To think rich people steal money all the time and that’s often why they’re rich?

It’s pretty obvious. Nobody on a six figure salary is in a position to influence tax policy, whereas billionaires certainly are.

A totally meaningless post unless you actually state what you mean by “rich”. Billionaires? Millionaires? People on six figure salaries?

Corporate tax avoidance. Go on then. This will be easy for you to give us a few examples, surely.

Well examples then. What ‘loopholes’ have property developers benefited from? Or companies faced tax avoidance claims? (And avoidance is legal, evasion isn’t). Because I predict you’ll struggle.

You seem to be riven with envy that ‘the wealthy’ are out to get you and the cause of all your problems. Seek help.

So you want us to believe people are stealing but won’t say who?

tax avoidance, exploitative labour practices or corporate bailouts
none of these are illegal,theft, nor are corporate bailouts.

This. Tax fraud costs a lot more. The amount of benefit fraud is outweighed by unclaimed benefits.

these people are unlikely to be "stealing money" their accounts will have been scrutinized 100X over.
will they have created trust funds for children will they have received a tax break for buying their parents a home maybe but none of that is theft.
having money allows you to make money especially when others are desperate to sell.

warren buffet just gave away 6 billion usd to various charities on saturday, something he does annually having donated over 152 billion in his lifetime.

I foolishly thought this thread would be about rich people 'stealing' money - silly me, what gave me that idea? Instead it's the usual jealous, chip on the shoulder rant. Yawn.

Tax fraud it is not only committed by the rich. How about all those cash in hand jobs around. I dare to say that some on benefits also defraud this way.

But we need individual examples to decide whether we agree with your perception of them. Just give us 2 or 3 names?

these 'loopholes' are available to everyone - be it inheritance tax planning, ISAs etc etc. But clearly you need to either research options, or pay for someone's advice, or you lack the money to need them.

This is a capitalist country. And I'd rather that than any of the socialist hellholes of the past century

Don't go confusing them with actual real life examples. It destroys the victim mentality

Same here, not bad for someone who left school with poor qualifications. Worked full time since 18, both daughters through private education. Both DH and I have 7 figure liquid assets plus house, no mortgage. ZERO help, just hard work, savings and wasting money on expensive cars etc. It can be done OP

I too would like to know.

Given we spend 1.23 trillion per year even if we recovered all defrauded tax it would barely make a difference ☹️

I’m talking more about the very wealthy, the ones with resources, influence and connections far beyond what most people will ever have. The scale of their wealth means they can bend systems in their favour and that’s where you see the kind of behaviour I mentioned in my OP.

Op can you name some of these people?

“Tax fraud cost the Treasury an estimated £20bn in 2018/19 – 9x more than benefits fraud (£2.2bn)”

https://www.taxwatchuk.org/tax_crime_vs_benefits_crime/

Yes. It’s called capitalism. Certain individuals accumulate wealth by dispossessing others of the means and opportunity to keep/make wealth. We’re all mad to be apologists for this system. None of the multibillionaires have done it through hard work. Eg. Basic example, Jeff Besos/Amazon has dispossessed smaller and independent retailers of the ability to sell independent of Amazon, or on the high street.

Plenty of them are. Like this one

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2025/aug/04/ofwat-examines-13m-paid-to-yorkshire-water-boss-nicola-shaw-via-offshore-parent-company

My bills are up 40% and she’s getting paid extra.

Great post but I will add the sheer level of ‘need’ is rising in the public. In the 1970s generally speaking there was a lot of social housing etc, but you died at 70 and freed that house up, the NHS only offered basic or life saving treatments (no IVF, complex mental health etc), and the ‘dole’ payment was relatively small and not boosted by PIP and DLA as they didn’t exist.

Now we have enormous numbers of people needing constant high level or multifaceted NHS care, rapidly rising numbers of SEN children needing bespoke educations costing hundreds of thousands each, we have the equivalent of the entire population of Scotland on disability benefits, and services are basically all stretched to the max. Everyone expects much more from the state, and for every part of their life to be financially mitigated by the taxpayer.

I follow a lady on Insta who has 4 children. She doesn’t work, 2 of her children are in special educational settings and receive DLA plus the obligatory transport. She recently moved to a new 4 bedroom social house, and owing to the transport situation, the local council asked if she could take the youngest to their special school for a couple of weeks until they’d sorted a taxi from the new house. All hell broke loose - she posted relentlessly about how they were being ‘failed’ and how ‘broken’ the system was.

I felt like saying for Gods sake. You have a free 4 bedroom house, you don’t work, your children’s education will be costing hundreds of thousands a year, and you’re complaining because you have to drive your kid to school yourself for a couple of weeks? The level of entitlement is insane.

Yes, that £200k a year (or whatever their cost to the taxpayer) is pennies compared to billionaires. But when you replicate this situation across the country hundreds of thousands of times the numbers become enormous.

There’s been a few rich vs poor threads today. People work hard and sometimes study hard, make money and that’s how it is.