Below inflation pay rise for social workers and social work England fees to rise to £120

There's really no need to argue between professions though. They're both difficult and stressful jobs. Im a social worker, I can handle the responsibility, but there's no way I could cope with teaching, or the politics involved in SLT in schools.

Agreed, I’m a really good social worker, I’d be a terrible teacher - both have their place. The difference being I’d never say I was a teacher, even if I spent time helping kids learn. They are both distinct professions with different roles, responsibilities and powers, and very different training. Spending time with kids, even very vulnerable kids, attending court does not make you a social worker.

I cannot be bothered to continue this argument. As I have said repeatedly, I have immense amounts of respect for social services and social workers- they do an invaluable job that is very difficult in lots of different ways. What I do not respect is people who have been doing a job for three years (which in most professional careers is basically newly qualified) citing themselves as ‘experienced’ and complaining that their salary (above the national average, with a pay raise, albeit less then 4%) is inadequate. No one should work in social services, teaching or the NHS if their principal motive
is money. Do something else- if you are bright enough, you definitely can earn much more elsewhere. Only do it if you love it. I do and feel very lucky to go to work every day, despite the challenges.

wrong thread!

This.

There is a reason why social workers are classed as the lead professional in STRAT meetings and core groups.

Solidarity from an educational psychologist - it’s even worse over here! Huge recruitment and retention crisis too - the lure of private work/pay is too strong.

I can imagine that teachers feel the emotional weight in a different way, due to seeing the children that they know are being affected, day in day out. Similar to how residential staff can feel, being alongside children in awful situations and witnessing it.
It doesn't mean they carry the same level of responsibility. It is still very intense, but in a different way. If anything, teaching staff do more of what many social workers thought they'd be doing in social work, which is spending time with children.

There's really no need to argue between professions though. They're both difficult and stressful jobs. Im a social worker, I can handle the responsibility, but there's no way I could cope with teaching, or the politics involved in SLT in schools.

Really? So teachers are going into homes, to work the parents of those children? They’re assessing the home conditions, looking for indicators or neglect, or substance misuse or domestic abuse? They’re sitting with parents explaining their concerns usually with the perpetrator present? They’re working with police to investigate criminality? They’re sitting with parents to try and make sense with them as to how their child has been drawn into county lines? Teachers are trying to build parenting capacity, supporting parents when their child goes missing, working with the police to trace said child, working with the child to find a way out of an incredibly dangerous situation - often putting themselves in danger in the process.

Teachers are assessing that that child needs to be taken into care? Teachers are convening and chairing statutory child protection meetings? They’re building an evidence base, writing the report, explaining to parents why their child needs accommodated? Standing behind that report in court, dealing with the fall out when court decides not to grant the order? They’re physically removing children from unsafe homes?

Teachers are important, a key part of the patchwork of support and safeguarding system, but they aren’t social workers by any definition.

No, even SLT don't have the same responsibility as a social worker - surely you understand that as SLT's responsibility is to refer to social services? For them to investigate and make decisions?

I’ve been teaching since 2011, I am not a classroom teacher.

You can do if you are in SLT which is clearly where the OP believes they should be given that they are openly complaining about a 37k newly qualified salary.

Seriously, being aware of a safeguarding issue or even being a witness in a court case is not the same as having the responsibility of a social worker. A classroom teacher definitely doesn't have anywhere near that responsibility.

I see where you are coming from but in inner city areas teachers can have dead children on their hands. I know a handful of teachers (including myself) who have been directly involved with county lines court cases and it so horrifying and absolutely heartbreaking. So please don’t tell me teaching isn’t social work. Because in some places it absolutely is.

Teachers working in schools that go into special measures do not 'lose their careers' how ridiculous.
But even if they did, it's hardly life or death, is it?
The safeguarding responsibility of teachers is to refer to someone with more responsibility - ultimately a social worker.

If you don’t perform the school goes in to special measures and you lose your job or- in all likelihood your career. It is no different in social work.

Except in social work if you make a mistake, a wrong decision you can easily have a dead child or vulnerable adult on your conscience. Even very good, skilled, experienced, well performing social workers can miss something when they’re working with complexity at pace. It’s very different to teaching.

So what about secondary school teachers? They will have done an undergrad in their subject for 9k a year, plus a PGCE at 9k. So 36k for university tuition. That doesn’t take into account any living costs (which would be a massive additional loan for the four years). Please don’t act like only social workers pay for university because that is beyond ridiculous.

I'm actually in agreement with the OP. £37k is not an appropriate salary given the level of risk managed and the level of responsibility held by a qualified social worker.
Its just a lot worse in NI

I think the posts above referenced something earlier where some posters were comparing length of experience in the post and assuming that a SW 3 with 3 years experience would only be recently qualified.
In teaching, as it's so much on the job training, people tend to count their experience as when they start teacher training, given that's when they start teaching.
In social work, years are referenced specifically to post qualification. So a social worker with 3 years experience means 3 years after qualification, so 3 years + 2 or 3 years training and placements.

Think social workers deserve same rises as teachers.

If you’re that crap you shouldn’t be complaining about earning 37k a year.

You also don’t understand in any way the safeguarding responsibilities of teachers. In teaching if you are on 37k+ (which is the salary the ‘very experienced’ social worker of 3 years is talking about) then you are normally trying to move in to a tlr position with direct accountability for a cohert or department. If you don’t perform the school goes in to special measures and you lose your job or- in all likelihood your career. It is no different in social work. I say this from the point of view of a lead practitioner who grew up with a family of social workers and who has worked at some of the worst and best schools in inner city London. I have been a witness in a murder case on county lines for a boy I met when he was 11. I am not trying to undermine social workers or social services- I have immense amounts of respect for them. But I don’t feel the same about people who come in to the public sector expecting more and more money. Everyone deserves a living wage, everyone deserves to be comfortable- but if money is your driving force please don’t go into social services, teaching or the NHs. There are much easier ways to make a living.

It's not? You're the one trying to create a weird hierarchy of challenges between social work and teaching. The rest of us acknowledge they are both challenging professions and should both be compensated properly!

If you're a crap teacher some kids might have to resit their GCSEs and the parents will bitch about you on whatsapp. If you're a crap social worker children could be murdered and you'll be dragged through the tabloids as personally responsible.
It's not really comparable is it?

Exact this. The OP is clearly feels/is(?) entitled for some reason. I’m not excusing the obvious issues with the funding of the public sector but to be complaining about a starting salary (3 years is nothing) of 37k shows they are somewhat out of touch with reality.

How is that in any way different to a secondary school teacher working in a special measures school in a deprived inner city borough?

It's intriguing to think about what society in 2035 might be like without teachers, nurses, social workers, and other crucial workers, all forced out by inadequate wages.

I’ve name changed for obvious reasons.

I’ve mixed feelings about this thread and quite sad that some responses have turned into a competition between professions that also face significant challenges.

For my part I qualified as a SW after 20 years in the private sector earning a six figure salary (plus bonus) and making the decision that I wanted to spend the rest of my working life before retirement “making a difference” (trite but true).

After self funding a Masters degree in Social Work I spent my probationary year (ASYE) earning circa £31k. This was increased to circa £34k, which is still my current salary.

I provide this for context given the figure of £37k has been bandied around this thread.

I’m very fortunate. This was never about money for me. The mortgage was paid off long ago and my pension pot is heathy enough that I could retire now and draw down twice what I earn now even if I live until I’m 90 years old.

To bust some myths. My public sector pension is not a patch on the one I had in the private sector.

My work to life balance (even though I worked in a very senior role previously) is certainly much more compromised than it was.

I work in the field of Learning Disabilities, which also covers autism and the transition of children with complex needs to adult social care. Many also have mental health comorbidities. We are responsible for some of the most complex cases in social care that sometimes require highly specialised provision that involves working closely with professionals in health and education.

Everyone is stretched beyond capacity and I have a huge amount of respect for professionals in those fields.

However what I don’t see in other professions is the same pressure that results in people being made to take responsibility for complex cases within a few years of qualification.

My own team is a case in point. We are down 5 staff (combination of long term sick/burnout, leaving to work in less complex fields or just leaving the profession full stop because they are done working well below minimum wage given the hours needed to do the role) and struggling to recruit.

I am the only full time member of staff on the team. I’m also the second most senior (excluding the senior practitioner and manager).

I regularly work a 50 hour week.

Due to the vacancies in the team those of us left spend 30% of our time covering duty (should be 10%) - yet still have standard caseloads.

I can’t push my “to do list” down the road. I have statements to file for the Court of Protection. I need to respond to S42 safeguarding enquiries within a proscribed timeframe. I need to ensure children who are 17 will still have their needs met under adult social care and a have a functioning support provision before they turn 18.

I have to conduct mental capacity assessments that have the potential to curtail someone’s freedoms and be able to evidence (quite rightly) that every effort has been made ensure they have been afforded every opportunity to demonstrate their capacity for self agency (and be willing to know that I might be called before a court to justify my findings).

I have to go to visit people with significant behavioural challenges armed with nothing but my (crappy) lone worker pendant that needs charging every night and yes I sometimes forget and spend time in home environments that are contaminated with faecal matter on pretty much any surface you can touch/sit on and hold a conversation with someone pretending you can’t smell/see anything.

Yet the most challenging part of my job is being on the phone (usually on duty) to carer after carer (usually a parent) whose sobbing or screaming in sheer frustration because after 6 months of being on the priory waiting list I can’t give them a timescale when their loved one will get allocated a dedicated social worker. Families that are absolutely at breaking point.

Please don’t misunderstand. I love my job and I’ve no regrets. But financially I’m in a very different position to most of my colleagues and the situation is not sustainable. The more staff we lose the more pressure it puts on those who remain, who in turn are burning out, not to mention the huge experience drain from staff post 5/6 years in job (that’s turning into the max tolerance period) that cannot be replaced.

Money isn’t the answer to everything and I appreciate public funds are not infinite, but you may want to think back on this thread when/if you need to contact social services in need and (eventually) get put through to the duty worker and told that your family is on an waiting list and there is no timescale as to when we can allocate someone to help you unless you are in crisis (and then you are “just” in the super priority waiting list).