HR rejected grievance I made against Colleague

Bump to my comment above.

If the male colleague concerned had declared a ND condition that he wished to be known only to the HR department and one of his declared conditions was a lack of filter when it came interactive verbal speech, there would be very little the HR department could do other than remind him that this was felt by the recipient that the comment was inappropriate, record it and keep speaking to him about what is acceptable. (HR professionals please correct me if this is not correct).

With so many people now declaring ND conditions and employers legally expected to make allowances and support them in the workplace and with employers legally expected to protect their employees from unwanted comments / employees feeling sexually verbally attacked it is going to be very, very difficult going forward for Businesses /HR departments.

hahaha... many many people i know wouldn't and don't talk like that but it's very common slang in Scotland. i'm sure most adults have heard the expression pumped and dumped.

I’m sorry you are upset OP.

Is the male colleague ND?

I have a colleague who left to his own devices has no filter with his language and has made inappropriate comments in the past as he doesn’t fully understand what he is saying or how it could misinterpreted.

We work hard to keep his comments appropriate (and we also have a duty of care to support him in the workplace and to make the necessary reasonable adjustments to support him in the workplace). He can do the job we need him to do just fine. He just doesn’t think sometimes before opening his mouth.

Honestly it’s a nightmare managing teams in todays workplace.

Maybe it was the way he said it but, on the face of it, it’s a stretch to see sexual innuendo in “getting her lips pumped”

We must move in different circles. People I know and associate with just don't talk like that.

I'm surprised that you think everyone does, especially as a significant number of posters also don't either.

The fact the colleague has form for this and answered on behalf of OP even though Q was not directed at him so he must have been pretty fast and so desperate to reply and the way that he termed it is clear innuendo wordplay for for vaginal (lips) intercourse (pumped).

However, yes technically that it was OP was having done but in the context of how it was said you can see why OP had an issue with it.

But I also see HR pov and he could argue nothing was meant by it so it’s difficult to be shocked by the outcome because of that.

I don't think it was meant with sexual overtures either.
I think he was simply stating that you were getting your lips done...and they do get 'pumped up'. I might describe it that way myself tbh as I have a couple of colleagues who have this procedure done. It's the sort of thing I would say about it.

It's not sexual harassment by my standards.

😂No wonder it hasn't been taken any further! He literally just said the reason you had a booked a day off!!!

Jesus fucking Christ....

I’m shocked at how many people don’t see the potential for this as a sexual comment. It’s depressing actually, because when I was young women had to endure this stuff routinely and the reason it happens less is because people (women) bravely stood up against it. That doesn’t mean there aren’t still creeps who like to push their luck.

As a PP said, the way men talk about women when they think they are unheard is sobering. And that is in professional environments. I have never heard a man pull another one up for a crude or lascivious comment even if they wouldn’t make it themselves.

In this instance it would be difficult to prove but I would expect HR to ask around to see if anyone else felt the same about the comment in the context it was made.

edited for typo

Apologies, reading back it’s probably difficult to comment without the context.

Basically - I had a random day off and one of the things I was doing was getting my lip filler topped up. Most of my colleagues knew this. Another colleague asked me what I was doing with my day off (in ear shot of the colleague I complained about) and he said ‘she’s getting her lips pumped’.

He is the oldest member on the team and makes inappropriate jokes most days which people pass off as ‘that’s just X being X’. He knew exactly what he was doing making that comment.

This is certified bollocks.

Comments like these are misogynist and create a hostile environment for female employees.

In this instance the innuendo is clear - this man is suggesting that your lips (mouth) or more likely your genital lips will be inflamed by sexual activity.

I'd advise you to go back to HR using these terms:

"John Smith's comment suggested that during my time off my lips or, more likely, my genital labia would be inflamed in a manner which calls to mind sexual activity.

There is a history of similar comments by John Smith.

Severally and in combination, these comments create a hostile environment for female employees.

In failing to address this complaint, [Company Name] are choosing to allow this hostile environment to continue. "

As a general rule, raising a formal grievance about things like this will definitely change the culture, because organisations are very wary of having a paper trail like this.

Please, destroy these motherfuckers.

Ugh what a creep. I hope the investigation means he will realise people are on to him even if he kept it just ambiguous enough to persuade HR

Unfortunately you picked the wrong comment to take a stand against OP.

I immediately understood what he meant

Something you hear quite often in relation to evidence being given/collected is a phrase along the lines of "You cannot tell me what (person) thought/meant".

You simply do not have that ability. You are referring to your own conclusion/interpretation of information. There may be all manner of context/additional information that leads you to draw your conclusion. However you cannot claim to understand what someone other than yourself thought or meant for the purpose of evidence.

Here you have zero context/information. Based on your own prejudices, experiences etc, you have assumed what he meant. You might be right or you might not; the point is you cannot claim to understand what another person meant by language that is clearly - based on the responses here alone - open to interpretation.

This is certified bollocks.

Comments like these are misogynist and create a hostile environment for female employees.

In this instance the innuendo is clear - this man is suggesting that your lips (mouth) or more likely your genital lips will be inflamed by sexual activity.

I'd advise you to go back to HR using these terms:

"John Smith's comment suggested that during my time off my lips or, more likely, my genital labia would be inflamed in a manner which calls to mind sexual activity.

There is a history of similar comments by John Smith.

Severally and in combination, these comments create a hostile environment for female employees.

In failing to address this complaint, [Company Name] are choosing to allow this hostile environment to continue. "

As a general rule, raising a formal grievance about things like this will definitely change the culture, because organisations are very wary of having a paper trail like this.

Please, destroy these motherfuckers.

Apologies, reading back it’s probably difficult to comment without the context.

Basically - I had a random day off and one of the things I was doing was getting my lip filler topped up. Most of my colleagues knew this. Another colleague asked me what I was doing with my day off (in ear shot of the colleague I complained about) and he said ‘she’s getting her lips pumped’.

He is the oldest member on the team and makes inappropriate jokes most days which people pass off as ‘that’s just X being X’. He knew exactly what he was doing making that comment.