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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Was I unreasonable to say no?

256 replies

Thefourth · 22/06/2025 15:20

Christmas allocation was sent out last week. We have to have it so early because we need to plan the out reach around it. For first time in 5 years I have Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, Boxing Day & NYD off. Im Working nye. We’re going to go away. We dont have children but that’s because I’m infertile it’s not because we don’t want them.

Usually I pick up extra but this year I thought fuck it, no I want to have it all off. So I requested it off and in the comments I pointed out I have covered their Christmas shifts & done my own for 5 years.

I have been massively guilty of tripped by 3 colleagues who have said I must pick up their Christmas shifts because they have children and I don’t. One of them said that I was deceitful by not telling them I wanted it all off because as she assumed I would cover it all she hadn’t asked for any of it off.

Another one has gone to our manager and demanded that he make me work it and give them my days off. He asked me to consider taking some of their shifts and I said if he asks me again I will quit.

For the last 5 years I have had off the 29th-30th December and then take my ‘Christmas leave’ in January.

Their children are 11,5,9,15,18 & 21 respectively if it changes anyone’s opinion.

the atmosphere is awful

OP posts:
Somewhat81 · 22/06/2025 17:48

RareGoalsVerge · 22/06/2025 17:21

There are 8 million unique mumsnet users each month.

If 95% of humans are entirely reasonable every day, 4% of humans are unreasonable on average once a month and 1% of humans are unreasonable more frequently - say once a week on average (there might be some who are unreasonable once a day or more but for the purpose of the maths I shall assume only 4 incidents per month - then each month about 66% of those 8 million mumsnetters will have zero incidents of people who are important in their lives being totally unreasonable about 26% might have one or two incidents of someone being unreasonable and 8% will be dealing with more frequent unreasonablness.

It's entirely possible that you are lucky enough to be in the 66% where all the people whose reasonableness or otherwise could majorly impact your life are ok. That's great.

If only 10% of the remainder make a mumsnet thread about the top most-irritating incident that happen to them in a month, and the other 90% don't bother, we would have about 9000 new threads about irritating and unreasonable people every day.

I believe the real total of threads per day about irritating and unreasonable people is a lot less than this, and the actual statistics for how frequently people are irritating and unreasonable is probably higher than this, so it must follow that actually mumsnetters on the whole are pretty tolerant and only make threads about the irritating and unreasonable people in their lives a lot less frequently than for 10% of the irritating and unreasonable incidents.

You gave that so much time and effort. I admit to not reading beyond paragraph 1 but still ❤️ the effort! ❤️

PopeJoan2 · 22/06/2025 17:47

Hankunamatata · 22/06/2025 16:36

I don't need to 'read the room' yes co workers being unreasonable but wouldnt have killed op to say I'm not doing overtime shifts this year.

Her job did not entail covering every year she just fell into doing so. She did not have to tell anyone.

PopeJoan2 · 22/06/2025 17:45

As someone who does not have children I am very familiar with this scenario. Stand your ground. You are entitled to this and do not quit your job if your manger asks again. Just stand firm. We are all behind you.

Somewhat81 · 22/06/2025 17:45

Rosscameasdoody · 22/06/2025 17:09

No it isn’t. The colleagues are basically saying OP should work at Christmas because she doesn’t have children and they do. The fact that OP can’t have children puts into context the fact that it’s not always a choice and they’re being insensitive as well as off the scale entitled.

Edited

Dear god

my point is that irrespective of ANY reason… the Op is entitled to have off Christmas and new year. Even if she wants to sit on her bum and eat pot noodles and avoid anything and everything Christmas related

Lotsofsnacks · 22/06/2025 17:43

Get a new job op. Not every workplace is like this over Xmas shifts, most people accept they need to take it in turns. Anyway as you will be leaving (hopefully!), they may have to work it anyway!

Daisy12Maisie · 22/06/2025 17:42

I work Christmas every other year whilst my teens to to their dads. If/ when they choose not to spend Christmas with me in the future I would always work shifts to cover Christmas those days for other people. It’s really rubbish missing out on the limited Christmases with young children eg primary age. I missed more than 50% so will always cover when I can for people with primary aged children at home.
But that is my choice. You aren’t obligated to cover for other people. I have never got special consideration at christmas just because I had children and only had them every other Christmas.
We always had a pretend Christmas a few days early on the years I didn’t get to spend Christmas with my kids. No Santa but everything else. So if they are missing actual Christmas they can do that. My extended family got involved as well so my whole family would celebrate Christmas on a random day in December. Then i worked over Christmas, the kids went to their dads and that was that.

So once the kids don’t believe in Santa they can celebrate on any day in December. It is a made up day.

ChocolateCinderToffee · 22/06/2025 17:41

YANBU and you also have a crap manager problem. I would make notes of what is said to you, when and by whom, and if the situation continues make a formal complaint.

GonnaeNoDaeThatJustGonnaeNo · 22/06/2025 17:38

They are being arseholes for behaving like this towards you.

stand your ground and don’t feel guilty.

Tulipvase · 22/06/2025 17:37

I’m not sure what the answer is really. I work in a school so it isn’t an issue for me. My husband is a team manager for a local government dept that has to have some cover over Christmas etc but there are OOH depts too.

They organise it by everyone putting in their request a few weeks in advance and then they allocate who gets what. Generally they try and share the pain. I think it’s fairer than first come first served but appreciate it’s an extra job someone has to manage.

Theroadt · 22/06/2025 17:36

Swiftie1878 · 22/06/2025 15:37

Same. But I know I’ve been lucky and/or wise about the people I allow into my sphere!
All of this stuff exists. Be grateful you haven’t had to deal with it rather than scornful of those who have.

Agreed - it hardly helped OP inher dilemma, did it

WearyAuldWumman · 22/06/2025 17:35

@SerendipityJane I did seek union advice but to no avail. At one point, there was an expectation - unbelievable though this sounds - that I would even write the reports for the Mother-of-Four.

I don't know the precise details, but it turned out that Mrs X had previously threatened the LA with legal action for failing to return her to her previous post after her fourth maternity leave. (My understanding is that there was a dispute as to whether she was entitled to a job in the same area at the same level or whether it had to be the same position in her old school.)

It was presented to me as "...and Mrs X will not be writing reports." There were two deputes in my classroom when this was dropped on me. (To be fair, they were doing the bidding of our HT - a father of five...)

At this point, I smiled sweetly and asked who was going to be writing her reports in that case? I vaguely recall referring to the amount of time for reports included within the Working Time Agreement. (As a PTC, I was supposed to have fewer reports to write than a classroom teacher, but I was also expected to check all the reports for my faculty.)

In the end, one of the deputes did them together with the Mother-of-Four. That was the only battle that I won.

As for the business of other members of staff getting time off for nativity plays and other primary school related activities - "First Day of Primary School" was one that one father had four times - that was something that I was aware of throughout my teaching career. These days off weren't official - they were all in the gift of the HT. As suggest, there's nothing to be done when it's not in writing. It doesn't sound like a lot, but it all adds up.

Something that staff were entitled to by law: if a mother had given birth during a holiday period, then there was an entitlement to take the missed maternity/paternity leave during term time.

The LA was supposed to buy in cover for that. In actuality, the school just assigned other staff to cover the classes. I recall being on my knees one time trying to keep on top of everything and then being given cover classes for someone in my faculty who had given birth during the holidays and was taking her 'missed holiday' in Tenerife during term time.

Another time, I finished up covering a couple of PE lessons (not my faculty) because a father was off on holiday with his wife and two children. Again, the second child had been born during a holiday period and the law allowed the father to have time off.

We did ask the union about the fact that the LA was forcing in-house staff to cover, but were told that nothing could be done to make the LA buy in supply staff.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 22/06/2025 17:35

SockFluffInTheBath · 22/06/2025 16:20

If you’re still there come Christmas you need a cast iron alibi ready for being unavailable to cover them all ringing in sick.

I agree with the PP that OP doesn't need an alibi now she's booked it, but since their manager's flaccid enough to have asked her to cover to get this off their back it wouldn't hurt

At least then, if they do all call in sick - which wouldn't surprise me at all - they'll know who to blame

Whaleandsnail6 · 22/06/2025 17:33

Stand your ground.

Everyone is as entitled as anyone else to have time off over Christmas and new year whatever the circumstances.

If you wanted to spend the days gazing out of the window or watching paint dry, it wouldnt matter...you have worked previous Christmas so its now your turn to have the days off.

I say that as a nurse who has done every other Christmas/new year alternated for the past 15 years

Firmly tell them once more if they ask, that you have plans and will not be changing your plans under any circumstances (especially now they have acted like they have!)

Tell them that if spending Christmas with their kids is so important, over putting food on the table and paying bills for their precious kids, they could always quit their jobs as that is the only way to guarantee time off if you work in an industry that needs cover over Christmas and new year

Daleksatemyshed · 22/06/2025 17:33

A pp had this right, you've worked Christmas every year for five years and they're not the least bit grateful, they felt entitled, not grateful. Go somewhere lovely for Christmas Op because at least one of them will call in at Christmas and say they're ill and your manager will ask you to cover for them, make sure your not available

Puzzledandpissedoff · 22/06/2025 17:29

Usually I pick up extra but this year I thought fuck it, no I want to have it all off. So I requested it off and in the comments I pointed out I have covered their Christmas shifts & done my own for 5 years

Gently, OP, it was probably a mistake to have done so much already; as you're finding out it's rarely appreciated and the whine about "I'd be inclined to give soooo much more if they'd just help out a bit" is being shown for the lie it often is

Very obviously you mustn't back down, and if they don't like it they can look for other jobs where their petulance might be pandered to - though actually they're just as likely to come up against the increasing number of employers who avoid those with caring responsibilities at all costs

godmum56 · 22/06/2025 17:27

Thefourth · 22/06/2025 15:23

I have! They were all sat there bitching about how I ruined Christmas on Friday 🤣

well they can fuck right off and keep fucking off till after christmas

Enough4me · 22/06/2025 17:26

RareGoalsVerge · 22/06/2025 17:21

There are 8 million unique mumsnet users each month.

If 95% of humans are entirely reasonable every day, 4% of humans are unreasonable on average once a month and 1% of humans are unreasonable more frequently - say once a week on average (there might be some who are unreasonable once a day or more but for the purpose of the maths I shall assume only 4 incidents per month - then each month about 66% of those 8 million mumsnetters will have zero incidents of people who are important in their lives being totally unreasonable about 26% might have one or two incidents of someone being unreasonable and 8% will be dealing with more frequent unreasonablness.

It's entirely possible that you are lucky enough to be in the 66% where all the people whose reasonableness or otherwise could majorly impact your life are ok. That's great.

If only 10% of the remainder make a mumsnet thread about the top most-irritating incident that happen to them in a month, and the other 90% don't bother, we would have about 9000 new threads about irritating and unreasonable people every day.

I believe the real total of threads per day about irritating and unreasonable people is a lot less than this, and the actual statistics for how frequently people are irritating and unreasonable is probably higher than this, so it must follow that actually mumsnetters on the whole are pretty tolerant and only make threads about the irritating and unreasonable people in their lives a lot less frequently than for 10% of the irritating and unreasonable incidents.

Agreed. Over time every day is a new opportunity to encounter a dickhead.
Over my lifetime of near 5 decades, I can recall many dickheads.

grumpygrape · 22/06/2025 17:25

Hankunamatata · 22/06/2025 16:36

I don't need to 'read the room' yes co workers being unreasonable but wouldnt have killed op to say I'm not doing overtime shifts this year.

But she didn’t know her shifts until a few days ago so didn’t know when she would be working anyway.

RareGoalsVerge · 22/06/2025 17:21

Somewhat81 · 22/06/2025 15:29

Mumsnet world. Where work colleagues behave like this, MILs are narcissists, school cliques, bitchy NCT classes, cheeky neighbours…. Endless litany of stuff like this that thankfully - I have never encountered

There are 8 million unique mumsnet users each month.

If 95% of humans are entirely reasonable every day, 4% of humans are unreasonable on average once a month and 1% of humans are unreasonable more frequently - say once a week on average (there might be some who are unreasonable once a day or more but for the purpose of the maths I shall assume only 4 incidents per month - then each month about 66% of those 8 million mumsnetters will have zero incidents of people who are important in their lives being totally unreasonable about 26% might have one or two incidents of someone being unreasonable and 8% will be dealing with more frequent unreasonablness.

It's entirely possible that you are lucky enough to be in the 66% where all the people whose reasonableness or otherwise could majorly impact your life are ok. That's great.

If only 10% of the remainder make a mumsnet thread about the top most-irritating incident that happen to them in a month, and the other 90% don't bother, we would have about 9000 new threads about irritating and unreasonable people every day.

I believe the real total of threads per day about irritating and unreasonable people is a lot less than this, and the actual statistics for how frequently people are irritating and unreasonable is probably higher than this, so it must follow that actually mumsnetters on the whole are pretty tolerant and only make threads about the irritating and unreasonable people in their lives a lot less frequently than for 10% of the irritating and unreasonable incidents.

Enough4me · 22/06/2025 17:21

OP, hopefully you feel supported by this thread - you have a right to book leave and enjoy Christmas!
Have you started to look around at other jobs and feeling excited at the prospect of new horizons?
I changed jobs around a year ago and still very happy to learn new things and be in a positive environment.

Corgiears · 22/06/2025 17:21

Somewhat81 · 22/06/2025 15:29

Mumsnet world. Where work colleagues behave like this, MILs are narcissists, school cliques, bitchy NCT classes, cheeky neighbours…. Endless litany of stuff like this that thankfully - I have never encountered

That’s good.

itsgettingweird · 22/06/2025 17:17

Thefourth · 22/06/2025 15:23

I have! They were all sat there bitching about how I ruined Christmas on Friday 🤣

Just say “not mine! For the first time in 5 years I’m celebrating Christmas” 🤗

Ellie56 · 22/06/2025 17:16

Thefourth · 22/06/2025 15:59

Absolutely!! I was thinking about looking for a new job and this has cemented it

Ha! I hope your replacement has kids and wants Christmas off too.

The entitled arseholes will then realise that they have shot themselves in the foot (feet?) and it will bloody well serve them right for turning on you after you have been so kind and accommodating all these years.

I never thought I'd say this in June, but enjoy your Christmas.

TimeForTeaAndG · 22/06/2025 17:15

SockFluffInTheBath · 22/06/2025 16:20

If you’re still there come Christmas you need a cast iron alibi ready for being unavailable to cover them all ringing in sick.

She doesn't need an alibi. She has holiday time booked and would be well within her rights to not answer the phone should her work call.

Daisydiary · 22/06/2025 17:14

I’d tell them straight. In fact, I’d say you’re looking forward to them covering for you for the next five years in return, fair’s fair and all.