To want to kill myself over bedtime

Mine sleeps on a floor mattress in my room or on my bed - never slept in a cot. Assuming yours sleeps in a cot for this to have worked

Yeah i mean thats half your problem. You have to teach them that you won't keep responding to all this shite at bedtime while they are still small/in a cot.

Do that pps approach but accept that foe the first two weeks you will be quietly returning him to bed 25 times until he gets the message he's to stay there. Make sure he gets plenty of attention before - bath, stories until he is calm and drowsy. Then go. He will cry because its a change but he will go to sleep and he will learn over a few weeks that he's safe in his bed & doesn't need you sat in the same room.

https://thesleepcharity.org.uk/information-support/children/childrens-sleep-ebook/

Where did I say there was shame in it?

I mean, or she could kill herself or have no more children? Why should paying for help be criticised? I couldn't teach my kids to swim so paid a swimming teacher. Why is there shame around paying for sleep training?

Some kids can. Some can't. My first dropped his nap at 20 months, by himself. After that, any sneaky naps would mean bedtime was 11pm or so.

His best friend still naps for an hour a day now, and she's 3.5. My son is in bed for 7:30, though, and she goes to bed at 9/9:30. They've got another friend who sleeps 10 - 9 but won't go to bed any earlier.

You have to go on your child.

As mother of five and grandmother of two I would advocate not engaging once they're supposed to be in bed. Each time they get up take them back to bed without saying a word. I used to sit at the top of the stairs. Make sure they have a drink, make sure they go for a wee. Then just rinse and repeat. It will take a while but once they realise they aren't getting attention, either positive or negative, it won't be worth their while. Also, cut the nap to one hour.
Ignore crying, ignore tantrums, just take them back to bed and leave the room. As many times as you need to. The time it takes will lessen until the behaviour stops. Oh and OP they will need their own room and a "big boys bed."

With the Supernanny technique, it’s really important that you don’t ’give in’ and communicate after you’ve gone through the ‘Bedtime, darling’ and ‘Bedtime’ stages.
Any communication beyond that point and you virtually have to start over.
Oh, and kids always become hyper/highly energised when they’re overtired!!

Well done on your brilliant progress! 👏
Keep up the good work 🩵 xx

You need to be more determined than them. Otherwise it’s long years of pain.

Both my kids are terrible sleepers, eldest didn't sleep through until 4.5 and youngest is 3.5 and still woke a couple of times last night. Neither go to bed and both wake ridiculously early.

I know it sounds stupid but I had to embrace it after it nearly broke me with my eldest. Assuming I'd be in it for the long haul I've structured everything so that it's as manageable as possible until they sleep better (or move out). My daughter sleeps on a double mattress on the floor and I join her. Both kids still take a longish time to go to sleep, but very strict on pyjamas, no lights except night lights, ladybird sleepy tales and lie down next to them in bed. Letting them sleep on me if needed. I plan for that time and use it as my wind down time. If I know I don't have it in me, I let them stay up and watch Julia Donaldson shows on iPlayer or cbeebies book at bedtime, this doesn't happen regularly, but I know it's there if I don't have the capacity to handle bedtime.

So did mine but your son is your son, my son is mine, and OP’s is hers. They’re all different and plenty of children have dropped naps altogether by 2 and a half. OP might need to try cutting the length of naps on the way to dropping them altogether. It is not bad advice to suggest this and see if it helps.

He's 2. He doesn't have to give up the nap. My sons 3 and still naps. Can nap 3/4hrs and still sleep fine on a night

I usually give up after about 400 attempts with my DD9. I think I managed it once.

Thats such good news. I came onto suggest just not engaging/speaking etc.
It’s just one of those hurdles you will get over and get your evenings back.

@Whathaveidoneeeeee Well done, sounds like it would have been very tough! Hopefully it will be short term pain for long term gain 🤞

I’m so happy to read this.

HRTWH

i only cracked it with number 3, when I realised he had a tired window at 6.00pm, so put him to bed then.
game changer!
but also probable it was his personality or just luck.

So true about their personalities. One of my friends always says that if she had her second one first she would never have had another! First one just settled at night and went to sleep, second was the complete opposite. I can remember looking after another friend's daughter one evening, did the bath, the story, sang a couple of songs and she just went to sleep! I was stunned, she is a teen now and is even keener on sleep these days

I completely understand your frustration. My eldest didn’t sleep through or settle before midnight until she was 5. She barely napped in the day either - just 10 mins now and then and only on me. I think you’re doing the best you can and hopefully this will pass.
I don’t know whether you’ve come across this book before, but it may provide a little light relief!
https://amzn.eu/d/j95aOHF

Read my thread from yesterday op. I completely understand you when posted your title. I’m sitting with this with a 9yo and 2.5yo. I live an utterly miserable life. I can’t wait for them to grow up. People just do not understand it who don’t have kids that are so incredibly needy.
we did the sleep training, gentle parenting, shouting and punishment, everything.
is your dc just only like this at bedtime?

I hope you're OK, OP. I have a 2 year old and I find it very hard too.

Some kids hold on to their nap til three but it's more usual that they're dropping it around this age, and given how long bedtime is taking I think in OP's case it's much more likely that her child is under-tired than over-tired. There isn't a huge amount of scientific backing for the idea of over-tiredness, whereas we know children need to have a certain amount of sleep pressure to fall asleep.

Of course every child is different and this might not be what works for OP but I think it's worth a try in her case.

I would cap it at 45 minutes or an hour and see if that helps. My son was a nightmare at bedtime for a while before he dropped his nap and then once it was gone it was so much better. He just didn't have enough sleep pressure to fall asleep quickly while he was still napping.

Supernanny is your friend OP. Her bedtime method worked for us. Bloody hard but if you stick at it, you will get there.
First time they come out of their room you say “ Bedtime darling” & take them back. Don’t say anything else.
Second time just say “ Bedtime”.
Third time don’t say anything.
Then you just keep taking them back. Don’t say anything. I think our record was over 50 times! But it’s so worth it for ( eventual) peaceful bedtimes & you get more of an evening. Obviously it’s different if your little one is poorly or something.

Look at his nap first. I don’t think a 2.5 year old needs more than 1-2 hours a day. By that age my DS had dropped his completely. Long bedtimes are often a sign of too much day sleep. Look at the timing of it too - he needs to build enough sleep pressure again before bed.

We have always had a strict bedtime routine. Bath at 6.15, out by 6.30 and then we let him run around naked for a bit (to let his last bit of energy out). By 6.45 it’s pjs on, milk, stories, cuddles and into bed. I sit and hold his hand and he’ll usually want to talk - I do this for a few mins then I just constantly say ‘it’s sleepy time now’ until he goes quiet. Then I leave him to it and he’s usually asleep within 10 mins.