To not go on holiday on Monday

Ages and stages. No, not all teenagers are like this but many are by nature. I found the below helpful. If you skip the trip I bet she will wish you had been there. If you need the break and won't feel you're missing out I'd take the time to give yourself a breather.

Dear Parent: This is the letter that I wish I could write. This fight we are in right now. I need it. I need this fight. I can’t tell you this because I don’t have the language for it and it wouldn’t make sense anyway. But I need this fight. Badly. I need to hate you right now and I need you to survive it. I need you to survive my hating you and you hating me. I need this fight even though I hate it too. It doesn’t matter what this fight is even about: curfew, homework, laundry, my messy room, going out, staying in, leaving, not leaving, boyfriend, girlfriend, no friends, bad friends. It doesn’t matter. I need to fight you on it and I need you to fight me back. I desperately need you to hold the other end of the rope. To hang on tightly while I thrash on the other end—while I find the handholds and footholds in this new world I feel like I am in. I used to know who I was, who you were, who we were. But right now I don’t. Right now I am looking for my edges and I can sometimes only find them when I am pulling on you. When I push everything I used to know to its edge. Then I feel like I exist and for a minute I can breathe. I know you long for the sweeter kid that I was. I know this because I long for that kid too, and some of that longing is what is so painful for me right now. I need this fight and I need to see that no matter how bad or big my feelings are—they won’t destroy you or me. I need you to love me even at my worst, even when it looks like I don’t love you. I need you to love yourself and me for the both of us right now. I know it sucks to be disliked and labeled the bad guy. I feel the same way on the inside, but I need you to tolerate it and get other grownups to help you. Because I can’t right now. If you want to get all of your grown up friends together and have a ‘surviving-your-teenager-support-group-rage-fest’ that’s fine with me. Or talk about me behind my back--I don’t care. Just don’t give up on me. Don’t give up on this fight. I need it. This is the fight that will teach me that my shadow is not bigger than my light. This is the fight that will teach me that bad feelings don’t mean the end of a relationship. This is the fight that will teach me how to listen to myself, even when it might disappoint others. And this particular fight will end. Like any storm, it will blow over. And I will forget and you will forget. And then it will come back. And I will need you to hang on to the rope again. I will need this over and over for years. I know there is nothing inherently satisfying in this job for you. I know I will likely never thank you for it or even acknowledge your side of it. In fact I will probably criticize you for all this hard work. It will seem like nothing you do will be enough. And yet, I am relying entirely on your ability to stay in this fight. No matter how much I argue. No matter how much I sulk. No matter how silent I get. Please hang on to the other end of the rope. And know that you are doing the most important job that anyone could possibly be doing for me right now. Love, Your Teenager

Let them go together. Frame it that you and your daughter will benefit from time apart. It will do you both good.

I have sons that breezed through the teenage years. I have friends with daughters who became absolute nightmares as teens. None of them stayed horrid. Do whatever gets you through this bit if your husband can support your decision.

Don't miss your holiday. She's old enough to be left alone in the accommodation. Go and enjoy the holiday with your DH. Try and involve her but if she wants to sulk in her room leave her to it. It might actually be a chance for you and DD to reconnect but if not take it as a chance to have a break yourself.

I don’t know but I’m with you on this. My 15 DD is similar and work has been stressful too, and last night I just took myself off to a hotel on my own and drank wine in the bath!

@Theteenandme my very wise late mother of myself, two sisters and a brother told me when my first was hard work as a little one that 'the teenage years are the worst'. She wasn't wrong, I think they're the worst for teenagers themselves as well as their parents and for teenage girls to be awful to their mothers in particular seems to be very common. Ignore the smug comments on here about delightful teens - I think it's luck of the draw. I had one who was a nightmare and one who was fine. Same parents! The lack of backup is fuel to the flames.
Is there a compromise for the holiday? Say to them all you think it would be good to have some space from each other, you stay home for a few days and then join them for the second half of the week as it isn't far away? Dh then gets the full parenting responsibility and might be more supportive going forward, and you still have part of the holiday as a family. Good luck with it all, these years do pass!

Personally I would drop her at her grandparents (if you can), then go away with your DH.

On the holiday remind your DH that you two are a team and you need support, but then have a great time.

If her grandparents are anything like my daughters, she will come back politer, grandparents whilst tending to spoil their grandchildren, can also scare the living hell out of them, without a conscience too haha

OP I just wanted to sympathise. My son is behaving in a similar way and I’ve decided we are not going away as I cannot face it. Also have no back up from his father, we are divorced. He’s lovely to everyone apart from his siblings and me. I’m riding it out for now.

OP I once left our then 16 year old DD at home with her Dad for a week while I took the younger two away. She'd been awfully behaved for weeks, and it was all directed at me. So I told her Dad that he could cope for a week seeing as it was me that was the problem and left the two of them to get on with it.

And we had a lovely week - it did me the world of good to press the reset button. By the Wednesday DH was messaging "you're never leaving me to cope with this on my own again" as he was then the target of her hormone fuelled rage

And it did help. She was still angry but it diluted it as she knew that I had a limit.

I love my mum very much and have a great relationship with her (on the whole) but I was awful to her in my teen years. She was tone deaf and didn’t give me enough emotional support (still doesn’t) but our relationship improved once I found that in my partner and stopped needing or asking her for it.

My dad was also emotionally distant but whilst I resented him just as much, I wasn’t nasty to him because I didn’t feel able to be. I wasn’t and still aren’t as comfortable with him.

Your daughter likely feels a reason for her disdain, but it doesn’t mean it’ll last. She also is likely expressing it to you because she feels safe to do so.

I think a conversation would help around you having feelings. How you want a good relationship and how her words hurt you. How you’re open to hearing her opinion and are willing to change if she needs that, and how you want to get along.

If she doesn’t respond well, then I’d ask her and your DH to stay home and use the time yourself. She needs to realise you’re a real person, and not an emotional punchbag. I still feel awful for how I treated my mum.

Please don’t miss your holiday because she’s being unpleasant. I have DS (15) and DD (13). DD is much harder work than DS. We’ve just got back from our holiday and both of them had their moments, but DD was worse. Rude, sulky, eye rolling at me - until she wanted a massage and her nails done at the spa…..

What worked for us (and it will depend on the type of holiday you have booked):

If they don’t want to get up until lunchtime, fine! DH and I would get up as normal and go to breakfast and the pool. It was quite nice having the morning to ourselves, DC would come down about lunchtime, by which point, they wanted to be there. We’d have lunch together, as they were usually hungry by then.

Day trips weren’t compulsory, those who wanted to go, were very welcome. Anyone who wanted to stay in the hotel, totally fine.

DD and I did have a nice afternoon in the spa - obviously she was on her best behaviour as I was paying and it was something she wanted to do. Nonetheless, she was pleasant and it was a great afternoon.

She did have a massive strop just before we went out to dinner one night. So we went out and left her in the hotel. It was an AI so she could go to the buffet if she wanted, but she actually just stayed in the room eating crisps. I think she was a bit surprised we went without her and it took the wind out of her sails a bit.

She enjoyed wandering round the local tat shops with EUR 20 buying cheap bracelets and local skin care.

Once we’d had dinner, if DC wanted to go back to the room whilst DH and I had another drink or watched the show, again absolutely fine.

I think they need a bit of freedom on holiday and not being coerced into doing things they don’t want to. It felt a huge waste to me for them lying in their beds until lunchtime on holiday and not something I want to do, but it is what they wanted to do. It didn’t impact on my holiday so just let them get on with it!

honestly - i would let her go on holiday with her dad and you stay home
or
you go (alone!)

I would explain clearly you both need some time apart and it will make you all the better for it!

I was vile at that age and ruined every family outing. Looking back I have no idea why really other than I didn’t want to go and my parents made me. By the time I was 17 my family left me at home and didn’t force me to come on holidays etc and we were all the better for it.

I don’t think you should just choose not to be around her. If your aim by not going is to make her feel guilty / bad for her behaviour I think it will back fire and will entrench it further. Even if that’s not your aim, it might seem like that to her. Not matter what you tell her about your reasons for not going she will perceive it as rejection.

You can be very clear with her that the way she talks to you sometimes is hurtful and not acceptable. Pick her up on it every single time. But also she’s 15 it’s really normal for her to not want to be around you / to be pushing you away. Frame it as fairly normal teen behaviour and don’t assume that it means she hates you. If you’ve been too restrictive with her she’s also probably trying to push back and assert her independence.

I've had many many issues with my 3 adult sons over the years but not once didn't any of them say they didn't like me as teenagers , that's worrying!

Mine never has. She’s 16 and we’ve had our moments, arguments etc, but she has never said anything like this. If she did I’d be sitting with her to discuss what the problem was.

I was often awful to my mum as a teen, to anyone else I was seen as a well behaved and polite person, but I was suffering a lot with mental health and didn't know how to communicate properly, so the ones you love the most suffer unfortunately.
Is there something else in the mix here? I was never overly close to my mum and felt it hard to communicate my feelings and was diagnosed with clinical depression at 13. My mum really suffered as I took it out on her, but at the same time I felt she didn't want to engage with me so was always a lose lose situation.
It would do both of you no harm if you didn't want to go on the holiday and be good for you to have a rest and reset. Don't beat yourself up. Much better to be honest with yourself and know your limits. You know you are struggling and what you feel is a good option so go with that and don't feel guilty.

Yes no use in fuelling up a already stroppy hormone enraged teenager and fight fire with fire it just doesn't work with them does it.

Sorry if I've given useless advice op I only skimmed over the thread but you definately need the holiday time apart if that's possible also if your dd does go with you and she becomes aa nightmare then make her dad spend some time with her and you go off and do something for yourself.
I used to humour my dc when he got a bit like this and it sort of helped diffuse it although that may not work or be acceptable for everybody.

@Balloonhearts i know where you’re coming from but I feel the dd would take that as a punishment and it would just inflame things.

The whole situation needs de escalation. Not punishments etc….

I would still go on the holiday as holidays can be an opportunity for relationships to be repaired. I would talk to her about the way she speaks to you and if she behaves like that while you are away, you can always come home if it's only a short journey away.

I would go on holiday but, if she decides to be awkward or nasty, go off somewhere and do my own thing. Leave her with her dad while you go shopping, to a museum, or just for a coffee and/or a walk.

I think you need to make a deal with your DH. You'll go on the holiday, but only if he'll back you up and not tolerate the way she speaks to you.

If you don't go, she'll be all sweetness and light with him, and he'll believe you even less.

I'd be going on holiday. She wouldn't be.

She'd be staying at home with her father, seeing as he is so reluctant to step up and parent her, while I decided whether I had a future with someone so wet that he refuses to discipline his own daughter and tolerates his wife being spoken to with such disrespect.

I'd be giving them both a few home truths including telling her how disappointed and ashamed I am to have raised such a spiteful little bully and that her attitude and behaviour are disgusting and will no longer be tolerated.

Any luxuries would now have to be earned. Phone, game consoles, make up, expensive clothes, all gone. If you can't speak to me politely, I don't pay for anything beyond the basics. Lifts? Laundry? You can forget that too.

You can only have the piss taken out of you if you allow it. Don't allow it.

Well I would stop with the day trips. I also would not want to do the holiday if you just get more of the same. It sounds like your DH needs to step up as a parent anyway so removing yourself from the equation sounds a good move.

I think you should stay at home and have some space from each other. Doesn’t have to be framed with blaming anyone just simply say you both need some space and offer to arrange something together for her return.
If your dh is any kind of husband and father he will back you up and try and have some chats with her whilst away.
Plan something nice for yourself whilst they are gone