This is why we should bring back the death penalty

It’s not about stats.

It would be one less on the streets, it would be closure for their families.

I’m not Qing about Lucy Letby, I’m taking about the ones where it’s been proved beyond a shadow of any doubt whatsoever!
How much does it cost to protect these people from being killed in prison.

It is interesting that even Albert Pierrepoint who had a better insight into capital punishment than most questioned it towards the end of his life. I think he is possibly misquoted when people claim he opposed it, but he certainly questioned what his career had actually achieved.

Clearly

You mentioned Fred West.

He saved the hangman a rope, by taking his own life. Where is the justice there? He wanted death, and made sure it happened. Where is the restitution? Did it bring back the lives he took?

No, it gave him the way to escape justice and punishment.

For the kind of people you mention death is their chosen alternative to being made to face and pay for their crimes. Giving them what they want makes you their friend not me!

We differ on what 'proper justice' is. Like I said, you don't understand how the justice system works however I find it difficult to believe that you think the law works like that. Most people understand that everyone is equal under the law.

Its not about sympathy, its about the fact that the death penalty achieves nothing.

It doesnt lower the crime rate (as proved by many studies over the years) and in many cases it would give "easy out" to these people. As PP's have said, many evil people have committed suicide as they didnt want to live out their days in prison as punishment for their crimes. And of course, again as PP's have pointed out, miscarriages of justice still happen. There is a huge question mark over the safety of Lucy Letby's conviction for example, the fat lady is a long way from singing on that one. Ruth Ellis was hanged 22 days after her conviction but evidence that came to light later showed that she was the victim of abuse at the hands of the man she killed.

As I posted above, the person who murdered my adults childs best friend was seeking their own death. Their actions against the best friend was in order to get that. So when the parents were offered the option to demand the death penalty (legal in the country that the crime and trial happened in) they refused. The punishment is the the murderer NOT getting the death penatly, which is what the murderer wanted.

Actually we have had this discussion a few times at work and none of us would want to work in an environment where people may/may not be subject to the DP. It’s not what we signed up for, not part of our establishments values and not on any of our contracts

we are already incredibly short staffed. I’m guessing the MOJ would need to re write contracts, re/hire….higher wage?

I don’t care 🤷🏻‍♀️

Please don’t say “sympathisers”.It’s incredibly offensive.

Well the justice system could make it however they wanted because it’s not a thing here so they could tailor it for those cases where it is cut and dry. Then there’s no miscarriage of justice and we can all be satisfied. You sympathisers that live on rainbow land and us the realists that want proper justice!

If someone was serving a true whole life sentence and would never be released then I'd suggest education's less of a priority since they'd never be in a position to put it to much use

Social care's a bit more complex and it depends on what's meant by the term, but for me it certainly wouldn't include such things as counsellors or any social facility beyond the very simplest

As PPs have mentioned there are worse things than a quick death, and I'd be entirely comfortable with the very worst offfenders experiencing them

And 3. It’s not what a civilized society does. Civilized societies don’t go in for judicial
killing.

They have friendships and relationships, they have hobbies/interests, they have support to apply for an appeal. They have a life.

I've clarified why the death penalty isn't law. 1. Potential for miscarriage of justice. 2. It's considered torture.

You can't cherry pick cases and demand the death penalty. That's not how the justice system works. The law would apply to everyone.

People in prison don’t get day trips, steak and holidays. Looked up forever means locked up forever. Which bit don’t you understand?

That's not how the justice system works. If the death penalty is law, it doesn't just apply to 'extraordinary cases' and is hardly likely to remain that way if it was reintroduced. Secondly, the death penalty is considered torture and we aren't in favour of it in the UK.

You can't just cherry pick cases and apply the death penalty to them.

You think social services could’ve helped Fred West?

If the government start wasting our money on satisfying a minority of people’s bloodlust rather than investing in education and social care, are you really saying you’d be happy with that?

Why?
Define what that means, tv, daytrips, steak and holidays. Or bread and water?

Can you give an example of this two tier system?

It clarifys nothing. I’ll say it again. Southport killer, Lee rigby, this case of the baby. Rose and Fred west. James bulgers killers etc etc, 10000% done it. No fake statements, no corrupt police, just plain evil killers. There’s no miscarriage of justice to be had because they were caught red handed. No “who done it”
those are the people that should be given the death penalty.

Not really. Talking about Fred /rose west, Venables, Priklopil. Where do they fit in? They’re extraordinary cases that should be dealt with accordingly.

I know, YouWillFindMeInTheGarden, but that doesn't change the fact that it could be made a priority if the will was there

Unfortunately, at least for now, it isn't and so we get these dreadful cases which rarely result in any really significant sentencing, and the calls for the return of capital punishment go hand in hand with that

You lock them up forever.

Where did I provide a sample size of 10?

Yes, we should look deeper into evidence, on that we agree. It’s just that, I have done that and you think that your opinion trumps it.

i don’t think you’ve asked me anything about Singapore before, but I’ll try to answer. It’s quite difficult to compare Eastern and Western nations because the cultural and economic differences are vast. Singapore is a wealthy nation and a tiny population. It has very strict legal and social rules about all kinds of misdemeanours and behaviours considered antisocial. Chewing gum is banned, failure to flush a public toilet carries a fine etc. We are a more lenient nation which brings more likelihood of rule breaking - and acceptance of it - but also a whole bunch of good stuff.

Here's an idea.

We reintroduce the death penalty.

In the event of a miscarriage of justice, the people responsible for that murder of an innocent person are put on trial. So, the lead investigation officer, the prosecution lawyer, the judge and the foreperson of the jury.

It's cut and dried that they are responsible. In fact, it's documented in court proceedings. No possibility of that being wrong. So they all hang.

I can't see how anyone could object to that, because we're suggesting that there will never be any miscarriages of justice. I'm sure all involved would be quite happy for my proposition to be adopted.