This is why we should bring back the death penalty

Whenever someone brings this up, I'm always reminded of that Alan Partridge sketch where he shares a similar view with a guest on his chat show. The guest replies, “Ever heard of the Birmingham Six?” to which Partridge responds, “Ah yes, but they were guilty its only now they are not.”

We don’t reject the death penalty out of sympathy for those who commit horrific crimes. We reject it because we know the justice system can and does get it wrong. Innocent people are sometimes convicted. Albert Pierrepoint, Britain’s most prolific executioner, hanged over 400 people. In time he came to oppose the death penalty himself. One of the men he executed was Timothy Evans, who was later found to be innocent and posthumously pardoned.

So they get to live out their twisted lives, in relative comfort? they will be fed and clothed, given educational opportunities, entertainment, therapies, visits.

No, there is no reason at all to allow people like these to live.

But i would be against the death penalty being the default for any murder, in the case of child serial killers, where the evidence is overwhelming, such as the above, then yes.

Why is it vengeance to want someone like Ian Huntley to be executed? he took 2 young girls lives, or Robert Black or Levi Bellfield?

Because we don't descend to their level. We don't indulge in the sheer hypocrisy of saying "Thou shalt not kill, but it's OK for us to kill". And because a long prison sentence is an entirely adequate punishment.

On the condition that if the dead person is later discovered to be innocent, all those that killed them are also put to death: Executioners, judge, jurors, people who voted for the law change, etc. Sure.

I've not heard of a baby being killed by abusive parents in hospital before. I really hope this brings about change so that this can't happen again. If SS were going to remove Ethan from them then he needed to be protected from them in hospital too.
Poor little baby. Heartbreaking

Let's not pretend scum like this creature will end up in Guantánamo Bay... (Though they would deserve it!) They end up in a warm and comfortable place with a TV, computers, home comforts, 3 meals a day, games and activities, and opportunities to learn and train, and plenty of smokes and drugs!

Tell us you know fuck all about modern prison conditions without using those words ...

@Zvov, do explain how you claim that the chances of miscarriages of justice now are very remote in the face of cases like Andrew Malkinson, Peter Sullivan and all those Post Office prosecutions?

Stefan Kizsko was convicted of killing a child, and spent years in prison before the real killer was caught.

Timothy Evans was convicted of killing his daughter and hanged. The main witness for the prosecution was John Christie, the man who had actually killed her and several others.

You think it's disturbed not to want the state to kill innocent people? I think perhaps you need to look in the mirror if you want to see what disturbance looks like.

This 💯

Animals like that don’t deserve to be fed and watered at our expense. 🤷‍♀️

That poor baby, and yeah I think they should bring back the death penalty absolutely

Tell me you’re a daily mail reader, without telling me you’re a daily mail reader!

There is so much sweeping generalisation and misinformation there I simply don't have the time or energy to address it.

About 4 death row prisoners are exonerated every year in the US. There are obviously many more where there are doubts over the conviction, but they are executed before exoneration.

There are no computers in prisons in the UK, and your idea of a warm and cosy place where there are games and fun is frankly bizarre.

This kind of argument makes no sense - you don't agree with the death penalty but you'd be happy for him to be murdered in jail?

Also Angela Cannings.

Not to derail the thread but I remember it clearly: Sally Clark was not horribly abused by other women in prison, she actually said on her release how much she’d been supported by other women and that it had surprised her to have made acquaintances and even close friends. I think it was obvious that she wasn’t guilty and women would be supportive of the fact she was bereaved, not guilty.

I agree @bluewanda , but you're always going to get liberal leftie hand wringers on threads like this. Yeah there were miscarriages of justice in the UK when execution was last a thing, but we have much more sophisticated systems now, forensics, DNA testing etc, so the chances of this happening is very remote.

And they wouldn't be 'executed' the next day after being given the death sentence. They'd go on death row, like in America. For a minimum of 5 years, so if they DO think they have been 'wronged' they have time to prove their innocence. The death sentence is still a thing in around half the states in America... When was the last miscarriage of justice (after someone had been executed there?) Has that even happened to anyone who has been jailed in the past 25 years or so?

Scum like the twat who beat and smashed his baby so badly that he died, need to be taken from this world. They don't deserve oxygen. I'm sure the people disagreeing with the death sentence would have a different attitude if one of their loved ones was murdered in cold blood by someone.

Yes I know some people think 'death' is too good for some people, and they should be made to 'suffer' in jail for life, but the fact is that some prisoners have a better, easier, more comfortable life than some pensioners! (And some younger people!)

Let's not pretend scum like this creature will end up in Guantánamo Bay... (Though they would deserve it!) They end up in a warm and comfortable place with a TV, computers, home comforts, 3 meals a day, games and activities, and opportunities to learn and train, and plenty of smokes and drugs!

The miscarriage of justice argument is just whataboutery.

It’s a really hard case, he was involved in other convictions in the UK but also his testimony and the oft used “meadows law” helped convict more than 70 women in Australia. One woman Kathleen only had her conviction quashed recently after spending two decades in jail. Described as Australia’s biggest miscarriage of justice.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/12/14/australia/australia-folbigg-murder-convictions-quashed-intl-hnk

You’re (deliberately?) misunderstanding me. The issue of the death penalty is complex, not whether or not it happened.

It’s a horrific crime, of course it is, but that doesn’t mean the conversations about the death sentence suddenly become simple. And the Daily Heil’s focus on him being a cross dresser (as though that is somehow as outrageous as murder) is a classic example of their manipulation of readers to produce gut reactions to complex issues.

Killing this one horrible man won’t prevent other crimes; it won’t stop the drugs problems we have in the country; it won’t fix a highly flawed child protection system or solve the poverty that often plays a part in the formation of characters and crimes like this. It’s really not as simple as immediate emotional reaction might want it to be.

Why is it vengeance to want someone like Ian Huntley to be executed? he took 2 young girls lives, or Robert Black or Levi Bellfield?

There is no redemption, no forgiveness, they live out their lives very often taunting the families by refusing to say why or where they hide their victims or even if they killed them or not.

The DP certain isn't going to deter these people b i really don't see why they shouldn't also know the terror of knowing their life is about to end, it is no different than wanting them to be locked up for life.

If we re introduced the death penalty, it could be done where only the most heinous and clear cut of crimes would be punished by death.

Yes here is the argument about who does the execution and encouraging them but you could equally apply that to people who take delight in seeing someone locked up and join the prison service/police so they can inflict misery on prisoners.

Nothing will ever persuade me to support a return of the death penalty. Even if this was my child, I wouldn't change my mind. For every pro-argument I believe a long life in a prison cell is worse than dying sooner. You see some serial killers end their lives rather than face many years in a cage, e.g. Harold Shipman and Fred West, etc. Death is a way out.
One of the arguments I see is financial. I looked into this and saw that by the time any death sentence is carried out (usually decades later), and multiple expensive appeals have been heard. It would have been cheaper to keep the monster in a cage for the rest of their natural lives than the cost in the US of putting a prisoner to death..

Then what you're looking for is not justice, it's vengeance. That's a dark and slippery slope.

That's really sad about Sally Clark, I hadn't read about it before.

Yes, it’s horrific. He should rot in jail.

A state being able to kill its citizens is also horrific.

This is always my first thought too

Death is such an easy way out for these scumbags, why would you hand it to them?