go around doing this are also at risk of being fined themselves for causing traffic obstructions.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CyclingMikey

No not in London but interesting to know!

OP posts:

Original poster

Charttopper · 06/08/2025 08:54

PhoneMeATaxi · 06/08/2025 08:25

@Charttopper no I actually don't because nothing can be that important. I don't take calls either. It is just a feature of my new car. But then I didn't grow up with a mobile phone glued to my hand, I went to school before mobile phones existed, when you needed an emergency 10p for a phone box to ring your Mum.

I grew up with scheduled tv, so we learned to wait, it was normal to wait.

Literally just replied to what you said;

"I just tap a button once. I can also reply verbally and replying is the major issue here, you get a message, you look at the lights, then start replying."

P.s. we're probably the same age then

OP posts:

IShouldNotCoco · 06/08/2025 08:54

He has a YouTube channel

https://youtube.com/@cyclingmikey?si=-QipZ8DjK65j0hxu

IShouldNotCoco · 06/08/2025 08:51

I’ve just been googling this - are you in London @Charttopper ? There is a well known cyclist there who apparently does this. Apparently, he’s caught celebrities and got them fined as well.

But from what I’ve read, cyclists who go around doing this are also at risk of being fined themselves for causing traffic obstructions.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CyclingMikey

FixTheBone · 06/08/2025 08:47

UrbanOasis · 06/08/2025 07:51

The cyclist was at no risk because the car was stationary. I accept it's the law, the OP has to accept the penalty, just pointing out that no-one was at risk because she wasn't actually driving at the time in any real sense.

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You being delberately obtuse?

The cyclist could have moved into a position where OP may not have seen them or be able to see them while they are using their phone.

OP then pulls away or makes a turn unaware a cyclist has moved into their blindspot and then tries to use the same argument to justify causing death by dangerous driving.

tigger1001 · 06/08/2025 08:42

Marmiteontoastgirlie · 05/08/2025 21:48

What a prick! Could you perhaps write in an irate message saying you were intimidated by this man and had picked up your phone to call the police before he cycled off? Could be worth a shot.

PS this is AIBU so be prepared for everyone to flame you. But I occasionally accidentally check my phone if I’ve been sitting at lights for ages in traffic (and then freak out and look around to see if there is a camera watching me and wait for the fine in the post). It’s definitely not worth the worry for me but I do sometimes itch to briefly check a message if I’m very bored and not moving.

How do you "accidentally" check your phone?

itsgettingweird · 06/08/2025 08:39

If you don’t break the law then none is going to film you through your window.

You created the situation you want to complain about 🤦🏼♀️

nopiesleftinthisvehicle · 06/08/2025 08:32

samarrange · 05/08/2025 21:55

The driver is meant to be paying attention to the traffic situation at all times, including when stopped.

For example, say the lights start to change and the driver misses them going from red to red-and-amber, thus also missing the chance to get mentally prepared for them to go green. She looks up, sees the lights are now green (maybe under even more pressure after just being honked from behind), jettisons her phone, and sets off. But some pedestrian coming from the right decided to try and scuttle across the road just after the pedestrian light went red. The driver's complete lack of situational awareness means she is a thousand times more likely to hit that pedestrian. Had she been watching the road, the pedestrian would just have received a muttered FFS from the driver, not a broken pelvis.

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Absolutely all of this.

Shame it needed spelling out 🤨

Any journey I make - even a 5 minute one to the Supermarket is filled with roughly 30% of Drivers on their phones.
This is only the ones driving past me in the opposite direction, or behind me.
It's an accident waiting to happen.
Someone ran into the back of me in traffic once, 100% on her phone and not noticing the conditions had changed.

IShouldNotCoco · 06/08/2025 08:32

Boredlass · 06/08/2025 07:11

You’re in the wrong. You aren’t even allowed to eat or drink anything either

I’ve learned quite a bit from reading this thread.

TheNightingalesStarling · 06/08/2025 08:28

PollyBell · 06/08/2025 08:25

If anyone doesn't know the laws fcor driving thry5 shouldn't be driving people dont need to know reasons for laws they need to follow thrm

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That goes for speeders, red light jumpers, middle lane huggers etc too but there is awareness courses for them.

Let's face it... many drivers wouldn't pass a Driving test now.

PollyBell · 06/08/2025 08:25

TheNightingalesStarling · 06/08/2025 08:16

I cant help thinking though that there should be a ln Awareness course for "first offense," like with speeding. As it seems many don't realise why its the law.

If anyone doesn't know the laws fcor driving thry5 shouldn't be driving people dont need to know reasons for laws they need to follow thrm

PhoneMeATaxi · 06/08/2025 08:25

@Charttopper no I actually don't because nothing can be that important. I don't take calls either. It is just a feature of my new car. But then I didn't grow up with a mobile phone glued to my hand, I went to school before mobile phones existed, when you needed an emergency 10p for a phone box to ring your Mum.

I grew up with scheduled tv, so we learned to wait, it was normal to wait.

YeOldy · 06/08/2025 08:25

TheNightingalesStarling · 06/08/2025 08:16

I cant help thinking though that there should be a ln Awareness course for "first offense," like with speeding. As it seems many don't realise why its the law.

C’mon there has been so much publicity about this. If anyone says they didn’t know they are lying

YeOldy · 06/08/2025 08:22

Charttopper · 06/08/2025 08:03

In summary, let's be reasonable that checking your phone when stationary is not causing danger in that immediate moment, unlike reading your phone whilst actually driving which is dangerous (and inexplicably remains legal if you're reading on your car screen).

However, I do take on board the point that it is a distraction and you're potentially not aware of your surroundings so could then go on to cause a problem if you don't focus before pulling away. To those who have kindly noted this, thank you for making me think on this.

And thanks again for those coming to my defence against the scolders 😂

Its silly to say it’s legal to read messages on you car screen when you could still be stopped and charged for even if you haven't technically broken the law on handheld device use. Imagine if you were checking messages on your car screen and were involved in a bad accident the police would check and prosecute.

I’ve copied this bit below

The offence of driving without due care and attention is defined in Section 3 of the Road Traffic Act 1988.
The actual legal phrase in the legislation states that a person is guilty of an offence if they drive a mechanically propelled vehicle on a road or other public place
"without due care and attention or without reasonable consideration for other persons using the road or place."
The legislation further clarifies what this means: a person is to be regarded as driving without due care and attention if (and only if) the way they drive "falls below what would be expected of a competent and careful driver."

Original poster

Charttopper · 06/08/2025 08:20

PhoneMeATaxi · 06/08/2025 08:14

@RigIt "I agree there’s absolutely zero risk in doing what you did" she "suddenly" noticed the chap at her window. If she was paying attention she would have seen him approaching from behind.

Actually because my two children have learned to drive in the last 5 years I have watched a lot of driving instructor videos, dash cam fuck ups which are plentiful on YouTube and an insurance claims person who now narrates crash videos and talks about who is at fault and what the highway code states.

If memory serves, there was a case of a person using their mobile phone in stationary traffic. It was a couple of lanes, a family decided to cross between the cars and the lights changed. The person using their phone had not seen the family and although the adults stopped, their young child did not and the driver ran him over. Now I know people would argue it was a one off but personally I don't think it is.

You are meant to check ALL mirrors before moving off from traffic lights because in stationary traffic both cyclists and motorbikes can weave through and if you are not paying attention to the environment you might not spot this or blue lights coming up behind you in the distance before you can hear the sirens.

The cyclist is wearing a camera on their helmet usually to report the drivers who pass them dangerously, maybe watch some of those dash cam videos on YouTube. Also my car screen will read a message aloud, I just tap a button once. I can also reply verbally and replying is the major issue here, you get a message, you look at the lights, then start replying.

But....after all of that, you do tap your phone screen and reply to messages whilst driving?!

OP posts:

TheNightingalesStarling · 06/08/2025 08:16

I cant help thinking though that there should be a ln Awareness course for "first offense," like with speeding. As it seems many don't realise why its the law.

PhoneMeATaxi · 06/08/2025 08:14

@RigIt "I agree there’s absolutely zero risk in doing what you did" she "suddenly" noticed the chap at her window. If she was paying attention she would have seen him approaching from behind.

Actually because my two children have learned to drive in the last 5 years I have watched a lot of driving instructor videos, dash cam fuck ups which are plentiful on YouTube and an insurance claims person who now narrates crash videos and talks about who is at fault and what the highway code states.

If memory serves, there was a case of a person using their mobile phone in stationary traffic. It was a couple of lanes, a family decided to cross between the cars and the lights changed. The person using their phone had not seen the family and although the adults stopped, their young child did not and the driver ran him over. Now I know people would argue it was a one off but personally I don't think it is.

You are meant to check ALL mirrors before moving off from traffic lights because in stationary traffic both cyclists and motorbikes can weave through and if you are not paying attention to the environment you might not spot this or blue lights coming up behind you in the distance before you can hear the sirens.

The cyclist is wearing a camera on their helmet usually to report the drivers who pass them dangerously, maybe watch some of those dash cam videos on YouTube. Also my car screen will read a message aloud, I just tap a button once. I can also reply verbally and replying is the major issue here, you get a message, you look at the lights, then start replying.

KnittyNell · 06/08/2025 08:12

Wolfpinkola · 05/08/2025 21:44

He sounds like a little prick

Really?
Why? It’s the OP who acted irresponsibly and illegally.

TheNightingalesStarling · 06/08/2025 08:05

The risk to the cyclist is that you look up, realise the light is green, and move without checking your mirrors.

Edit... cross post as you realised that!
If you look at statistics the most common cause of cyclist fatalities is the driver not seeing the cyclist.

Original poster

Charttopper · 06/08/2025 08:03

In summary, let's be reasonable that checking your phone when stationary is not causing danger in that immediate moment, unlike reading your phone whilst actually driving which is dangerous (and inexplicably remains legal if you're reading on your car screen).

However, I do take on board the point that it is a distraction and you're potentially not aware of your surroundings so could then go on to cause a problem if you don't focus before pulling away. To those who have kindly noted this, thank you for making me think on this.

And thanks again for those coming to my defence against the scolders 😂

OP posts:

nietzscheanvibe · 06/08/2025 08:02

cyvguhb · 05/08/2025 22:21

So for example I might be looking for something in my handbag while at the lights, exactly the same scenario could play out, do you think that is putting lives at risk?

Where are the studies that concluded a risk 1000 times greater?

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If you "looking for something in my handbag while at the lights" caused an accident, then you could be charged with careless driving 🤷♂️

GCAcademic · 06/08/2025 08:02

chiefscoutsgoldaward · 05/08/2025 22:00

Whilst I agree that the OP did break the law and people should most definitely not be using their phones whilst driving, I really don’t agree with intimidating vigilante cyclists like this who are just looking to score points when ultimately in a situation where harm is very unlikely to occur.

I don’t understand why it’s acceptable for the cyclist to be actively concentrating on filming something rather than paying attention to the road and traffic. I think both the OP and cyclist are at fault here.

Yorkshiremum80 · 06/08/2025 08:00

RigIt · 06/08/2025 00:30

The bloke sounds like an utter prick. I agree with you OP. The law is as it is to make it simple to apply, but I agree there’s absolutely zero risk in doing what you did. So why this cyclist felt he should go around intimidating lone women when they are stationary I have no idea. Power trip - sounds like my idiot uncle who pulls similar power trip moves - I can tell you for a fact he does not do it because he really cares about safety!! A very nasty part of the surveillance society we all seem to have sleepwalked into.

He may have been a policeman, they do do this it's their job to catch idiots who think they can break the law and not get caught. They won't necessarily tell the driver they have been caught at it's stops them catching others and alerts others as to who they are.
Whether you agree with the law or not it's beside the point, we all know you can't hold your phone at all whilst driving let alone use it.
You can use a touchscreen built into you car, but even that can get you in trouble if you are in an accident and the police can prove it distracted you. I have Android auto in my car so all the actions are voice activated if I need to turn say nav on our send a message, which I would still only do in an absolute emergency.

UrbanOasis · 06/08/2025 07:59

Chompingatthebeat · 06/08/2025 07:56

So ignore red lights as well if the road is empty?

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I don't think that's equivalent in terms of risk

Chompingatthebeat · 06/08/2025 07:56

UrbanOasis · 06/08/2025 07:51

The cyclist was at no risk because the car was stationary. I accept it's the law, the OP has to accept the penalty, just pointing out that no-one was at risk because she wasn't actually driving at the time in any real sense.

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So ignore red lights as well if the road is empty?