AIBU to say that graduation ceremonies are not the place to make political statements?

“And what did you do yourself Granny?”

”Well there was one time I really burned this lady on Mumsnet…”

.

Well said!

A couple of years ago being opposed to child casualties of war was a fairly mainstream position that you could safely assume anyone with any kind of moral sense would hold. Not so any more apparently, dead kids and child amputees and babies starving to death are just par for the course.

😂 I hope the view is nice from your high horse

I'm really sorry that happened to you, I can understand your concerns, I had a friend who was attacked for speaking Hebrew with visiting family.

People always seem to be able to deny that antisemitism happens and when they have no choice but to concede it occurred there is always an excuse as to why it's OK that it happened.

Except a soldier from the IDF has whistle blown that they do target civilians deliberately

Also - Israel bombed the tents of displaced refugees in Rafah. What was the military justification for that, and countless other similar incidents?

www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/may/27/global-shock-after-israeli-airstrike-kills-dozens-in-rafah-tent-camp

Aren’t you the selfish one living in your bubble?

If you can tolerate the deaths of tens of thousands of children at the hands of the IDF because they're 'military casualties' then you're just a profoundly different person to me.

It is illuminating to see that this thread has rallied activists who are blind to any other point of view.

I still stand by my assertion that 90% of students - including those with a flag at graduation ceremonies - are either anti-establishmentarians just looking to disrupt an occasion for whatever reason, or sheep who’ll be on the next bandwagon as soon as you can say disposable bbq (let’s give them the courtesy of seven syllables).

Civilians are unfortunate victims in every war and half the population of Gaza are children (perhaps a good argument for Hamas not to have started the war in the first place).

So long as the bombing has military justification and they're not specifically targeted then the blame once again lies squarely with Hamas just as the 500k German civilians that died in WW2 was down to the Nazis (and Islamism just like Nazism is a cancer that needs to be completely destroyed).

They may be evil but Hamas are public relation geniuses, knowing footage of dead kids will rally useful idiots in the West to their cause whilst their own leaders live lives of luxury in the Gulf.

Naturally.

But whatever, when your grandchildren ask you what you did when the Palestinian genocide was taking place

The absolute self-importance of this! 😆

Oh wouldn't you love for me to tell you that.
It's my own business and not here for the likes of you to pick holes in. Suffice it to say it's a central tenet to live by my moral ethics but not shout it from the rooftops so everyone can see how righteous I think I am.

What kind of activism do you support?

Ridiculous moral grandstanding. I don't know how you dare use other people's plight for your own self satisfaction. Appalling.

Exactly didn’t and wouldn’t happen. All these people talking about their Jewish friends and flatmates who are super pro Palestinian and wouldn’t be offended by the flag.

Many Jews are appalled by the activites of the IsraelI government. Many Jews are actively opposed to it and have a huge issue with the Netanyahu government

However, they’re for the main part fundamentally Zionist in the purest sense of the word in that they believe in the existence of the state of Israel.

There are some who are busy with a Palestinian flag but the vast vast majority wouldn’t dream of it because ultimately given the level of anti Semitism in the world they know deep down that Israel is there for a reason

so no, sorry, there aren’t all these Jewish students proudly waving pro Palestine flags, many are neutral and quiet and simply wouldn’t do it. That’s not to say that they condone the Israel government, they’re vocally and actively against it but raising flags and going on protests vanishingly minute numbers sorry.

Useful info on this here - https://www.economist.com/middle-east-and-africa/2024/01/10/just-how-bad-is-it-in-gaza

It is paywalled so I have added screenshots of relevant passages. The IPC cannot assess two of the three criteria for declaring famine because the healthcare system has been destroyed.

This article is from a year ago. The situation has deteriorated significantly since then.

There are absolutely anti semitic people who are pro Palestine, and people who don't really give a shit about Palestine but who are happy to use the conflict as an opportunity to be anti-Semitic. It's not acceptable and it's not to be tolerated.

But what is the overarching purpose of your comment? That genocide in Palestine is ok because some supporters of Palestine are antisemitic? That we can't criticise the state of Israel or the IDF? That the people of Gaza deserve what's happening to them?

There are antisemites in the pro Palestine movement. The pro-Palestine movement is not itself antisemitic. This is a crucial distinction.

The Israeli government has spoken openly about their desire for the complete annihilation of Palestine. Their end goal is the complete occupation of the Gaza Strip and the concentration of its people in a camp they aren't allowed to leave (their words, not mine). We shouldn't be afraid to stand against this. It is possible and necessary to be in fierce opposition to this. We can refuse to tolerate antisemitism and refuse to tolerate the destruction of Palestine simultaneously.

The Israeli government is expert at saying that to be against their actions is to be antisemitic or anti Jewish. This is propaganda, and it ignores the many thousands of Jewish people who have been outspoken critics of Israel, who have protested and campaigned and donated to Palestinian causes.

It is absolutely a trendy cause and has been for the last 30 years. People were wearing keffiyehs unironically when I was at university.

There’s very few protests about the far more damaging situation in Darfur and elsewhere. Absolutely no one’s grandchildren will be asking about Palestine as they’ll have the rather bigger issues of climate change and AI to worry about.

The unfurling of flags or the wearing of politically symbolic scarves or other clothing has been a thing for as long as I’ve been attending graduations (over 30 years).

They’re young and passionate. As long as it doesn’t disrupt other graduands’ moments across the stage or the speeches it’s best to let them be.

But yes, universities are tough places for Jews - staff and students - at the moment. The underlying anti-semitism of the world is nowadays pretty overt Jew hatred and the fear of being accused of Islamophobia stops the clamping down on Jew hatred promulgated pretty widely as fairly everyday beliefs in Muslim communities in the UK.

Has a famine been officially declared in Gaza?

Ah ok, so there is no humanitarian crisis in Gaza because it hasn't killed absolutely everyone yet, is that right? It's fine if some babies starve to death as long as it's not every single one? As long as some people manage to survive we can turn a blind eye to the crisis?

Does this logic also apply to other places? Do you deny that there is a famine in Sudan too because some Sudanese people have food? Or is that different somehow? And if it is different, why is that so?

To those of you who think the pro Palestinian movement is not at all anti semetic....can you please explain to me why on virtually any social media post I see about Jewish culture (not the actual conflict) ...the comments section is full of pro Palestinian slogans, memes and unpleasant comments. I saw a post the other day on FB literally about cheesecake that a Jewish content creator posted and there was a comment underneath about genocide.