To feel this way, as a woman?

Are you denying people with DSDs the right to name themselves, GreenGully? Intersex implies that they are between sexes. Some sort of third group. They are not. People with Differences in Sexual Development know exactly which sex they are, either female or male, even if their appearance is at all ambiguous, even if they appear not to be typically female or male.

It is quite amusing seeing the odd man out and about dressing in women’s clothes, wearing a wig and too much make up. Quite comedic. Obviously I feel sorry for them and their families.

Yes but they are still male or female not something in-between and don't want to be referred to as intersex

And having DSD means they are not typically male or female, that's just a fact.

No it means that they have a DSD and they have as a community repeatedly asked for people to stop using the misnomer of intersex and people did for decades (it went out of use at the same time as mongoloid and spastic in medical and common parlance) it is only since the rise of gender ideology that it has been resurrected against the wishes of the DSD community even after they specifically asked stonewall to stop using it or claiming to represent them.

You're being rather pedantic. Intersex people are not TYPICALLY male or female. That's what makes them intersex.

No they are either male or female with a Disorder of Sexual Development that always follows a set path depending on the DSD that they have.
There is not 3rd sex or in-between sex (which would be a 3rd sex).

Not a third sex no, but somewhere in between the two.

Intersex is considered a derogatory outdated term that DSD charities and the community have repeatedly asked not to be used.
I repeat no-one is intersex we are all male or female but a very small number of people will be born with a DSD this does not make them some 3rd sex or in-between the sexs. It's offensive nonsense pushed by stonewall et al

YANBU. Transwomen are not women. They are a different demographic with different needs from women. Conflating the two groups has resulted in harms to women and our rights.

Yawn

The definition of intersex: Intersex people are those born with any of several sex characteristics, including chromosome patterns, gonads, or genitals.

Hard agree. Women are not an idea in a man's head. As hard as it is to hear, there is a difference, and it's a big one. It's just so insulting to me that women as a group have been oppressed for thousands of years by men, assaulted, raped, killed over and over and over, walked over, controlled, belittled, threatened etc etc etc and men put on a dress and suddenly they are the most oppressed. Womanhood isn't something that can just be 'put on' or achieved by wearing a sparkly headband or a pink dress. And that in itself is insulting to me; that my femaleness can be reduced to a sexist stereotype of wearing a dress or a headband. Particularly as I live in trousers most of the time, shirts and baggy jeans!

I've nearly died in childbirth, I have endometriosis, my sister died of a female only type of cancer, I have been sexually assaulted numerous times, belittled at work, paid less than male counterparts, mocked, threatened, cat called, groped constantly (the first time when I was only 12). I don't walk alone in the dark, when I ever did I held my keys in my hand, I calculated routes, I always text my parents or friends when getting into taxis alone. And on and on. All these experiences have built into me my lived life as a woman. A man will never have this. I can't share spaces with them, the thought of my heavy flooding in a toilet with a man in the next cubicle, or in a changing room at a gym or pool getting undressed in front of them, or in sport. If I ever needed a single sex rape crisis (hopefully not!) or a counselling service, a man there, however he identified, would make me feel awful, I'd need to self exclude. This has all been happening to other women. It's now finally on the ordinary public's radar hence all the threads, but it is something that does need to be pushed back on.

I agree with you op, it's mad it's ended up like this, but women need their stuff back.

I believe anyone should be able to wear what they want as long they’re not exposing themselves, but wearing trousers doesn’t make you male and wearing a dress doesn’t make you female.

in answer to the “trans women are women” surely the reply is well no they’re not if they were they wouldn’t be trans ?

my dd has a friend from school who transitioned to “female” from 13/14 and was very feminine right from infant school. Thing is with all the men in toilets stuff, if dds friend was in the ladies/changing rooms/swimming pool with you, you would have absolutely no idea that they weren’t female, which is fine, and I have no problem with referring to her as a she as that’s what she appears to be. My problem is when a bloke with a penis still attached says he’s female and wants to use the ladies Eddie izzard

I don’t particularly agree with what dds friend has been able to do, but don’t know enough to judge, she seems less a person in wrong body and more a penis was attached to wrong body.

Zey/Zem. lol 😂

No-one is intersex there are a small number of people who have DSDs but they are all 1 sex or the other

Why can’t trans women have their own spaces

Because most of the time, it's a fetish. And knowing they're violating women's private spaces gets their dicks hard.

There's no thrill in having a third space. That's why when the World Aquatics created a separate category for transgender swimmers to compete, they had zero entrants.

You're missing the fact that the entire "transgender" narrative is basically a smokescreen to enable pervy men to get their end away by walking around in womanface and forcing women to go along with it. Some men have gone to the lengths of war to service their particular sexual desire. This is no different, people are just naive about it. All others who want us to pretend they are the opposite sex (e.g. young gay men and women) are all fodder to mask this fact.

In practice, the best way to treat "trans women" (abusive or frighteningly delusional men) is to greyrock.

I'm really over the whole thing to be honest. 'Transwomen' are men. End of.

The sarcastic posters policing the thread prove your point - it is still difficult to be honest about this. Either your view is transphobic (not had one yet, but it will come), or it is boring - in both cases you should pipe down and be quiet. Discussion is Not Welcome.

Please be welcome on FWR S&G board where much better brains than mine contribute daily insights on this topic.

Cogniyive psychology tells us that one of the reasons it is so hard to change minds (your own, or someone else's) is because of the undermining of personal identity in the process. Obviously this would be existential if you identify as trans, but even for those of us have always identified as liberal, kind, open-minded, the upheaval needed to see we were wrong about certain aspects of the liberal movement is dislocating. My own epiphany came from experience as an HCP with distressed gender-confused children and young people. I couldn't unsee the harm the medical /psych profession was doing in the name of kindness.

I have found it profoundly undermining and now question all of my norms - new or deeply held.

Just so you are warned about the further soul-searching you might find yourself making now the scales have fallen!

I’ve always wanted to share my opinion and view but never feel clever enough (especially as people who even agree with you OP are giving you snarky remarks about sharing your opinion) or informed enough, and of course absolutly terrified of any backlash!
But, like you OP, I’m just getting to grips with how I feel and it’s been unfolding for a good few years and I’m still not 100% sure. I think it’s good for those of us who aren’t confident in our views yet, and are still getting to grips with them, to be able to speak out too and not just the bolshy confident ones.

I always thought I was extremely liberal, would spend my 20’s with a gay club in a big city as my regular haunt every night of the weekend, friends with both just social cross-dressers and people who identified as trans. I didn’t care one jot about sharing the unisex toilets there, would take anyone at face value for who they wanted to be, call them any name/pronoun they wanted and genuinely supported everyone. Would stand up and shout loudly in my support for people to be who they wanted to be.
however, on the other hand I was raised by a strong feminist and started to notice that although I was accepting of everyone else identifying as who they wanted to be, and being called whatever they wanted to be called; I, as a woman, was not granted the same respect/privilege anymore.

It started with feeling ‘ o actually I don’t want to be identified as a cis-woman, I’m just a woman’ but too scared to offend anyone to say anything.

Then j.k Rowling put her head above the parapet and spoke in defence of women, and at first I was outraged. I actually had only heard second-hand about what she was saying, and everyone said she was transphobic and I found that outrageous as it felt so wrong and far from how I felt. I lazily echoed false statements that people told me without question, I had adored Harry Potter as a child and I was swept up for a moment in the narrative that she was a terrible terrible person with the worst views!
Until my mum asked me to tell her specifically what J.K Rowling said that offended me. I realised I hadn’t actually read any of the ‘tweets’ and I had a general idea based on what others had told me. Of course, when I actually read J.K Rowlings opinions, I couldn’t actually pin point anything that I found that I hugely disagreed with.

I also found a lot of the trans movement seemed to reinforce dated gender stereotypes that I just don’t agree with, and also affected my lesbian friends specifically. For one example that they are transphobic if they don’t want to have sex/relationship with a transwoman. As a straight women, I can’t imagine that I would ever be attracted to a trans man, and surely that is my personal right.

I then realised that just because I am mostly comfortable sharing a toilet with a trans women, I do not speak for all women and how dare I disregard other women’s experiences just because I don’t personally care.

I’m still trying to figure out what solution I actually champion, and where i sit. At the moment I’m still trying to get to the bottom of how I feel and what I believe as I’m still conflicted on a lot of areas.
I’m still too afraid to speak out as scared of being labeled a transphobe.
On an individual level I still feel that I would like someone to be who they want to be, and live life how they want to, but i also cant get my head around the basic science of sex is not changeable. On a dna level you can’t chose to change your sex.

I hope, and I do feel, like ever so slowly the tides are changing and more people are starting to think more about what this all actually means for women going forwards, and starting to form their own thoughtful, nuanced opinions. I certainly will keep trying to unpack my own opinions as I still have a lot of grey areas where I’m just not sure how I feel.

Plenty of bio women will never know what it is like to bear children. But I take your point

There are men, women and a miniscule number of intersex people.

Anything else is mental illness.

What a controversial and brave opinion to share on this message board. Never heard that before. Wow.