To think that primary schools are sending a really shitty message to well behaved kids

I personally think it’s worth letting teacher know she was in tears and feels invisible. It’s horrible to feel that way.
Yes you can praise her at home and tell her the certificates are a way to try to bribe the naughty ones but school should be recognising she’s constantly trying her best and just getting on with things (sometimes in a difficult or disruptive environment)
Dies she do extra curriculars? I’m a volunteer guide leader. We have a wide range of girls but some join as they aren’t having easy time at school. I really try to praise and give 1-1 attention which is easier outside a school setting.

God there's a lot of vitriol on here which makes for unpleasant reading. I don't think labelling kids as "little shits, naughty kids" is helpful. Ideally all kids should get an acknowledgement for a strength in the year and I don't think it has to be merit based - academic. Given how many kids seem to have additional needs now, they may be rewarded from something you take for granted that your child can do standing on their head. I think some compassion is needed here. But I do agree it should be fair and everyone in the class receives something. That's the problem with UK state schools now - class sizes are too big, resources are low, and a huge rise in SEN kids without sufficient support. I'm not sure anyone is benefitting.

@usedtobeaylis in my experience, of the numerous schools I have worked in, and from my own children's schools this is the case. All are encouraged to work hard and do well. All children regardless of their starting points, are encouraged to push themselves beyond what is expected. This thread wasn't about schools pushing students to achieve or praising or recognising those that do. It was about children ( primary aged) being upset that they didn't get a certificate when others do. And I can understand a child's naive and innocent perception of this. But ultimately, it is down to parental conversations and engagement with their child regarding expectations around certificates.

I agree with you that it is not fair.
My DS has achieved these based on small Improvements as a younger child. It definitely benefitted him but wasn’t fair other children, now he has impeccable behaviour and never gets the reward.
I hope your DD feels better soon.

yanbu

Depends on the school. Some are rubbish and always reward the same kids or the naughty ones. My dc school regularly gives them all merits for various achievements not just academic, and everybody seems to get a chance even the average well behaved kids.

I agree with all you have said. As a child I was never rewarded anywhere near as much as others, who seemed to have a natural flair and talent for everything they did, whereas I had to keep on trying and trying, will very little gain.

I admit that being the 1980s the concept of rewarding the "bad kids" for any improvement they made was absolutely not a thing, but I will say it's important that you teach your daughter to focus on her own issues of not being rewarded, than looking to others and deciding they shouldn't have been rewarded at all even if everyone knows and can see they don't bloody deserve it. Far better that she tries to make sense of her own situation.

Why is it a choice though? Why can't you meet ALL children where they are?

@coolbreezes I never said that children are or should be rewarded for poor behaviour or poor choices.Read the thread. But supporting or encouraging children, who struggle to make correct choices by a reward system, can have really positive impacts. It may absolutely impact their adult lives, making the difference between children growing up to be functioning members of adult society or children and young people becoming involved in criminality and suffering. Have you read the statistics about young people who are permanently excluded from school and the correlation of those same children ending up in prison? Or young people who are in care that end up in prison? So yeah, I'm all for rewarding those kids when they get it right.

I think this varies per school. My children were academic -rarely got any mention or awards. It was as if the school took the view - we don’t need to bother with you as you get the good results without much effort from us and it frees us up to deal with the ones who need more attention.

I had to explain to them the certificate assembly was not there for kids like them, it was used a motivational tool which they didn’t need. They still felt left out as clearly they were kids and wanted the occasional pat on the back.

. Even when they left the primary school, neither for the top awards in year 6. My son was the only one who played a few instruments and the only one who really partook in music lessons as a result but they didn’t even give him the music prize. It was given to a girl who had improved during the year and liked to sing. He was gutted.

i do however, empathise with teachers having to manage these situations.

Because they are achieving what is expected, and they are doing the right thing and doing it to the best of their abilities.

They're children though. And they do thrive with praise. Seeing other children continually getting that praise for, as someone articulated really well, achieving things that they are also achieving but not being recognised for can be crushing. They're just kids. They didn't implement the reward system. But they're a part of it whether they like it or not, and it turns out an invisible part of it.

@ClareBlue
All children are recognised for their achievements: verbal praise, marked work and feedback, stickers etc. I gave numerous examples above of how all schools both Primary and Secondary recognise achievement for all, and not just for 'high flyers' day to day, which you have conveniently ignored. Again, a child that is turning up every day and doing what is expected is great. But this is what is expected. I don't see how a certificate to award doing the expected is necessary.Like I said earlier, it completely negates the significance of a certificate. If a child comes home sad about not getting the star of the week etc but X child did because they are usually naughty/ struggle etc. Then surely that's an opportunity to have a parental conversation about it : 'X really struggles and they have had a brilliant week so that needs to be recognised! They find that really hard. You find doing that quite easy so it wouldn't be special for you to get a certificate for that. You get certificates when you do something super special such as swimming 10 metres etc. You've worked really hard this year at school and done as is expected therefore xyz...' I can understand how all parents want recognition for their children. But this is done day to day. Surely you can see the logic that for all children to be given certificates makes it rather pointless?

Isn't school also supposed to encourage a good work ethic? Isn't it supposed to encourage all students? It's already been addressed on the thread that assuming average children have no other issues or struggles is a useless bias.

Edit; Ugh. Apologies for mistakenly quoting the top post.

This isn't just a recent thing. It started in the 80s when schools took on the idea that self esteem was more important than behaviour or grades. They started rewarding kids for doing the bare minimum of what they were expected to do. IMO it's been a disaster and explains why so many young people are so reactive to normal stress and need a "safe space" where they are free from all criticism and discomfort.
Some of the blame should go to the coddling parents who don't want their little darlings to even be disciplined. They had an influence on these policies.
So YANBU.

Do you really think that? That it's fine for children to be rewarded more for bad behaviour?

Yet that's not how the real world works? If someone is naughty most days at work they get sacked,.they don't get a pay rise on the days they behave

So you only want to ready well behaved children for the "real world" ?

I got moved up because I was finding school too easy, so did DH (different years and different parts of the country)

He didn't mind it too much but socially I found it hard (I was a summer baby anyway) and the work was still too easy so it didn't achieve much. In the end I went to private school until I could start at a very good state grammar.

Because what children feel and perceive is important to their development. It's different as an adult. Can you genuinely not see that an 11 year old seeing those that don't following the rules getting all the recognition is not going to think, oh, that's fine because my parents praise me, and I have a clear understanding of social inequalities, so it's fine nobody ever says I have achieved an award. In fact it great because it is setting me up for life, or at least to be a shit teacher.

Do you read your students work as accurately as you read my post before making comment.
I said 'sense of injustice' I.E. what children feel. I didn't say it was an injustice. Your rationale for your post is depressing.

@Ladychatterly86 thuis is not about highflyers. The post is about those that abide by all rules and do their best but aren't top and aren't bottom. They are not going to fly through education. They are working to be as good as they can. It's not their fault that their education is disrupted by others or resources focused on a minority. But to embed an attitude that they don't need recognition is shit, tbh.

@ClareBlue
I feel 'injustice' is quite a powerful statement to make about a kid at school getting or not getting a certificate. For the majority of working people we go into our jobs and may get occasional thanks or get recognised for something particularly great. For many people working they may not even get that. That's the reality of our society. Surely the important thing is instilling work ethic, resilience and compassion and empathy in children? These things don't need a certificate for most children. But for some children, getting a certificate or recognition for this could be life changing. Why deny this? Or worse, why complain about others getting this recognition?

And I feel the teachers attitude that is posted above is ingrained in culture of education now. If you follow rules, don't disrupt anyone and try as hard as you can, then so what we won't recognise it because you should be grateful that you aren't disturbing everyone else's education and haven't come to the attention of your teacher or need interventions. Get you recognition at home, you're not getting it at school. Though the school couldn't actually function if it wasn't for students like you. But hey, we are not going to recognise that. Get it at home and be grateful.

I agree with you op, I have the same with my lovely but very quiet ds. I used to be a teacher so I know how hard it is to recognise all pupils but seeing from the other side is heartbreaking, seeing them get crushed every week but knowing that you can't say anything to the school as then you'll be 'that parent'.

It's not reasonable to expect children to except all recognition to go to those with challenges and just be grateful and suck it up. That's a really shit attitude and post and has made me really pissr off for all those children who follow the rules and try their best and distrupt nobody.