To cut holiday short

It's difficult to say, OP.

Apart from the running off and getting lost for 20 minutes, which would have made me do my nut, none of this sounds particularly outside the range of normal behaviour for little kids. There was nothing else that jumped out at me and made me think, "Mine would never!"

I have to say, however, that mine are only 4 and 2. Perhaps in two years' time I would no longer consider this sort of thing normal behaviour, I don't know yet.

Solo parenting with two little kids is a lot. I know single parents do it all the time but they have developed their coping mechanisms. You normally have your husband around and have not.

You don't have to stick it out to the bitter end if you're really not enjoying it, but maybe see how today goes first.

Whiy could your dh not come due to work, doesn't he get annual leave? Do you think he had an idea of how things would be?

For your own sanity stick to boundaries. Also a 5hr drive sounds miserable too, maybe next time somewhere closer there are holiday parks everywhere.

I once went on a caravan holiday when mine were 4, 6 & 7. First & last time. I packed up the car 2 days early because I'd had enough & had reached the tearful exhaustion stage. Turned the key in the ignition & absolutely nothing. Four hours I waited for the AA. I think it was longest 4 hours of their lives because I wouldn't let them out of their car seats. I used the time to organise a full day with the childminder the day after.

So no, I don't think you're being unreasonable for going home. Don't let it put you off though. When mine were a few years older we started camping. It was great, they just joined the gang of kids on site & went feral for a week. I dutifully took my turns at supervising, cleaning grazes, feeding snacks etc etc & had lots of nice time alone or with the other parents in between. It takes a campsite of like minded parents, or a hotel with a great kids club to make a good family holiday, & no one will ever convince me otherwise.

Mate, go home

My son can be like that but he has adhd and is only child. I wouldn't have been able to cope with 2x. You have my sympathy.

I think you need to implement consequences here-now rather than threaten with future holidays cancelled. They would be upset for a moment and then carry on.
Also, if you threaten you should really follow through. Talking from experience, as I am really bad implementing "big bad" measures.
Is there a kids club you could park them in to give you a bit of rest?

Just power through until Fri. You can't go home, they sound like pretty normal annoying kids. If they don't respect boundaries and instructions it's something you need to work on once home.

Going forward never ever do anything alone trip wise with a 4yr old and 6yr old. Make sure your dh books time off or arrange to go with friends or family. Other adults obviously dilute the situation.

They’re doing too much. They’re overhyped and overtired. They may also be hungry if they’re not eating enough or regularly enough. I wouldn’t go home but I would have a mostly duvet day today. If you can, put on a movie and give them a couple of big bowls of pasta (assuming there’s a shop in striking distance buy a packet of spaghetti and a jar of pasta sauce), and just let them chill out. You can go out in the evening perhaps but just let them stop.

This is great - I wish I'd known more about this when DD2 was little. She can actually be pretty organised and mature at 16 so I think we muddle through ok, they are not like that forever.

Pick your battles OP! Put their shoes on for them. One less thing to fight over. Take it in turns to open door. Give them choices… shall we do x or y. They just sound like normal high spirited kids, do you not spend much time with them at home?

It sounds really tough.

One of the things that worked for us at that age was keeping the dc busy, generally with games. They can't tease each other and wind each other up if they are engaged in an activity. I-Spy, colour spotting, memory games, even things like "everyone name their favourite toy/hobby/holiday/activity we've done" worked for my dc when walking, or when we had to wait for a show or something.

I'd definitely make a 4yo hold my hand if they'd run off and got lost for 20 mins, that must have been really scary!

I'd also pick my battles, just put their shoes on for them.

I wouldn't go home, because I dont imagine fir a minute it will improve at home .

I would tell 6 year old that if I hear them teasing 4 year old again they are going to the room to reflect on their behaviour. I would also explain it's mean. I would tell 4 year old to ignore 6 year old, as they are doing it for a reaction. Once the reaction stops, 6 year old will stop. If they do it again, send them to room and ask them to return when they have thought about behaviour, and are ready to apologise. No shouting, no drama, just consistency.

Do not engage in the drama. Tell them, its the youngest turn to use key and ope door this time. If you fuss, I will do it every time, and follow it through.

Dont want the food? Fine. You still sit at the table, engage in conversation. Food in fridge for when they are hungry. Again, no drama, just carry on. Dont give in and buy some crap for them to eat later.

Not dressed in 10 minutes? Guess what? You go out in whatever you are dressed in. In my experience, if they truly believe you would do that, they soon throw their clothes on.

You're in charge. It doesnt mean constant shouting or being annoyed. It doesnt mean always negotiating. It means firm boundaries and consistency. It means being firm, but also allowing for fun along the way.

It worked for me and I often holidayed solo with 4 kids.

I have the same age kids.

4yr old - why is he running off? I’ve had three kids (DS DS DD), youngest is 4 and none of them have run off like that at that age, I’d say that not typical. My kids always stay with me when on route somewhere. I’m not boasting, just saying that, to me, that’s not usual behaviour at that age so I’d keep my eye out on it. Lots of reminders to stay with you as it’s not safe, lots of bribes if they do “walk nicely”.

6yr old - absolutely not ok to constantly tease brother. It’s unkind and feels horrible as the younger sibling. I’d be going solo with 4yr old to next trip and letting 6yr old know why.

Id not bother doing trips now until DH is free. Personally I’d never take mine alone, a holiday is for everyone and I’d find it too hard alone. I’d rather be at home doing day trips.

YANBU it’s times like this you wonder why you ever had them. Good for you for trying but I’d just go home. Kids are hard work!

Just sounds mostly like normal little kids to me with a bit of extra giddy excitement. Keep the schedule relaxed, you are on holiday and don't worry if they take a while to put shoes on or just do it for them or make it a game. "I bet you can't put your shoes on before Mummy!" Praise them for sitting nicely or anything which shows more maturity and minimise the telling off, picking your battles.

Holidays are just normal parenting in an unfamiliar environment which can actually bring stress as well as interest and excitement. Don't expect too much and chill out.

In the dark ages when I had young children, I discovered the older one bullying the younger one. I meted out exactly the same treatment to the older one. I then asked him how it felt when somebody older and bigger treated him badly and pointed out that that was exactly what he had done to his younger sibling. I never had to deal with the problem again. (No, it didn't involve biting!) They are close siblings who look out for each other in their twenties. This is probably not very woke. I can say that this has not figured in any complaints about their childhood - the elder one seems entirely focussed on a kayaking event on a school trip for which I did not consent to given there was no information about where they would be kayaking, the level of supervision involved and even whether they would be wearing a life jacket.

Having now read the updates I think you should stay for the looked forward to activities today, but I wouldn't blame you if you decided you couldn't face another day.

Doesn’t sound too out of the ordinary except the bit being able to find your DS for 20 mins, you must have been frantic. I’d either drastically lower your expectations - stay in your accommodation and venture out somewhere cheap/free like the park if you feel up to it. Or, just go home

Every time he winges he’s gets your full on attention for as long as he likes.

You explain and then give him a short ‘No’ and immediate consequences - If you ask me again X will happen -

It could be anything every child has a price - lose 5 mins of xbox, then another, then another - all you say is 5 mins 10 mins 15 mins - it’s then his choice when to stop - this only takes a few times for him to get it.

Eventfully you only need to give time!

I feel exhausted just reading your update. It’s hard dealing with this on your own. I honestly think going home is the reasonable thing to do here, but I know I’d struggle to go through with it in your position.

Remembering a couple of things I’ve picked up from useful parenting advice sources. One is the idea of “body doubling” a known support tactic for people with ADHD, including adults. They don’t necessarily need someone to be making them do things, they just need company and that keeps them on task. For example, my DD 11 will go to brush her teeth but then get distracted and if left to it you’ll check twenty minutes later and she’ll have organised all her hair accessories very nicely but not actually brushed her teeth. If I just go a sit in the bathroom with her she’ll have brushed her teeth in three minutes and be ready for the next thing. Young children have similar traits to ADHDers due to brain development stages and will (usually) grow out of them, but you can use the same tactic while they’re young. I know it is exhausting having to actually watch over them for everything, but it will be less exhausting than two hours of pain while they don’t get ready.

You could try putting a song on and they have to get dressed before it’s finished. Pick one they like and call it the getting dressed song. Dance round with them, maybe getting dressed yourself at the same time, turn it into a game or a race.

The other thing that has always stuck with me came from a parenting course I went on, it’s the point that “what you pay attention to is what you get more of”. Basically kids crave attention, even bad attention, so if playing up gets your attention that is what they’ll do. A PP mentioned dopamine seeking, which could very much be true. Ideally you ignore the bad behaviour and reward the good. If they squabble over opening the door, don’t acknowledge the child whose turn it isn’t, just focus on the one who is doing it. If the 6yo is teasing the 4yo, make a big fuss of the 4yo without even acknowledging the 6yo. If the 4yo old runs off obviously you have to intervene to keep him safe, but just firmly take his had and march him along in silence or while chatting to the 6yo. Just don’t give them any attention for the bad behaviour and really praise the good.

Good luck OP. It honestly sounds like hell and I really feel for you.

They just sound like typical excited children on holiday. I don't think they sound as though they are particularly badly behaved, although obviously difficult for one adult to manage. Sorry no useful advice, but I had similar when I took my two boys away on my own.

Sounds very stressful but they sound overwhelmed by the planning and activities. Too much choice and discussion. Do they sleep and eat well or is that a battle too? Depending how far you are travelling could you give them the morning to just go out, wander and play as you go then decide?Or head home late afternoon . Keep the day really simple and informal. Agree you need to keep the 4yo on a tight handhold or buggy/reins if he liable to bolt.

Butlin’s is very exciting 😁 I’d take the youngest to the buffet with you and leave big boy in charge of the table. Not sure where they’re sleeping but have one in with you and one in the other room so they get respite from each other. I’d help them get dressed tbh and I’d get ready for swimming before leaving the chalet but get showered and dressed at the pool after as it is easier. I still lay out outfits for my older dc on holidays if we’re rushing. Do what’s easiest for you as well - if they’re running off and arguing just stick them in the playground or softplay and leave them to it for half an hour.

I’m sure it’s terrible mn parenting but I’d bribe with money for the arcade/ gift shop if they are good and I’d also be far more assertive- no please put your shoes on darling with a 15 minute explanation of why shoes are important and the history of cobbling from me 😁

Yes agreed, can't stand that people let their younger children be emotional punching bags for the older one.

And the 4 year old running off. You know that he does this so you need to be anticipating it not waiting for it. Why is he ever in the situation where it is possible to do it? If you're loading the car strap him in first. Come on Op I don't want to have a go at you but don't be such a wet blanket, it's so incredibly dangerous.

Just go home, they've had enough warnings

I think this is fairly common on holiday, the excitement snd change in routine makes them crazy.

I agree with taking turns for choosing who sits where and opening doors etc

I also agree with pick your battles - yes long term you want them to be independent but if you have to moss showers or put their shoes on on holiday it doesn't matter

The only thing that I think really isn't on from what you've said is the teasing, relentless teasing especially of a younger child is bullying and not on. But agree its hard to punish when you're not in your own home. Could yoh do something like give your youngest a treat and a cuddle every time he gets teased to 'make him feel better', might stop him getting upset and running off and the eldest might realise that being mean has consequences

I'd explain to your kids how it's going to work and if they can't behave all morning then you're going home in the afternoon. Pick a couple of key things like no moaning, no teasing, no running off and ignore the rest. And then give up if this doesn't improve.

I still stand by children need a firm rein from about 1 year old. You need to be very firm but fair. If they grow up with this method before they are even aware, they are far less likely to disobey. I was afraid of my father because I knew he meant business. If he put in a boundary and I broke it, there was a consequence i.e. no treat for that week. If my mother tried to discipline me, I would laugh at her. Why? Because she tried to be kind to me and reason. She would shout, plead, and threaten but I knew that I could push, push, and push those boundaries with no consequence.