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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

was I unreasonable to refuse to go an aquarium on welfare grounds

167 replies

pppppppickupapenguin · 08/07/2025 16:59

I’d organised a meet up with my NCT group at a coffee shop in central Birmingham just to have a chat and a drink later this week. After coming out of my baby sensory class, I checked my phone and saw that someone in the group had found 50% off tickets to the Sea Life Centre. Everyone else agreed and booked tickets to meet there instead. The problem is that I have welfare concerns with the penguin enclosure there. Penguins have such a huge range in the wild, but at Birmingham they’re stuck in a small enclosure with no natural light and it honestly upsets me.

So I said that I didn’t want to go to the aquarium because I didn’t like the way the penguins were kept there. If it were a new meet-up suggested I’d have just said I was busy, but I was the one who suggested the date for this so I couldn’t think of a white lie to get out of it after the venue change. There were a few replies saying that it must be fine or it wouldn’t be legal, and someone said they went last year and the penguins looked happy. The group went quiet after that and it feels awkward. I wasn’t trying to judge, but I couldn’t think of a reason why I wouldn’t be able to go other than I had a problem with it so just went with honesty and I’m not sure if I was unreasonable for saying it in the first place and how to smooth it over now.

OP posts:
RampantIvy · 09/07/2025 07:13

FigTreeInEurope · 09/07/2025 07:10

The planet and everything on it is a system. Generally speaking, it's better not to mess with the system, and zoos are a completely unnecessary messing with the system.

Humans mess with the system by destroying animal habitats and animals themselves in the wild.

FigTreeInEurope · 09/07/2025 07:10

Firefly1987 · 09/07/2025 02:31

Why? Humans are hardly in their natural habitat either and we seem to prefer that than having to hunt for food, be wary of predators 24/7 and with no access to medical treatment. I don't understand the problem with zoos that have good animal welfare.

The planet and everything on it is a system. Generally speaking, it's better not to mess with the system, and zoos are a completely unnecessary messing with the system.

Doncarlos · 09/07/2025 07:08

I don’t understand why you should feel the need to lie, or be made to feel you’re out of line for having that opinion.

I have very mixed feelings on Zoos and aquariums. There’s one near us I absolutely will never give a penny to and if someone suggested going there’s if not hesitate say no thanks, witnessing pacing tigers and the most miserable looking bear slumped on a concrete block in their cages that are smaller than my house once was enough for me.

If anything, I’d imagine some of the others also feel the same way, or have conflicting feelings about it and don’t know how to respond.

IButtleSir · 09/07/2025 07:02

I'm with you, @pppppppickupapenguin- I won't go to the Sea Life Centre in London because the penguins never see daylight. It's vile.

I also didn't go to one end-of-term party (I'm a teacher) because it was to horse-racing. Didn't make a big thing of it, but said I wouldn't go because of animal welfare concerns. The person in charge of organising never organised to go there again, so it was worth it.

OnLifesEndlessCorridor · 09/07/2025 06:59

I’d have done the same OP. I have refused to join in on trips to the zoo, dog and horse racing, betting on the grand national etc because it goes against my beliefs. You haven’t said anything bad or judgemental, just explained why you won’t be attending so they shouldn’t feel judged. If they do feel judged, maybe they should think about what they’re doing more.

There were a few replies saying that it must be fine or it wouldn’t be legal, and someone said they went last year and the penguins looked happy.

I’m not sure I could be around people who are this dense though so I wouldn’t really worry about smoothing things over if they are being off with you. That’s me though, I’m probably older than you as my kids are grown and I have zero shits to give anymore.

Maryslion · 09/07/2025 06:58

Fargo79 · 08/07/2025 17:13

YANBU. It's a perfectly reasonable ethical choice. If they feel judged, as opposed to just accepting your choice, that's on them.

This.

You can’t go through life making up lies to avoid offending the fragile sensitivities of those with different values.

rosa24 · 09/07/2025 06:45

pppppppickupapenguin · 09/07/2025 05:15

The logistical argument would have made sense because Sea Life in Birmingham is literally in the centre and the tickets were £14. There’s no way I could have been able to attend the meet-up based on cost and location but not the aquarium. With hindsight saying aquariums aren’t my thing would have been better. I feel a real need to explain myself, especially as I’d planned to meet them and felt I was dropping out.

I agree etiquette is important, but sometimes in a friendship if it’s more than surface level then at some point you need to share opinions rather than being on the fence the whole time. I don’t get uncomfortable with the mum in the group who gives her baby no UPF at all, while I’m happy for mine to have pouches and melty puffs because it’s her decision and not a judgement on me. If they are happy that the aquarium is totally fine, then me saying I don’t like penguin exhibit shouldn’t bother them. And also on etiquette, surely the it’s worse to change a meet-up from a coffee shop to an aquarium and go ahead and book tickets while the organiser hasn’t even replied (probably 90 minutes from first message to when I picked up my phone again).

I agree with you on this point - how rude that you originally suggested and organised the meet up for someone else to change the venue/activity and everyone buy tickets before knowing whether you were up for doing the new suggestion. They should feel bad for doing that, not you feeling bad because you expressed why you didn't want to go. I think they were really rude!

dawngreen · 09/07/2025 06:43

She was talking about one place! ????

RampantIvy · 09/07/2025 06:34

ByGreenHiker · 08/07/2025 23:31

I got absolute living hell from a couple of my animal loving friends. Because I went to a wildlife park when I went to Canada.

If they'd asked me before they flew off the handle, they would have known that all of these creatures had been rescued as injured from the wild and were no longer capable of independent living in the wild. The eagles were unable to fly for.example.

Rather than putting healthy creatures down that were injured, they are flourishing in a wildlife park with massive enclosures and are well cared for. The money from ticket sales goes to help there. Welfare and to rescue other injured creatures that would otherwise die in the wild.

I'm not saying sea life is like that. It probably isn't, but do do your research before being an arsehole to somebody for no reason.

Yorkshire Wildlife Park are on a mission to rescue a third set of lions. What do the anti zoo posters suggest that are done with them if they weren't rescued? Currently they are in Ukraine.

I feel the same as the OP about greyhound racing and horse racing and have declined attending these type of events. I just say I can't make it.

dawngreen · 09/07/2025 06:33

I would say its not my thing, and leave it at that. But if ppl pushed I would be honest. After all every one is allowed to have a view point. If they make an issue of it that's on them!

MaggieBsBoat · 09/07/2025 06:32

They feel judged and on some level they’ve judged you.
Just bail.
As a vegan of many decades now I have long since realised that you can’t go in with lines like that. You just need to let people get on with it. Yes you organised it, but you could’ve said something’s come up. It’s urgent. Have fun!
So I’ve voted YABU - unless you are actually a vegan and feel compelled to make the point, which I doubt so you’ll be judged by them as a hypocrite possibly but as you’ve said you don’t care about being judged. Most do.

DreamTheMoors · 09/07/2025 06:28

I completely understand.
When I was very little, our parents would take us to the zoo - and I remember the elephant in particular. She was beautiful. But she lived by herself, in a cage, on cement.
I was probably 5 or 6 the first time I remember seeing her, and then assisting my mum with her 6-yr-old summer school class when I was 17.
That elephant was still there, on the cement.
The zoo guy hit on me though - that was new.

Now they have a whole new safari park thing and have bought a lot of acreage - so none of the animals are kept in cement cages. Or so I hear - I have no desire to go back.

IberianBlackout · 09/07/2025 06:23

“It must be fine or it would be illegal”

Oh, the sweet summer children they are…………

iloveeverykindofcat · 09/07/2025 06:23

I'll go against the grain and say I think you were right to express your reasons. You have integrity. There's a difference between being judging a person for who they are and criticising a choice they're making. The former is unhelpful, the latter is....part of how human society functions. If we never offended anyone, we would have no principles about anything.

Mrsttcno1 · 09/07/2025 06:21

I don’t think you’re unreasonable for the way you feel about it, but if you were bothered about maintaining these friendships then I wouldn’t have advised saying it the way you did. I’d have just made something up or said it’s not your thing.

dottiedodah · 09/07/2025 06:20

Soonenough well done you. Greyhound racing is frightful.my friend worked for Greyhound rescue charity. Really appalling what these poor dogs are put through.

Moonnstars · 09/07/2025 06:15

I think it's fine to voice your views. I think I would have simply ended it by saying that while it's not something you agree with you hope they all have a good catch up and that you hope to see them all soon, and then state somewhere like soft play.
My NCT group didn't last long and different people did pair off. At the time I took it personally but I think these things happen, some people connect better (though actually the two that were never apart no longer seen to be friends either).

Yogabearmous · 09/07/2025 06:09

How did they know the penguins were happy? Assuming they were not tap dancing, that is an odd comment .

Moglet4 · 09/07/2025 06:08

pppppppickupapenguin · 08/07/2025 17:51

This was part of why I spoke up. I really have an issue with large wild animals in captivity and will never go to the Sea Life Centre or Chester Zoo (which has also been floated and I just ignored) and I having to come up with an excuse every time because I think it will be transparent after a few years of meet-ups.

So I assume we’re talking about the Trafford centre here? Can’t you just meet up with them afterwards for a coffee? You can just potter round while they’re inside

KickAssAngel · 09/07/2025 06:06

I think it was quite rude of them to change the plans before they had heard back from you anyway. It's not like you ignored then for several days. If they completely change the plans like that without waiting to hear from everybody, then they risk someone dropping out and should have thought of that first. They clearly couldn't be bothered to wait to hear if you wanted to switch to the new plan.

I think you just need to assume you'll never see these people again.

babyproblems · 09/07/2025 06:01

YANBU.
I won’t eat foie gras EVER. People think I’m judgey. I am a bit; it’s barbaric and a line for me!
Stick to your guns. Next time you meet up if anyone says anything; explain why you feel as you do. Maybe it will open their eyes a bit to the truth and you might inspire someone else to say no next time if they feel as you do!
You can still be friends with people and hold a moral standard you believe in; ignore the awkwardness.

pppppppickupapenguin · 09/07/2025 06:00

rwalker · 09/07/2025 05:46

I think “it’s not for me “ was all that was needed

I think I felt I needed more of a reason than this since there was no logistical reason I couldn’t attend. We were due to meet at that time and a walk away from there anyway. If it was new meet-up I’d have just avoided, but for what felt like dropping out I felt a need to explain why. Seems like vagueness might have been better.

OP posts:
ClaredeBear · 09/07/2025 05:59

Hopefully you’ve given them some food for thought.

whynotmereally · 09/07/2025 05:58

I do agree given you had organised the meet up it was rude of someone to change the plan without consulting you.

whynotmereally · 09/07/2025 05:56

It’s fine to not want to go but if you don’t want to alienate these friends you need to be aware of how you come across. It may be unintentional but it comes across as judgy. Like you are a bit better than them (particularly given it was a done deal by then) Assuming you want to continue the friendship group I’d message something general maybe ask for a bit of advice about something to get the chat moving again. Then arrange another meet up.
Going forward I’d just be a bit more tactful so in this instance you could have said “sorry, not really our thing but have a lovely time and we will come to the next meet up”