To think DD should get place at nursery over children deferring reception?

Out of interest how did your d. Cope with repeating twice? Did they complete year 13 and go to uni? How did they explain the repeats. Were unis sympathetic and accepting?

I think the whole deferring places trend is a bit ridiculous. Many (not all) parents are misusing it to give their kid some kind of advantage.

@Namechangerage DGS is a summer born boy. By Easter in nursery, he was a year behind where DGD was at the same age. He couldn’t even hold a pencil, never mind drawing or writing. His parents and I tried to get him to hold a pencil and he just refused! ALL he wanted to do was play with his cars. He would play with Duplo revolving around cars; but he didn’t want to do anything else. Frankly, we find it hard to have a conversation with him, because we don’t know the first thing about Hot Wheels!

There was no way, he was ready to go into Reception last September. The school advised he stay in nursery for another year. He is now going into Reception this September. I read his nursery report this week, and while he mainly plays with cars, they have got him onto playing with sand and toy animals. He’s achieving age appropriately.

As more children are deferring, it will be interesting to see how things like age group sport (currently, deferred children may have to play competitive sport in their ‘true’ year group above a certain level) and 11+ (currently, in some areas at least, only allowed to be taken by older children - ie those who are deferred - by exception) pan out. It seems quite likely that there will be a move from invested parents to make sure their child is ‘as old as is allowed’ in these competitive scenarios. I agree that late summer borns, especially boys. from disadvantaged backgrounds will become very much ‘developmental outliers’ in school cohorts, to their educational and social detriment.

@NchangeoThey are too young to start school but that disadvantage stays with them throughout life, even beyond school, summer borns are statistically less likely to be successful in their jobs, more likely to go to Prison, more likely to commit suicide. The list is pretty extensive. It is not a matter of them being at a disadvantage for a couple of years and then catching up. The government allows deferral because it can make such a significant impact. A couple of people have mentioned that I seem to defensive and I would just clarify that this has nothing to do with my own decisions for my DC. I know 100% that I have done the best thing by my child. I do however feel quite passionate about this topic and feel the need to advocate on these frequent threads where so much misinformation is given.

See that’s not adding up with what you and others are saying about them being too young to start school. If the issue is the gcse year being at the wrong age. Then fair enough. Move that test to another time.

Thats exactly the reason btw that the people I know are deferring. It’s got nothing to do with not being ready for school. Most are in 8-6 nursery prep currently. It’s to do with the grammar 11+ being year group marked not age marked. I am hoping the grammars/ gov clock onto this and change it by the time we get there. They have already in some counties. Hoping same with gcse/ a level results.

As I said, if that’s what your child (and others) needs, fair enough. Lots do well having not deferred, and vice versa. There’s no need to be so defensive about it.

@NchangeoYou're absolutely right the issue isn’t really about reception as that’s very play based. It’s as they move further up the school that research shows that they start to really struggle. Summer borns will be sitting their GCSES a year earlier and dealing with all the teenage drama at a younger age. My own DH who was very successful at school and now in work, is an august born and he ended up repeating y12 twice. I have no evidence for this but I wouldn’t be surprised if the statistics are much higher for summerborms dropping out in sixth form or repeating a year.

My son's best friend was born at the end of August. He said the biggest issue for him was he couldn't socialise in clubs and pubs during year 13 so his first experience was when he was with new people far from home which sort of messed up some of his first year at uni. I thought that was an interesting point of view.

Actually April-born! Children can be deferred if they were born as early as 1 April.

I am not buying that. I don’t know whether my son has just gone to a really advanced nursery/ prep or the school is very free-play based. But there is little difference between his prep and his reception. It gets more structured once you hit year 1 but there is lots of free library and interest time, and no homework even up to yr 6. I don’t believe he’s too young to start. I do believe that the only disadvantage he will face is being the youngest. Perhaps we have been lucky with our school/ nursery here.

@Firefliesaremagichas responded to this before I could. That being said, on an individual basis, I can't change the age at which compulsory education starts for all children in this country. I would if I could! I can't even change the age at which my own child starts compulsory education. The only thing that I COULD do about it was at least ensure they didn't need to start an entire academic year earlier, so that's what I did. Is it 'the answer' on a wider level for all children, no, of course not. But it's all I could do for my own child, so I took it, as I didn't want them to be at the (statistical) disadvantage that reams of evidence shows they would have been at otherwise.

As @LegoHouse274has said the point is that children who start school at just turned 4 are at a disadvantage because of how young they are. Presumably the research supports the fact that this disadvantage is less for those born in March, who will be 4.5 when they start. There is a reason why the government has limited the ability to defer to summer borns.

Okay, March born children then?

You can defer April and May born children. Anyone born in the summer term I.e after the Easter holidays.

It’s not really about the academic side. My DC would have been fine in the year above from this perspective. It’s about emotional maturity which feeds into positive mental health outcomes in the future

But what changes between April and May? Surely April kids are still too young to be in reception? I actually agree with you that kids go to school too young in this country. But I’m not sure deferring summer borns is the answer…

I will agree with your point about it tending to be educate and engaged parents who defer. The ones who have actually done the research and can see what a disadvantage being summer born will be for their child. Where as actually it is probably often the case that children from more disadvantaged backgrounds would benefit even more from a defferal. This is why I always comment on these threads. People spread so much misinformation and there are many who don’t even know it’s an option. Anyone can do it. This should be spelt out to all parents.

@Nchangeowhat you are saying is not grounded in logic or fact. You offer nothing to support your argument. In many many countries ( including Australia and Scotland) defferal is very normal . They seem to manage without any difficulties. The situation you’re describing is not the reality of what actually happens

You're completely missing the point. It's not being the youngest that causes the extent of the disadvantage, it's the too young school starting age!

You can’t or won’t read what I am saying.

Do you think it’s the magic sun woo that makes summer kids disadvantaged or being the youngest. If the latter obviously that moves depending on whether deferral becomes the norm; especially for normal spring borns. It’s turning something entirely simple into some odd version of parental game theory.

I don’t blame parents for deferring summer born children. But the situation it creates is difficult, especially as it’s not an automatic thing and therefore easier to access for DC with engaged, educated parents. There is 15 months age difference between the oldest and youngest in DC1s class. The girl who turned 6 at the end of May is very different to the boys who don’t turn 5 until August. I’m not sure what the answer is though, as some DC do need the option of deferral, so I wouldn’t want to see it banned.

I would be annoyed in your situation too OP.

I think it all depends on the individual child. DGD is an autumn birthday, one of the oldest in her year but has ADHD and is at least 2 years behind academically and emotionally so no advantage to her for being one of the oldest. If she had been born a week earlier and thus in the year before hers then she might well have needed to be deferred though. Her little brother is a summer born, not deferred and doing absolutely fine. In fact he is further ahead than either of my own DC were at the same age purely due to the fact he is at school and learning whilst they didn't start school until age 5 back in the day. Each parent just has to make a judgement call based on the child they actually have.

@NchangeoI would argue that it is literal common sense that we don’t sent tiny 4 year old children to school.
How would you explain the numerous studies that have shown that summer born children are at a disadvantage and the fact that deferral and starting school as late as 7 is commonplace in other countries?

I don’t need any knowledge for this. It’s literal common sense reasoning. If it becomes the norm to defer (as you a suggesting we are moving to), then there is no advantage anymore. Only disadvantage for those who would have actually needed to defer; ie those with serious difficulties.

And so we are not there yet; we are currently going through this weird period of flux. Where the curriculum is not correct for age, years have all mixed up ages. And then how do we solve the problem of those with difficulties; in how ever many years they reintroduce laws to ‘double defer’ for people who actually need it?

Honestly it’s nonsense. Some people do need to defer and I accept that. But it’s not the people I know. There kids are fine.

@Nchangeo

What are you basing your knowledge on?
How do you define what you’re supposed to be doing? Deferring is allowed and very easy to sort out .
You clearly have complete blind faith in our government if you think that following what your “ supposed to do” is in your best advantage
The UK starts school earlier than almost any other country in the world. It is also very normal to defer in most other countries, becoming more normal here too as you’ve stated