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to think that just because you say something about Israel and Gaza does not mean that you should be threatened with arrest under the terrorism act?

482 replies

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 18:59

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/jul/17/armed-police-threatened-to-arrest-kent-protester-for-holding-palestinian-flag

She had a sign saying "Free Gaza" and "Israel is committing genocide"

She was threatened with arrest under the terrorism act because a certain group that has been deemed to be a terrorist group also share those same views - and therefore the lady was supporting a terrorist group.

In the encounter, which she filmed, one officer told her: “Mentioning freedom of Gaza, Israel, genocide, all of that all come under proscribed groups, which are terror groups that have been dictated by the government.”

He went on to say that the phrase “Free Gaza” was “supportive of Palestine Action”, adding it was an offence “to express an opinion or belief that is supportive of a proscribed organisation, namely Palestine Action is an offence under section 12(1A) of the Terrorism Act”. The officer told her she had committed that offence.

I can think of many groups who share those same beliefs. Having that belief does not mean you support that group.

A Kent police spokesperson said: “Under the Terrorism Act it is a criminal offence to carry or display items that may arouse reasonable suspicion that an individual is a member or supporter of a proscribed organisation such as Palestine Action.”

Armed police threatened to arrest Kent protester for holding Palestinian flag

Officers accused Laura Murton who also had a sign saying ‘Free Gaza’ of supporting a proscribed organisation

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/jul/17/armed-police-threatened-to-arrest-kent-protester-for-holding-palestinian-flag

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Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:36

It won't happen to me because I'm not stupid enough to put on a keffiyeh and hold a sign like a gormless fuckwit. Even more fuckwittery to align yourself to a cause that's been put on the terrorism list. Jeez, I need to hide this thread now.

Kakeandkake · 18/07/2025 20:36

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:19

I'm really done with going round in circles with you. Other posters have seen sense and ignored the thread. I'm looking forward to seeing tomorrow's arrests because that's been a long time coming. Show support for a cause that seeks to kill Jews and expect to get arrested. It's as simple as that. Shame the idiots don't see how they are being used.

You are not going round in circles. You have made the point that you think someone saying 'Free Gaza' should be arrested.

Ridiculous.

I agree with you OP, this country is becoming more draconian with limiting free speech.

TheCrenchinglyMcQuaffenBrothers · 18/07/2025 20:33

As a local resident that is having to live in an area that has increasing amounts of anti social behaviour, with very real consequences - local wildlife being killed on a regular basis, disabled and elderly people being victimised and terrorised in and around their own homes, as just two examples - that is leading to the imminent threat of vigilante action, I would absolutely love to see Kent Police being pro active, about any of it, in any way. At all. Alas, of course we don’t see that. Instead Kent Police (armed, apparently) are busy warning Laura Murton, peacefully protesting by the roadside, that she ‘may be’ breaking the law and therefore ‘may be’ supporting a terrorist organisation. They also acknowledge, when she says she isn’t, that just because of what she is saying and doing, she ‘might support a proscribed terrorist organisation. The very definition of the Thought Police. When she challenges this they claim, ah ok, well yes, but you might be distracting the traffic. Ok, which is it then? ‘Potentially’ committing a public order offence isn’t an acceptable accusation from the uniformed police.
Sorry, KP, not good enough. Either she is supporting a proscribed terrorist group - in which case fucking arrest her and keep the good people of Kent safe. Or, she isn’t, in which case what exactly do you think you’re doing, you muppets?
Laura sounded, calm, reasonable, educated and informed. The police involved did not, they sounded fucking desperate and like they don’t have a fucking clue about what the actual law is or how to uphold it. As a resident I don’t feel safe under their care.
And my opinion on this particular episode has nothing to do with my opinion on the current conflict. Rather, if you think it’s ok for this to happen and to be shut down, then don’t be surprised when you’re part of the next perfectly reasonable group expressing opinions that are also suddenly outlawed. And don’t be so naive to think it won’t happen to you.

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:32

ChickenAndHamPie · 18/07/2025 20:30

Yeah and anyone who thinks Ireland should not be United is pro the terrorist UFF/UDA etc.
How far do we go in associating believing in an ideal/concept with saying that then that person supports X organization. It is serious black and white thining

Seems the best thing is not to have an opinion on Northern Ireland.

It would be so tempting to have that discussion with the police.

But I am sure they would then think you are breaching the peace.

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ChickenAndHamPie · 18/07/2025 20:30

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 19:18

If someone said "Ireland should be united", should they be arrested if the IRA were a proscribed group - because the IRA believed that.

Yeah and anyone who thinks Ireland should not be United is pro the terrorist UFF/UDA etc.
How far do we go in associating believing in an ideal/concept with saying that then that person supports X organization. It is serious black and white thining

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:27

This is Section 12 of the terrorist act

A person commits an offence if the person—

(a)expresses an opinion or belief that is supportive of a proscribed organisation, and

(b)in doing so is reckless as to whether a person to whom the expression is directed will be encouraged to support a proscribed organisation

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/11/section/12

That's interesting - so they if they express an opinion that is supportive of an organisation, then it's only an offence if the person to whom it is directed will also be encouraged to support that organisation

I think members of the public need to carry that piece of leglisation with them.

But then there is the "Breach of the peace" arrest because someone might want to attack them so they are preventing a breach of the peace.

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GiraffesAtThePark · 18/07/2025 20:26

Even if these protesters are just ignorant people who don’t know anything I fail to see why that’s a reason to arrest them.

ssd · 18/07/2025 20:26

Themomentsheknewshefkedup · 18/07/2025 19:08

People have become so anti Israel that they have become pro terrorist.

Sorry but this is nonsense

2024onwardsandup · 18/07/2025 20:25

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:21

Saying Free Gaza is not "Show support for a cause that seeks to kill Jews and expect to get arrested."

Why do you think that?

i agree free Gaza is not in itself a terrorist call to sction

what is your view on “to the river to the sea Palestine will be free”?

I think that on the other hand is much more problematic

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:25

GiraffesAtThePark · 18/07/2025 20:23

People who want mass arrests for people who say Free Gaza really don’t want to create a more peaceful world. Cracking down hard on people who are upset at the killings of civilians won’t help

There's another group who don't want a peaceful world, either. This is why I'm finding all of this staggering. You don't even see it. Crack on.

GiraffesAtThePark · 18/07/2025 20:23

People who want mass arrests for people who say Free Gaza really don’t want to create a more peaceful world. Cracking down hard on people who are upset at the killings of civilians won’t help

SprayWhiteDung · 18/07/2025 20:23

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 19:22

I don't believe we should have a Monarchy.

It's a good thing there isn't a terrorist group who believe the same - or else I could be arrested for holding a sign saying "Not my King"

That did actually happen during the coronation: a group of people peacefully protesting with 'Not My King' posters were arrested and bundled into a van.

There was also a tourist from Australia (iirc) who had come over to enjoy the celebrations, who had the misfortune to be standing near to the peaceful protesters, and she was arrested and shoved in the van too.

Bad enough that peaceful protest could get you arrested; but apparently, standing on a street in a part of London that's near to where a group of protesters is also standing is enough to implicate you in sympathising with their (yet again, totally peaceful but potentially embarrassing to the monarchy) beliefs.

What next? Will they be saying that Hitler ate bread, so if you do the same, you must be a staunch supporter of everything that he believed in?

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:21

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:19

I'm really done with going round in circles with you. Other posters have seen sense and ignored the thread. I'm looking forward to seeing tomorrow's arrests because that's been a long time coming. Show support for a cause that seeks to kill Jews and expect to get arrested. It's as simple as that. Shame the idiots don't see how they are being used.

Saying Free Gaza is not "Show support for a cause that seeks to kill Jews and expect to get arrested."

Why do you think that?

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cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:20

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:19

I'm really done with going round in circles with you. Other posters have seen sense and ignored the thread. I'm looking forward to seeing tomorrow's arrests because that's been a long time coming. Show support for a cause that seeks to kill Jews and expect to get arrested. It's as simple as that. Shame the idiots don't see how they are being used.

You are not going around in circles.

I bet you can't quote the law that says expressing an opinion that is SHARED by a terrorist organisation is against the law.

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2024onwardsandup · 18/07/2025 20:19

This dudes protest has nought to do with Palestine. It’s all far left performance

but I do agree that the police over stepped. But I think that is more a case of poor police training rather than properly implemented government policy

all the training budget was probably spent on pronoun training so not all a bad outcome in this particular situation

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:19

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:15

No it doesn't

Do you understand the difference between expressing an opinion and expressing an opinion supportive OF a terrorist group?

I'm really done with going round in circles with you. Other posters have seen sense and ignored the thread. I'm looking forward to seeing tomorrow's arrests because that's been a long time coming. Show support for a cause that seeks to kill Jews and expect to get arrested. It's as simple as that. Shame the idiots don't see how they are being used.

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:18

If someone said "They support the IRA", then they are expressing an opinion supportive of a terrorist organisation.

If someone said "Ireland should be united", then they are expressing an opinion that is the same as that shared by a terrorist organisation

Which of those statements is illegal under the Terrorist Act?

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cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:15

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:10

The law says it does. Why aren't you understanding that? It doesn't matter whether you think it's fair or not. Laws are there to govern conduct.

No it doesn't

Do you understand the difference between expressing an opinion and expressing an opinion supportive OF a terrorist group?

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Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:14

Free Israel's hostages.

burneraccount15 · 18/07/2025 20:12

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 19:30

It looks like there are a lot of groups linked to Northern Ireland terrorism on there - so if you share an opinion that the IRA share - or if you share an opinion that the Loyalist Volunteer Force share, then you could be arrested.

Perfect comparison.

I believe Ireland should be united and free from British occupation. To arrest me for that view would be unhinged.

Meanwhile, here in the North of Ireland actual paramilitaries stake their claim over new build housing estates by hanging the flags of proscribed organisatjkns - mainly the UVF and UDA. No one gets arrested. For fucks sake a kids summer camp just got cancelled because the local loyalist paras got wind that some children who were members of a GAA club were due to attend. No arrests.

Fuck this complete misuse of policing, these Draconian laws, and while I'm at it. Free Palestine.

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:10

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:05

So what. Expressing an opinion does NOT mean you are expressing an opinion supportive of a terrorist organisation,

The law says it does. Why aren't you understanding that? It doesn't matter whether you think it's fair or not. Laws are there to govern conduct.

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 20:05

Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:04

She's just another Thunberg looking for attention. I can only laugh at their pitiful attempts to make a shred of difference in a conflict they have no skin in.

So what. Expressing an opinion does NOT mean you are expressing an opinion supportive of a terrorist organisation,

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Dangermoo · 18/07/2025 20:04

2024onwardsandup · 18/07/2025 19:51

“She” would get a bit of a shock if she popped into Gaza

She's just another Thunberg looking for attention. I can only laugh at their pitiful attempts to make a shred of difference in a conflict they have no skin in.

pointythings · 18/07/2025 19:56

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 19:54

I think this would be laughed out of court. I don't even think the CPS would prosecute.

I sincerely hope you are correct.

cakeorwine · 18/07/2025 19:55

NeedAnyHelpWithThatPaperBag · 18/07/2025 19:54

As soon as things become enshrined in law the room for manoeuvre, nuance and common sense judgement goes out the window, for good and ill, I feel.

I wonder what training the police got on this?

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