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My employer said I now have to go permanent

115 replies

user1471867483 · 05/07/2025 22:23

I have been working for a not-for-profit organisation for the last 10 years on their 'internal agency' for them to save money on high street agencies. They're making cuts now and I now have to become permanent or I go with 4 weeks notice. I love being temporary. I wasn't even looking for any other work as I'd assumed I could carry on working forever like this! I will also have to change my working hours working two hours later in the afternoon and starting two hours later. It will mean I'll have to come home in the dark now. They want my answer Monday. If I'd known a few months ago, I'd have applied for temp work elsewhere, but applying/looking takes time. What do I do? Temping suits me to a tee. We have a new director now who's decided to shake things up a little in our dept. TIA.

OP posts:
GonnaeNoDaeThatJustGonnaeNo · 06/07/2025 19:23

You are not temporary if you’ve been there 10 years.

ThejoyofNC · 06/07/2025 19:14

Sounds like a case of all good things must come to an end. You've had it very good for a very long time. Sadly that isn't beneficial to the business.

Youngerthanmystepmum · 06/07/2025 18:51

OP It's worth looking into the legal situation and seeing if they have been breaking the law. If so, you can get all your holiday pay, and any other benefits they ought to have paid, backdated for the years they should have been paying it. That could well be enough to let you leave now and look for a job that suits you better (or just a tidy sum to put away form your pension etc.)

user1471867483 · 06/07/2025 18:45

Redburnett · 06/07/2025 14:09

Is it an NHS bank role?

Yes!

OP posts:
user1471867483 · 06/07/2025 18:32

Dufff23 · 06/07/2025 09:48

@user1471867483 i had exactly the same deal and the same situation - I went perm and it’s been two years of scrapping over any time off. Getting unpaid time off is a nightmare if you have a difficult director.

take the job (try and negotiate for your current hours or something not so bad, lay out your caring issues) and look for something more flexible.

Exactly what I'll do.

OP posts:
2024onwardsandup · 06/07/2025 17:31

NoodleNuts · 06/07/2025 00:02

Unless I am missing something, what difference is there in temping or being permanent? I mean, if you have worked there 10 years already then that is hardly temporary, is it?

Yes this is what’s confused me!!! If live been there for ten years you’ve jsut not had the benefits of being permanent. What does employment status have to do with working hours?

Dunnocantthinkofone · 06/07/2025 17:27

You’ve had it your own way (illegally as it turns out) for way too long

The other employees must bloody hate working with you. Choosing your own hours, refuse to work over Christmas etc and just decide unilaterally to take holiday when you feel like it.

TizerorFizz · 06/07/2025 17:24

ACAS says this about workers as opposed to employees. The op is possibly a worker. The organisation might well seek to regularise this arrangement because it is to the detriment of other employees who appear to be on worse terms.

My employer said I now have to go permanent
My employer said I now have to go permanent
GetAGripPlease · 06/07/2025 17:21

It will mean I'll have to come home in the dark now

Welcome to the real grown-up working world 🤷🏼‍♀️

Jellycatspyjamas · 06/07/2025 17:17

AnSolas · 06/07/2025 13:13

But she is not on a temporary contract just because her employer claims that she is.

She is 10 years in and is controled by a manager. Her employment (contract) and pay method ticks almost all the tests of being an employee not a supply of service on a self employed basis. So can the employer prove she is being paid a self-empolyed rate over and above other employees?

The only rebuttle they have is that she is allowed pick and choose her holidays and they dont pay for days off.

I think it’s the OP that’s claiming she’s in a temporary contract, her employer is trying to formalise her permanent status.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 06/07/2025 14:14

I think they probably have to make you permanent after all this time?

Also seems really odd that you are paying into a pension but aren’t a permanent employee.

Doesn’t sound fair on your colleagues that you have this set up where they have to fight for Christmas leave but you are exempt.

Redburnett · 06/07/2025 14:09

Is it an NHS bank role?

GabriellaMontez · 06/07/2025 13:15

So are you basically on a zero hours contract?

Do you get paid holidays?

AnSolas · 06/07/2025 13:13

Jellycatspyjamas · 06/07/2025 12:51

Custom and practice can be changed though, they’re offering her a new permanent contract, they can set any terms they like and the employee accepts that or not. As she’s on a temporary contract they can simply say the contract has come to an end.

But she is not on a temporary contract just because her employer claims that she is.

She is 10 years in and is controled by a manager. Her employment (contract) and pay method ticks almost all the tests of being an employee not a supply of service on a self employed basis. So can the employer prove she is being paid a self-empolyed rate over and above other employees?

The only rebuttle they have is that she is allowed pick and choose her holidays and they dont pay for days off.

Dinkytoy · 06/07/2025 13:01

Your company have been breaking the law. New director is rectifying that.
Why would you think a temporary position would be forever? That is the opposite of temporary.
Anyway you have 2 options, take the offer or look for another job.

Jellycatspyjamas · 06/07/2025 12:51

ByQuaintAzureWasp · 06/07/2025 10:42

Legally you have exactly the same rights as a permanent employee after 10 years.

I would say happy to accept the permanent position but it's highly unreasonable to expect me to change my hours of work and I request that you re-consider that aspect, given that its been custom and practice that my current hours of work have been x to y in for z years. If they decline I'd submit a grievance and look for another job.

Custom and practice can be changed though, they’re offering her a new permanent contract, they can set any terms they like and the employee accepts that or not. As she’s on a temporary contract they can simply say the contract has come to an end.

LittleBearPad · 06/07/2025 11:55

ByQuaintAzureWasp · 06/07/2025 10:42

Legally you have exactly the same rights as a permanent employee after 10 years.

I would say happy to accept the permanent position but it's highly unreasonable to expect me to change my hours of work and I request that you re-consider that aspect, given that its been custom and practice that my current hours of work have been x to y in for z years. If they decline I'd submit a grievance and look for another job.

It’s moving her hours by 2 hours. It’s not highly unreasonable, especially if OP is customer facing.

Carrotsandgrapes · 06/07/2025 11:46

Legally/tax speaking, the company is in a dodgy position having a "temporary" employee for over 10 years. I'm not surprised the director is taking action.

I do contact work, and since the ir35 changes, after a set time (often 2 years) the company says I have to go permanent or leave.

You've enjoyed the benefits longer than most contractors do these days. Be grateful for that.

I'd go perm and then look around for something else if you want to. I have to tell you though that the temp/contract market isn't what it was 15 years ago! In those days I could hop from contact to contact and take my choice of where I wanted to work.

Generally, when you're perm , most orgs let you take some time off for caring responsibilities. But no, you won't have the same flexibility as you once did.

EleanorReally · 06/07/2025 11:11

otherwise they could just let you go surely? temporary workers no longer needed

bridgetreilly · 06/07/2025 10:55

I admit, I’m with the new director. You sound like a nightmare employee, who is absolutely unmanageable.

AlphaApple · 06/07/2025 10:55

Take the permanent job. Submit a flexible working request, citing your caring responsibilities. Look for another role and once you get an offer use that to either exit or negotiate new terms and conditions.

But depending on your role and skill set be realistic, if you are in the UK the job market is a bit shaky right now.

AnSolas · 06/07/2025 10:52

pinkdelight · 06/07/2025 09:55

Agree the new manager sounds like she's doing things properly rather than 'throwing her weight around' and your 'best manager ever' has let things slide too long. You just want things to suit you but that's not the company's purpose, especially a not-for-profit which sounds like it's there to help it's service users. It sounds like you should probably go as you're not on board with the changes, but equally there's absolutely nothing stopping you taking the permanent role and then looking for other temp jobs. If you get on with it and are as employable as you believe, you could get another gig before the evenings darken.

Or shock

The management take ownership of poor business decisions which has created the issue.

The OP is an employee in a permanent part time role.

The Director is trying to pull a fast one by saying that the business can just sack a long term employee. There is no "business need" to accept the other employees request to change their hours and then force the OP to fill the hole left behind.

The employee has no obligation to go over and above her contract.

Its is not fair to sack the employee who is doing their job per their contract just because the business failed to correctly select another employee and deployed that employee into a role that the employee could not do.

The Director needs to prove a prior contractual obligation over changing working hours or time off. If none exists and they did not follow their own HR policy its not a case that the employee can be sacked just for asking that her current contract is honored.

The Director is opening up a can of worms by trying to force the new contract rather than having an open conversation with the OP listening to her needs too.

That is why the Director is being paid a managment salary and the OP is being paid an employee salary.

ByQuaintAzureWasp · 06/07/2025 10:42

Legally you have exactly the same rights as a permanent employee after 10 years.

I would say happy to accept the permanent position but it's highly unreasonable to expect me to change my hours of work and I request that you re-consider that aspect, given that its been custom and practice that my current hours of work have been x to y in for z years. If they decline I'd submit a grievance and look for another job.

Honon · 06/07/2025 10:40

I agree with pp that you have to be realistic, you've had it really good for a decade - you've basically had the security and PAYE associated with a permanent job (which it probably should always have been legally) with the perks of being freelance too. That's not really fair on everyone else. The new director sounds savvy to be honest.

EleanorReally · 06/07/2025 10:39

i find it hard to believe that you dont seem to think twice about taking time off when you need to without consideration for your colleagues
it should be give and take
and i am surprised you have got away with this for 10 years.