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To feel completely betrayed by staff member

135 replies

BurpeesAllTheWay · 12/06/2025 23:24

I run a cleaning company, I started 6 years ago on my own and over the last 1.5 years have added in 6 more employees. The first lady I hired, Ann has been with me since October 23. I employed her daughter to work with us 2 and the pair of them work in a team and the daughter doesn’t drive. Everything was fine until this year, they’ve had 6/7 clients leave and they are calling in sick atleast one of them weekly.
Today, the daughter called in sick because she was too tired to work. I managed to cover her work and team up someone else with Ann for the day, I did ask Ann if she could work late and she said she had something on, which was fine. Then driving home from work today, I drove past one of their old clients houses, who left us a couple of months ago, to see Ann and her daughter loading up their car with all of their cleaning equipment (which is actually all of my cleaning equipment) I’ve had 2 more clients leave in the last 2 weeks, which I now suspect have been taken on privately by them too. Am I being unreasonable to feel really hurt by this dishonesty from someone who I trusted as a friend?! I’ve always subbed her wages early, helped her out when her husband left, we go out for drinks together and catch ups regularly! How would you go about confronting them?! I also now have to sack them, I’m so upset to lose them as members of staff.

OP posts:
Doggielovecharlotte · 14/06/2025 19:17

I’d be tempted to highlight to previous customers that keys are missing and it could affect their insurance

Doggielovecharlotte · 14/06/2025 19:16

GiveDogBone · 14/06/2025 18:55

Hit them with everything you’ve got. Sack them, if they have keys that don’t belong to them, they have stolen them, etc, etc. You may be able to claim damages for lost earnings from the small claims court (not sure about this, but worth a try). You can also grass them up to HMRC, highly unlikely they are paying any taxes on what they earn.

Basically do everything in your power to make their lives as miserable as possible.

U

GiveDogBone · 14/06/2025 18:55

Hit them with everything you’ve got. Sack them, if they have keys that don’t belong to them, they have stolen them, etc, etc. You may be able to claim damages for lost earnings from the small claims court (not sure about this, but worth a try). You can also grass them up to HMRC, highly unlikely they are paying any taxes on what they earn.

Basically do everything in your power to make their lives as miserable as possible.

Cassandra12345 · 14/06/2025 18:13

I think it depends on the contract you have with both clients and employees. This sort of situation is quite common and is normally factored in contractually. Eg my agency send me to work for someone and they get £20 an hour and I get 12.21 an hour. The agency still has to find the employee, do all the associated paperwork and payroll, pay holidays, pay insurance for their office and their own staff salaries. If the customer came to me direct and offered to pay me £12.30 an hour it’s in my contract to tell the agency. It’s in the employees contract that if they want to employ someone direct they have to pay a fee.

Isinglass20 · 14/06/2025 18:09

No sentiment in business. Don’t socialise unless in a staff situation.
If you don’t have employment contract then start researching for what you want in it regarding poaching clients, insurance cover, sick leave, holiday entitlement, performance review , action for theft, pay, hours, client information and GDPRegs.
Like all contracts point out to new recruits it is legally binding.
Do you have employee insurance and client liability cover.
If local colleges run small business courses then attend, also useful for networking.

1SillySossij · 14/06/2025 18:03

If your employees are on a zero hours contract, you cannot stop them from working for themselves or anybody else, e en if you put it in their contracts

Funnyduck60 · 14/06/2025 17:43

Sadly this does happen. It doesn't help that agencies charge so much and all you often get is insurance which most home insurance covers anyway. I'd go to your old clients and ask for a quick conversion about why they left and in future get future losses to complete an exit questionnaire. Obviously sack both ladies and remind your other staff about the consequences of doing this. Talk about biting the hand that feeds you.

Doggielovecharlotte · 14/06/2025 17:16

Surely clients have contracts too that they can’t do this..

Nikki75 · 14/06/2025 17:10

I was going to say this will happen if the said cleaner for said house is liked trusted and does a top job the relationship between both will be can you just work for me ( customer) cheaper than business rates.
As for going out with you as a friend having drinks being obviously very false and stealing your business is a low move .
Isn't there a clause or rule that client or customer caught doing this is liable to be prosecuted because at the end of the day they are not paying tax or not honest tax .

Quinnie1 · 14/06/2025 11:45

BurpeesAllTheWay · 12/06/2025 23:24

I run a cleaning company, I started 6 years ago on my own and over the last 1.5 years have added in 6 more employees. The first lady I hired, Ann has been with me since October 23. I employed her daughter to work with us 2 and the pair of them work in a team and the daughter doesn’t drive. Everything was fine until this year, they’ve had 6/7 clients leave and they are calling in sick atleast one of them weekly.
Today, the daughter called in sick because she was too tired to work. I managed to cover her work and team up someone else with Ann for the day, I did ask Ann if she could work late and she said she had something on, which was fine. Then driving home from work today, I drove past one of their old clients houses, who left us a couple of months ago, to see Ann and her daughter loading up their car with all of their cleaning equipment (which is actually all of my cleaning equipment) I’ve had 2 more clients leave in the last 2 weeks, which I now suspect have been taken on privately by them too. Am I being unreasonable to feel really hurt by this dishonesty from someone who I trusted as a friend?! I’ve always subbed her wages early, helped her out when her husband left, we go out for drinks together and catch ups regularly! How would you go about confronting them?! I also now have to sack them, I’m so upset to lose them as members of staff.

Get a solicitor/legal advice ASAP before you do anything else. I know a lot of comments are 'just sack them', but make sure you do it legally, you might even be able to take them to court and get your money back.

justkeepswimingswiming · 14/06/2025 11:33

Id cut their hours down to nothing & take back your equipment while you seek legal advice. No doubt theyre also dodging the tax man and doing this without the correct insurances etc

Emptynester67 · 14/06/2025 11:17

I'd gather photo evidence and when you're ready, I'd inform them that your contacting revenue to report them working without paying taxes. They're doing this using your equipment, I'd be taking it back.

pollymere · 14/06/2025 10:32

Contracts need to include a clause to say they cannot work independently for the Company's clients during employment and for a year after they leave.

This protects you as you can then sue them for breach of contract. I'd also put it in the Contract of your Clients. They will then know that to use your cleaners outside of the Company will result in being sued.

I'd also bill the Client for the time you witnessed Ann etc cleaning at their house with your materials.

As a client, I wouldn't be happy that a cleaner was retaining my keys either. You need to have a system where they are logged back at the end of the day and no payment given unless keys are returned.

Braygirlnow · 14/06/2025 10:20

I would get legal advice before confronting them.

Sunshineandgrapefruit · 14/06/2025 05:03

Get advice. If your contract doesn't stipulate that they can't do this maybe change all contracts and get the rest of your staff to sign new ones. I would write/ message all clients to tell them what's going on and make it clear that they no longer work for you. If they damage anything who is liable? The customer may blame you. Also you are not seeing any of the money.

momtoboys · 14/06/2025 02:37

That is really a betrayal. I’m sorry

Devianinc · 14/06/2025 01:23

BurpeesAllTheWay · 13/06/2025 06:19

I classed Ann as a friend, she’d even said last week that we haven’t been out for a drink to catch up in a while and wanted to arrange something. I think that’s why I’m so upset and I feel like I’ve been taken for a complete idiot. A friend had told me that they that’s what they were doing and I didn’t want to believe it.
The clients they have taken are ones that I’ve never worked with, they which clients are my friends or are loyal to me so as far as I’m aware they haven’t tried to take them.

I will change policy on the keys, to get them all back asap. The last thing I want to be having to do is offering to change 20 odd houses locks for them!
I need to keep them on for the moment as I spent most of last night working where I could move clients too if I terminated them immediately and until I can employ someone new I can’t cover all of their cleans…although I suspect some of the clients would be loyal to them and keep with them, which they are perfectly in their rights to do. After all I can always replace clients, I’ve done it before and can do it again. But also I will let the clients know that they have been dishonest and stealing from me. I can’t see anyone wanting them in their home knowing that they are dishonest.
As @MooFroo said, I am not actually the big bad boss, they know I work the most hours on houses myself out of every member of staff, I do admin in evenings and weekends as I’m a single mum. They know all of this and know how much I’ve struggled to get the business to where it is today.

Just get your cleaning equipment away from them and then move on. Horrible cockroaches. It’s disgusting when you hired them to help them and you thought they were your friends.

SallyDraperGetInHere · 14/06/2025 00:47

I think you’ve been had here, op, and as a micro business, you might not have the resources to fight this. TJe this as an opportunity to lock down your business terms for both clients and employees. You might have to accept you’ve lost certain clients, but you should still pursue them for monies owed, advising them that your staff members MAY have offered them a direct service outside your terms. You need to pot Ann and her daughter oj some sort of suspension pending investigation and return of all materials. I feel for you, but I think you have to tighten things up to move forward without them.

Abitofalark · 14/06/2025 00:34

You can speak to ACAS (advisory service on employment matters) and it doesn't cost anything.
"Advice
^https://www.acas.org.uk/advice^
Acas's advice is for every worker and employer across England, Scotland and Wales. We advise on employment law and good practice.
If you want to speak to someone, you can contact the Acas helpline."
------

Also, here is an article by a solicitor which discusses where fraud may arise; the role of police; alternatively, what civil remedies may be available to you:
www.orj.co.uk/setting-up-in-competition-with-your-employer-can-be-a-criminal-offence/

EggnogNoggin · 14/06/2025 00:03

Call in all key and equipment, sack them, and immediately email the clients they clean for in a very professional manner saying that issues about the conduct of certain staff have come to light and you take client safety and provacy very serioisly etc therefore you have recently needed to let go of certain staff members and that alternative staffing will be in place. As a gesture of good will, you will offer a (generous)% discount on the next e.g four cleans.

You want to

  1. put the idea in those clients minds that Ann and daughter are dodgy without accusing them
  2. undercut them hard so a customer can't turn down the offer
  3. Offer the dicount for a long enough that the client wupd feel.guilty leaving after such a generous dicount and familiarity with a new cleaner
  4. So Ann and daughter find themselves sacked and with no customers or client lists.

^^ it's not about being able to replace clients, it's about the principle of them being sneaky bitches and frankly I'd pay out of pocket if it meant screwing them so they had no work.

And make sure all cleaners sign a proper contract which covers this and consider retention bonuses for clients e.g. free deep clean every 12 months.

Wooky073 · 13/06/2025 23:43

Here is some AI advice: This is unfortunately quite common in the domestic cleaning sector, especially when staff develop close relationships with clients and aren’t under formal contracts. What they’ve done — taking your equipment and potentially poaching clients while still employed by you — could constitute gross misconduct, breach of trust, and possibly theft (if the equipment is yours and not returned).
A few practical steps you can take:
Secure your business assets: Demand return of keys and equipment in writing. If they refuse, inform them that retaining client keys or company equipment after dismissal may be considered unlawful and reportable.
Contracts: If you don’t already, formalise all employee arrangements with contracts that include:
Non-solicitation clauses (e.g. staff can’t clean privately for your clients for 6–12 months after leaving).
Terms on equipment use and return.
Client communication: Proactively contact all clients to explain you are reviewing staffing due to recent concerns. Reassure them that you remain in control of the business and their service. Ask if they've had direct contact from your staff outside of work.
Future safeguards:
Rotate staff more regularly.
Avoid assigning all client contact to cleaners — centralise billing and communication where possible.
Keep ownership of relationships with newer clients in particular.
Finally, if clients have been paying them directly while you were also paying wages, that’s potentially fraud, and you may need to speak to an employment solicitor or HR advisor to confirm next steps. It might also be worth checking your business insurance and speaking to ACAS (UK employment advisory service).

Wooky073 · 13/06/2025 23:40

I would be using this time period to play innocent whilst gathering evidence (eg photos of their car outside / leaving clients houses whilst off sick using your cleaning equipment).

Once you know for sure (not hunches but hard evidence) id take legal advice. You will need legal advice for knowing how to deal with it without leaving yourself wide open for any revenge tactics.

It is

Therealjudgejudy · 13/06/2025 22:38

Outrageous behaviour by the pair of them!

ThatDaringEagle · 13/06/2025 22:32

littlemousebigcheese · 13/06/2025 22:04

You haven’t answered any questions about contracts etc which makes me think they haven’t signed one? Taking emotion out of it - hard I know as you’ve been betrayed by a friend - think about your business now. If there is no contract stipulation about clients then they haven’t done anything wrong (only morally!) except for claiming double pay - again you haven’t confirmed this though? Do they get paid if they don’t turn up? You could try and reclaim this if they have been claiming sick pay from you whilst working for themselves. Not sure how easy it would be though.

Ehh sorry, things they've done wrong:

  1. Lying
  2. Stealing clients
  3. Using the OP's cleaning equipment to service the OP's clients for their own gain
  4. Retaining & using client's keys without consent
  5. Faking being sick (I.e. probably letting down client's intentionally when working for OP)

Tbc:

  1. Claiming sick pay? while simultaneously moonlighting Using company equipment??
  2. Tax fraud?
  3. Social welfare fraud?
  4. Knowingly damaging the OP's business for nefarious purposes (e.g. what have they been saying to these clients to steal them from the OP)
YourRubyShaker · 13/06/2025 22:29

I have a cleaning company also and a lady who stole some of my clients. But this was after she quit with no notice. We had a feeling she was planning something because of a big change in her attitude towards us. The clients approached me and told me she’d got in touch with them directly and they wanted her and to cut us out. I knew she’d end up letting them down. And she has! There isn’t much you can do, but hold your head high! You haven’t done anything wrong. They are the sneaky ones and they’ll get their karma. In the meantime, I’m not sure I could continue with them working for me. I’d have to try to cover, or maybe subcontract some jobs out so you’re at least still making a little money from them, (with a clause in a contract) temporarily. Moving forward, ensure there is something in writing to attempt to prevent this in the future.

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