To be glad schools are finally hitting back

Given that you clarified you’re talking about rules governing serious issues like racism and violence rather than petty uniform infractions, I think you are very reasonable to be glad.

@Merryoldgoat

No strict schools are in special measures. Schools in special measures all have behaviour that is dangerously and out of control.

Just think about how that would work. Does a zero tolerance policy mean no reasonable adjustments for disability? Do you throw out those dreadful children who have major processing and sensory problems, who become so distressed in school if not properly supported that they may have meltdowns? And the ones with executive functioning difficulties who never have the right equipment with them? Those with sensory problems who can't tolerate the feel of the uniform, even though they can tolerate something very similar in a softer material? How about the ones with vocal tics who just won't keep quiet in class? What about those major criminals who never stand up when told to but instead doss around in wheelchairs?

As for zero tolerance - if you empower schools to throw out the inconvenient children with no redress, how does that feel for the child who has done nothing wrong but no-one could be bothered to investigate properly? Where do those children go? Are you going to leave them wholly uneducated?

The key to providing an education for the majority of students is to get the highly disruptive minority out of the way. They shouldn’t be allowed to wreck the life chances of others in the name of inclusivity. So much has been sacrificed on that altar.

They shouldn’t be mainstream teachers’ problem - provision needs to be made for them elsewhere and this should be a higher spending priority than, say, new software or painting the corridors.

Nothing will get better until teachers are allowed to teach and motivated students are allowed to learn in peace and safety.

Not always that easy. You may send your child to a perfectly sensible school, only to have an academy takeover and/or a new head, which is a classic time for stupid rules to be imposed because it's so much easier than improving teaching and learning. If your child is established at the school, taking them out is potentially harmful, especially if they are coming up to GCSEs or A levels.

In any event, why should schools and heas be exempt from challenge? It would be silly to claim they are infallible. Doesn't it make sense to try to improve them from within rather than vote with your feet?

I work in a school where sometimes, despite behaviour meeting the criteria for exclusion, we instead keep some children in 'inclusion' at school because horrifyingly, it is safer for them to be at school than at home.

I think what many forget is that schools are dealing with hundreds, sometimes thousands of kids. Yes some rules seem petty and silly but trying to keep 32 children in a class safe, occupied and learning is a totally different ball game to home school or PRU/specialist setting.
I really feel that a whole variety of different settings are needed and people need to get out of the idea that mainstream is somehow superior.

If uniform is supposed to be such a leveller, then why do so many of them cost hundreds to kit a kid out?

Mine used to time it for tests… They’d express fury when I told them they’d have to be accompanied by an invigilator for exam board exams…

We had one who came in pished during the Nat 5 prelim and disrupted the whole bloody thing.

Mummy worked in a law office and threatened to sue us for suggesting that her precious was inebriated. The empty vodka bottle must have been planted and it was unreasonable of us to object to the yelling and table banging.

Kid had been a free transfer from another school. The LA doesn’t do permanent exclusions - only managed whole-school transfers.

FWIW I know of a few parents who deliberately send their kids into school with the wrong socks or their mobile phones at the bottom of their bags (not allowed) because the ‘rules are stupid’ and are faux shocked when there is a consequence. Cue a Facebook post, ‘awww hun’ comments and complaint. Setting up their kids to fail because they think the rules are stupid is also stupid and unfair on their own kids.

Why send or keep your child in a school you think is stupid? Blind leading the blind surely. Stupid schools surely will produce stupid pupils?

If a parent thinks the rules and school is stupid probably best to move the child to a none stupid school. Everyone would be happier.

Your sentence construction and punctuation are poor. Could do better…

Why should parents support stupid rules? Surely the result will only be that your children think you are as stupid as the school is? I wouldn't support breaking them for the sake of it, but if a school has a bad rule then parents are entitled to challenge it.

My children go to schools in another country - it is definitely not formal here! Teachers are called by first names or even nicknames, students seem to be able to joke around with them, mostly students can go to the toilet whenever they want (there was a brief crackdown when there were some incidents but I don't think it lasted long), not a lot of rules (could write them on half a sheet of A5), and detentions are pretty rare. DD has forgotten books, homework etc. a few times and all that happened was she got a lesson mark - if it got frequent something would happen but they understand that everyone forgets things from time to time.

Whether rules pointless or not - parents should support the school ( whether they agree or not, what harm are your kids coming to?). It's not a parents prerogative to tell theirs kids to ignore them, that's just permissive parenting, what sort of example do you think you're setting? It's a slippery slope, kids have always pushed back against rules, nothing new there. What's changed is parents attitudes to this and parents need to buck up their ideas on this and actually be an adult and parent.

Responsibility is totally absent for some people. I've been asked to potty train (non-SEN) children multiple times. The free breakfast club means that not only are some children, who have been dropped off late, have been given no breakfast because the parents know we have food in the school.

While the pencil issue sounds petty, if I added up the time each week that is spent sorting stationery it would like be the equivalent of doing an intervention group. Nothing is without consequences.

I have long thought that parents at the bottom of the socioeconomic pile, who lack agency in their own lives, want to redress that by pushing against school rules.

No. A parent should be training and requiring their child to organise themselves, not doing it for them!

Behaviour policies are the key.

Helping and supporting children who are disruptive and stopping the rest of the class learning is an essential. Those particular children need help and education but it may be more complex than mainstream can offer so learning facilities should be available to help them learn in the way they need to.

However, the children who can learn in mainstream need their education safeguarded too. It isn't fair when one or two children demand the teachers attention while the rest of the class are sitting about waiting to learn something.

The petty stuff needs to be let go for the real issues that stop the majority of children learning. The wrong skirt doesn't do that, or the fact a child has worn a coat on a 20mile trip to school from a rural location. It is classroom management of behaviour that makes the biggest difference.

Bleurgh. Problem with state schools is state school parents. Raise your game guys.

Haven’t read all the messages, but has anyone mentioned if you let one go to the toilet, miraculously half the class want to go? Infuriating 😩

If this is the result of schools hitting back, I'd say it's more a matter for shame than pride - https://www.itv.com/news/meridian/2025-07-21/strict-behaviour-policy-behind-exodus-of-500-pupils-from-school

As I'm sure you know, the reality is usually that you watch your child fail to thrive, day after day, no one listens to you and you eventually withdraw them just before they're about to be permanently excluded. Wait too long, and they'll probably end up in a PRU. You might luck out though, and it could be a good one where they are met with a level of flexibility, support and understanding that their mainstream school couldn't (or simply couldn't be bothered to) show.

If you have the money, you could try going private and try to find a more nurturing environment. Otherwise, the options are limited besides spuriously "home educating" your child because their mental health is in the gutter and, although you're not confident educating them and they're missing out on the social aspect, the thought of school is simply too stressful for them to cope with after so many negative experiences. Works for the short-term, maybe, but unfortunately long-term they're at risk of underachievement and social exclusion.

"One size fits all" education doesn't always work, especially when applied with a complete lack of common sense or compassion. And when it doesn't work, it destroys the lives and self-worth of some children and some schools are fine with sitting back and letting this take place so long as everyone remembers their pencil and no one takes off a blazer without being given permission first.