Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that this could be possible - covid birth

59 replies

DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 21:35

I had my first baby during the pandemic, and I’ve never fully understood why much of it happened the way it did.

As a bit of background, my waters went at 31 weeks but I didn’t go into labour, so I was induced bang on 37 weeks (with checks in hospital every 3 days to monitor for infection).

I was called in at 9pm for my induction, and by 11am the next day I was having contractions. After several hours I was recording that I was getting three contractions lasting around 60 seconds every 10 mins. I told a midwife to be told just to sit tight. During a 2hr period I pressed my bell three times as I was so sure I was in active labour and every time I was dismissed. By the time they finally said they would check me I was 9cm and rushed round to delivery suite. This was really stressful and at this point I already felt like I wasn’t listened to/ignored and it didn’t fill me with confidence.

As soon as I got in delivery suite I was 10cm and needing to push. I pushed for 1.5hrs before they did a forceps delivery, then and there in the room without an epidural or gas and air.

I still to this day have no idea why I had a forceps delivery. NHS website says to allow up to 3hrs for pushing for first babies.

I’ve since had my second baby and my experience was completely different. It was so much more positive and I felt like I was in control and could have a say in what was happening.

My hunch is that when I had my first baby, they didn’t have any space for me on the delivery ward and so they kept stalling me when I was saying that my contractions were coming close together. And then the only reason I can think of for the forceps delivery is because they needed the room back. Baby had constant monitoring during my labour so I know there weren’t any concerns with him.

What does everyone think? I suffered PTSD following my first birth and had counselling. My pregnancy was complicated and my baby was unwell after he was born so that has a lot to do with it, but the thing that bothered me the most has always been the forceps. I had a birth debrief and when I did my birth plan for baby 2 neither the consultant nor the midwife could give me a reason for the forceps delivery.

I also recently spoke to a friend who’s a nurse and mentioned that I wasn’t allowed gas and air first time, and she said that there was an oxygen shortage during the pandemic, so I guess that could be why they didn’t let me have gas and air 🤔

it’s always bothered me and I feel like I can’t get any straight answers, so would be good to hear what others think.

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page
TrixieFatell · 07/07/2025 09:14

BellissimoGecko · 06/07/2025 22:48

But surely the risk of infection is still there?!

Show quote history

Yes which is why we monitor and why prophylactic antibiotics are given. But there are also risks of having a baby prematurely. It's about weighing up those risks. Obviously if we pick up that there is an infection starting we would deliver baby.

Original poster
DaisyEM · 07/07/2025 08:51

@LadyQuackBeth thanks for replying. That’s an interesting way to look at things, as I actually feel really positive about my 2bd birth, despite having to have the blood clots removed by hand and the emergency bell pulled, which I found terrifying and absolutely screamed through as it was agony 😖 but like you say, the bar was set low with my first birth and I was just happy to have not needed an assisted birth and to have done it myself. I felt much more in control.

Oh I wasn’t suggesting that covid patients needed beds on the labour ward. At the time I had my first there was a bit of a baby boom and you could really feel how manic the maternity wards were and how stressed the staff were, so I wondered if they possibly needed me out of the room asap to make space for another labouring woman. Which if that was the case I totally get it, as if I was coming in in labour I’d expect to have a room to give birth in. They have to manage the situation as best they can. I just always wondered if I’d sort of had my time in the room and so they decided to call it and do forceps to get baby out and free up the room x

OP posts:
LadyQuackBeth · 07/07/2025 07:43

The second birth doesn't sound as if it was objectively a great experience (well done though) just compared to your expectations (which were low after the first one). A lot of women have high expectations the first time which means birth comes as a shock. This is okay, birth is horrible and shocking, but nothing youve said indicates the lack of care or compassion you are assuming. It does sound as if the medical team had you and your babies health at the front of their minds. Its possible he PPE made them seem more distant or affected communication, but I really doubt they didn't care. I'm not saying this to defend them or take a side, but to try and reassure you that they cared.

The judgement on pushing versus intervening with forceps would have nothing to do with needing your bed, they weren't putting covid patients in maternity wards. It was most likely that they didn't know how long you'd been fully dilated (you presented that way) so they were erring on the side of caution. If the rate of progress was slow, it was unlikely you'd have had an intervention free birth within 30mins, so intervening a bit early was actually to save you from more exhaustion, more risk and a potentially emergency situation. Maybe everyone erred too much on the side of caution, but there's no way to know. Nobody can tell you for sure what would have happened with 30mins more pushing, it could have been better or worse.

Original poster
DaisyEM · 07/07/2025 03:09

EmeraldShamrock000 · 06/07/2025 22:40

I strongly disagree.
It really took the pain away for me.
I was late for the epidural and I couldn't have done it without the gas and air.
I had a retained placenta on no.2. Doctor hand up trying to pull it out, no pain, just discomfort thanks to G&A. I was drunk on the gas. 🥴

Show quote history

This near enough happened to me too 2nd time around. I had clots forming inside which they didn’t know about until 30 mins after birth; emergency cord was pulled and I had my uterus manually cleared out by hand, with no epidural and only gas and air, which was also horrific, but the gas and air took the edge off I’m sure x

OP posts:
Original poster
DaisyEM · 07/07/2025 03:07

BellissimoGecko · 06/07/2025 22:48

But surely the risk of infection is still there?!

Show quote history

It is, but it’s a case of weighing up whether it’s better to keep baby in and monitor mum/baby closely, or delivery a baby prematurely. In my case this happened with each pregnancy. I travelled down to our local hospital (45 mins away) every three days for tests and monitoring, took antibiotics and took my temp at home every 3hrs. I also initially stayed in hospital 2-3 nights after my waters went, and when labour didn’t start, I was sent home. As others have pointed out to you, it’s a very different scenario when your waters go preterm.

OP posts:
Original poster
DaisyEM · 07/07/2025 03:04

Anon501178 · 06/07/2025 22:34

I think its awful you weren't allowed an epidural or gas and air! What pain relief did you have.....if any?!

I was given paracetamol on labour ward, which as far as I’m concerned is pointless with something like giving birth! Tbf, I never asked for an epidural, but I actually didn’t know they did forceps without one!

OP posts:
Original poster
DaisyEM · 07/07/2025 02:58

Radionowhere · 06/07/2025 21:56

I had forceps with my third. I have no idea how long I was pushing. Big baby, back to back, epidural. Awful. We were both fine. I never questioned it tbh. Why is is bothering you OP?

I found the forceps birth really traumatic, it kept me up at night for months afterwards, going over it in my head. I don’t know if because I had no epidural; no gas and air etc, I just felt absolutely everything and it was horrendous. Since having a more positive birth experience with my second, it’s just brought up more feelings about my first birth and wondering if it could have been different. Sorry you also had forceps, they really are horrible 😔

OP posts:
Lalapopo · 06/07/2025 23:25

Honestly? I think some Trusts are just very forceps-happy, particularly with first time mums. It lets them feel in control and they have such a downer on first time mums. We have a consultant in our Trust that says 'I'll be seeing you with my forceps' to FTMs at about 36 weeks. I wish I was joking. It happened to me and 2 others in my NCT group in the same week.

My birth plan consisted of one statement with both births - 'I do not consent to forceps'. No one even attempted to suggest forceps to me.

PickAChew · 06/07/2025 23:00

I'm not a midwife but 2 hours of active pushing is a long time. As the PP who is a midwife had said, they may have assessed that you weren't making progress. There may also have been a practical issue such as shift changeover that would have been encountered if they allowed you to push for longer.

Communication was obviously lacking, whatever the reason.

MoominUnderWater · 06/07/2025 22:56

BellissimoGecko · 06/07/2025 22:48

But surely the risk of infection is still there?!

Show quote history

And if that occurs then they’ll deliver if necessary and give baby abx as well if needed. It’s all covered in the evidence based rcog guidelines and is routine practice. https://obgyn.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1471-0528.15803

yes infection is a risk, but so is prematurity.

MoominUnderWater · 06/07/2025 22:50

OP

  • this is what the nice guidelines say.
  • after 1 hour of active pushing, reassess the clinical picture, including progress, contractions, and maternal and fetal wellbeing:
  • if there are signs of progress (in terms of rotation or descent of the presenting part), encourage the woman to continue pushing
  • if there are no signs of progress, offer vaginal examination and consider amniotomy if the membranes are intact; if there is still no progress, diagnose delay and escalate for senior review
  • if birth is not imminent after 2 hours of pushing, refer the woman for a senior review and a decision on place and mode of birth. [2007, amended 2023]

It could well be that after an hour/1.5 hrs there was no sign of progress and they didn’t expect baby to be born in the next 30 mins. So if after that length of pushing there has been little to no descent it’s unlikely anything would change in the next 30 mins. Prolonged pushing increases the chances of a post partum haemorrhage, and also risks your perineal muscles long term, ie incontinence. It’s all about weighing up risk/benefit. If it looks like the baby will be born within 2 hours then keep going, but otherwise there is no benefit to carrying on pushing for another 30 mins just so they can tick a box that you got the “allowed” 2 hours of pushing.

It’s very unusual for pushing to be for more than 2 hours, the 3 hour timeframe you’ll have seen includes passive (non pushing) 2nd stage for women with no urge to push or an epidural.

going for a birth debriefing is a really good idea.

BellissimoGecko · 06/07/2025 22:48

MoominUnderWater · 06/07/2025 22:41

It’s very possible. A baby is safer inside than outside at 31 weeks. Obviously they monitor for signs of infection and can give prophylactic antibiotics. It’s a very different position from waters going if you are term.

Show quote history

But surely the risk of infection is still there?!

MoominUnderWater · 06/07/2025 22:41

BellissimoGecko · 06/07/2025 21:59

Your waters went at 31 weeks but you didn’t go into labour until 37 weeks? This is not possible. Once waters have gone, there is a risk of infection. My waters went and I was taken in to be delivered the day after.

It’s very possible. A baby is safer inside than outside at 31 weeks. Obviously they monitor for signs of infection and can give prophylactic antibiotics. It’s a very different position from waters going if you are term.

EmeraldShamrock000 · 06/07/2025 22:40

comoatoupeira · 06/07/2025 21:56

gas and air isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
birth is birth

I strongly disagree.
It really took the pain away for me.
I was late for the epidural and I couldn't have done it without the gas and air.
I had a retained placenta on no.2. Doctor hand up trying to pull it out, no pain, just discomfort thanks to G&A. I was drunk on the gas. 🥴

USaYwHatNow · 06/07/2025 22:37

I will just preface my comment by saying I'm a midwife. I had a 4 hour labour with my first baby and had a ventouse delivery purely because I was screaming, it was too late for any pain relief and I had stopped pushing with any actual effort. Just kept screaming at my husband and my mum for it to stop, begging them for terbutaline to stop my contractions (I was having 8 in 10 minutes-with no induction medication) and shouting over and over again that another contraction was coming because they were so fast I couldn't get a grip of myself.

I didn't have any gas and air (they'd taken it off me) and I had local anaesthetic for the episiotomy for the ventouse.

When I reviewed my birth notes with one of the midwives (I gave birth at a different hospital to where I work) I'd been fully dilated for maybe an hour and 'pushed' for about the same amount of time as you. His heart rate was okay...he could've had a bit longer in there, and the reason for the ventouse was given as 'maternal distress'. Could the same be true for you? Which may not have been clearly documented?

Anon501178 · 06/07/2025 22:34

I think its awful you weren't allowed an epidural or gas and air! What pain relief did you have.....if any?!

TrixieFatell · 06/07/2025 22:31

DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:22

Thank you, I’ll do that to be sure. I wasn’t sure if they would even consider talking to me about it now as it’s been so long x

Show quote history

That wouldn't matter in my trust, five years is nothing. You can also do a subject access request to get your notes, they have to be keptn for 25 years. Your hospital website should have a link to the SARs request.

I'll be honest, I think it's terrible you weren't given a debrief after the birth. That is standard where our births have ended up with an instrumental.

I hope you find the answers you need. Birth trauma is a very real thing and I'm sorry you had to experience it

Original poster
DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:28

SockQueen · 06/07/2025 21:54

I'm sorry you had a bad experience. At the very beginning of the pandemic, there wasn't much understanding about how Covid was spread and I remember there were vague concerns that gas & air could increase droplet spread, so I think it was temporarily withdrawn in some places - though I worked in obstetric anaesthetics in the first wave and my hospital never stopped using it. That might explain that bit.

As for the forceps at 1.5 hours, we can't really tell you as none of us were there. Allowing up to 3 hours 2nd stage is unusual, and would be more likely in someone with an epidural already in - though some of that time would be allowing "passive descent,' not actively pushing. It may have been necessary because your baby was getting distressed, or you were becoming unwell, or were simply exhausted and no longer able to push effectively. It's incredibly unlikely to have been done with the aim of getting the room back sooner though - instrumentals increase the chances of needing stitches, or other complications, so it's not likely to have reduced the time you spent in the delivery room! I can hear how scary you must have found it, but please don't think they were just trying to rush you out of there; there will have been another reason.

Thank you, this is really helpful x

OP posts:
Original poster
DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:26

myplace · 06/07/2025 22:23

I’m a fan of Gas and air. It didn’t actually affect the pain, but I didn’t care as much. I ran out with DC 1.

Yes agreed! I had it with my 2nd and it definitely helped to relax me x

OP posts:
WTF987 · 06/07/2025 22:26

Depending on your trust, I remember a while ago (not sure if right timing for you) that a lot of hospitals stopped giving gas and air for a period because they found the ventilation in the hospitals wasn't good enough and workers were being exposed to above the safe limit. Think it was linked to adverse outcomes in pregnancies in those workers and maybe some other things.

Original poster
DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:25

@comoatoupeira i had gas and air (and nothing else) with my 2nd and did find it took the edge off a bit. Anyway, the lack of gas and air wasn’t my main concern or the main point of my post.

OP posts:
TheBroonOneAndTheWhiteOne · 06/07/2025 22:23

DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:22

Thank you, I’ll do that to be sure. I wasn’t sure if they would even consider talking to me about it now as it’s been so long x

Show quote history

I really hope they do, as it will really help you.

myplace · 06/07/2025 22:23

I’m a fan of Gas and air. It didn’t actually affect the pain, but I didn’t care as much. I ran out with DC 1.

Original poster
DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:22

TrixieFatell · 06/07/2025 22:20

A nurse doesn't have the training to interpret a ctg to recognise fetal distress or hypoxia, unless she has trained in midwifery? There can be quite subtle signs, it takes three years of training for midwives to be competent in interpreting ctgs. It would be bets for you to meet with someone who could go through the ctg with you. It may not have been for fetal distress, but at least you would know that for sure. Contact your hospital maternity dept and ask for a referral for a birth reflection with a pma.

Edited
Show quote history

Thank you, I’ll do that to be sure. I wasn’t sure if they would even consider talking to me about it now as it’s been so long x

OP posts:
Original poster
DaisyEM · 06/07/2025 22:21

Izzy24 · 06/07/2025 22:05

If you birthed in the UK your notes should document the reason/s for all decisions made during your labour. So, in an adequate debrief, the clinician will be able to read your notes and answer your questions. For example the notes might read

Plan: for trial of instrumental due to maternal exhaustion/fetal distress etc.

I’m sorry you had a difficult experience and I’m sorry you’ve had a less than helpful birth debrief.

Perhaps getting a copy of your notes and reading them yourself might help?

Thank you, I’ll see if I can get hold of my notes rather than just having them read to me. On my app the reason for forceps is down as ‘failure to progress’ x

OP posts: