Is our town a shithole..

@suburburban So where you you suggest people live? I agree there’s too much building on farms but where else? If planning authorizes allowed redevelopment of town centres for living and recreation zones it would help. We also need to accept more flats and communal parks if we want to keep farms. Labours 1.4m homes will mostly go on green fields, despite their new grey belt ideas. They got a huge majority so they will develop into the countryside - it’s inevitable.

Oh give over! I spent several years doing the same thing (in NZ). It was good pocket money for kids, and although hard work it was great being out in the fresh air with your friends and learning a work ethic.

Hardly comparable to sending kids up chimneys.

My sons twenty odd years ago along with friends would help out with hay making. Loading the bales onto wagons and delivering them. They'd arrive home at 2am filthy but well paid. I don't know if that would be legal now or if sixth formers would be interested.

Locals can’t work for farmers because it is temporary and seasonal work. People used to be able to live on seasonal work in the 50s /60s /70s when they had council houses and no-questions-asked benefits systems. Even in the 90s you were able to do a temporary job and go back on benefits easily. That’s gone now. All security has gone.

That’s a real shame

I remember going to Colchester circa 2016 and it was lovely.

thye keep banging on about the environment yet the constant building on beautiful countryside is criminal

There's a lot going on in Penzance. Give it a couple of years - if we don't enter World War III - I think the amount of investment going on will have made a big difference. People LOVE to slag the place off, including depressingly loads of the people who live there, who appear to want "The Council" to hand them life and and jobs and riches on a plate. It is far, far nicer than loads of the shitholes mentioned on this thread.

I live in Colchester and, yes, I would describe it as a shithole. I hate the place. I have lived here over 40 years and it is much worse than it was in the 1990s. It seems dirtier and more run down. The beautiful three story Debenhams has been closed, and so have many of the best shops. But the worst thing is the overcrowding. Back in the ‘90s it was a relatively quiet, almost sleepy market town. Today, it is a small town with the population of a city crammed into it. You can’t breathe.

I’m supposed to be starting a course in the centre of the town next week, but I’m going to cancel. I just can’t face the drive. I can’t face the traffic, and I can’t face the way the town makes me feel. I come home stressed, irritable and depressed. In fact, I very rarely go into town anymore, and I’m not the only one. Several of my neighbours now drive 20 miles out of their way to do their shopping. Anything to avoid the town itself. How sad is that?! Of course, it isn’t just the town that is overcrowded. I live in a village on the outskirts, but it is slowly being swallowed up. My local woods have been hacked down to make way for two giant housing estates. Then they built a massive estate at the other end of the village. Now the fields in the centre of the village are going to be built on as well. It just never ends. If I was young, I would 100% leave this country. And I would advise any young person to get out as soon as possible - go somewhere where you can move and breathe, where you have space and light and can be alone with nature.

Meopham area in the early/mid 80s. Amd obviously in the school hols and weekends 😆🤣

No idea! We just wanted the cash. Probably the same way as the people we now import do. It's just a shame kids now don't have that opportunity to make money for themselves in their free time (remember, it wasn't a "job" as we were still at school so we could work as much as we felt like).

@bipbopdo I don’t think you can say that around £12 an hour though isn’t a fair wage - my son is in a skilled job in IT and it still works out at £16 to £18 an hour as do many professional jobs - the problem in the UK isn’t so much wages, it’s lack of affordable housing in many areas, council tax, affordable childcare with young kids, utilities- when we lived in Denmark their minimum wasn’t really much higher, but tax is much higher so no council tax, cheaper utilities, very cheap ( and good ) childcare , lots of good quality social housing. People brought home about the same as UK across all income brackets- but so much more had already been covered off or was reasonable . ( childcare bills etc)

If jobs don’t support family and community life though @Pistachioitaliano then you get the breakdown in cohesion that people are describing.

Corporations need to pay a decent wage. Eliminate housing benefit is the first step. People would need to work and would take on the jobs.

That's not completely correct.

Years ago some of the work was done by people with SEN. Their houseparents would transport them to the area (usually in a minibus) to do a shift with minimal supervision. They were provided with a packed lunch, suitable clothing and had support if needed.
It gave them the opportunity to get out in the fresh air, get some exercise and earn some money for themselves. They could be proud to say "I go to work" - so it was win/win all round.
Unfortunately the costs of employing these people were undercut by the gangmasters who provided the farmers with cheaper labour.

At one time (70s) the work was done by students, but that seems to be "not cool" any more. Now students would rather stay in their rooms, rack up huge student debts, and play x-box rather that do any manual work.

It’s still a fact that local workers worked on the farms. I think potatoes are dug by machines now. We all want cheap food - thst means keeping costs down. If we don’t want British food, then import it. You cannot have it both ways. Neither can Boston. You reap what you sow.

Where in Kent was this? My family farmed in Kent the seasonal picking work was done by local people, often farm labourers wives and family (older teenagers), students and travellers. Children usually joined in later, at the gleaning stage. I have no recollection whatsoever of children of 10 years old being used as pickers - they were at school in accordance with statutory obligations. 1960s/70s. The farm went in the early 80s to pay death duties at a stinging rate.

😁 Yeah, there was that!

We used to get £1 an hour for potato picking, this was late 70s / early 80s though, when I started work in a factory few years later, it was still only £2 an hour. I still remember the feeling of putting your finger into a mouldy potato, yuck!

But you did the job anyway, as did I at Chelsea girl on Saturdays at the same age.

The farmer was lenient with his whip though, so…

Yes, and I didn’t get a fair wage for it. I was also a Saturday girl when I was 15 and made significantly less per hour than my colleagues, but did the same job. Wage differentials based on age are deeply unfair and exploitative.

Reliance on cheap labour is what got us into this mess in the first place. Employers paying fair wages would go a long way toward boosting local economies.

Did you do a paper round as a child?

Yes, we all attended the union meetings too,

Did you get the same wages as adult pickers?

We weren’t underpaid. We enjoyed it and there was a sense of community. Gave us a good work ethic too.

So, instead of cheap labour from abroad, farmers used to underpay children to do the same work?