To think that free breakfast at school is a bad idea due to the quality?

Given the increasing rates of childhood overweight and obesity I'm pleased to hear the portions are small. A lot parents are massively over feeding their kids, and healthwise that's likely to be as bad as smoking 20 a day. It's crazy to add a universal extra breakfast in - the rates of children being underweight are tiny and show no change in recent decades. I just don't believe the narrative of high numbers of kids going to school hungry.

22% of kids in reception are overweight or obese. That is entirely the fault of their parents giving them too much food. The money would be better spent on interventions to help those families & early safeguarding for underweight kids, not giving the kids more calories.

The latest data shows childhood underweight at 1.2% of children in reception whilst 2.6% are severely obese.

https://fingertips.phe.org.uk/profile/obesity-physical-activity-nutrition/data#page/1

It is an argument because in this country there's no one with less income than a jobless under 25. You can look up how much less benefits under 25s get, still always had money for 70p cereal. Bullshit on those people claiming they can't afford to feed their kids breakfast.

I think your missing the point somewhat it's not the government's fault that some parents won't feed their kids
But in those cases surely having a bowl of cereal and a slice of toast even if it, s cheap cereal and bread is better than not eating at all
We got great home made dinners at primary school too this was in the 70 s and 80,s which my parents paid for we also got fed at home.

I would have thought that porridge with a bit of brown sugar, honey or syrup would be better than Rice Krispies or cornflakes which are devoid or anything nutritious (other than added bits and minerals).

I’m absolutely amazed at all the posts on here defending shit food in schools. All the “fed is best” crap. Surely in a country as rich as ours it’s not too much to expect children to be both fed and fed healthy?? Let raise the bar a little for gods sake.

I’m not blaming the schools or school staff for it…I’m blaming the government. I wouldn’t expect TAs or teachers (who currently run our schools breakfast club) to get into school early to make porridge and boil eggs etc, then wash it all up. There needs to be enough funding for the school to hire breakfast cooks / staff in the same as at lunch time.

Skimping on school meal nutrition is a false economy. Especially for those “fed us best” children who will most likely also be getting crap food at home. All it does is create unhealthy eating habits, so kicking the financial can further down the line when they are adults with health problems and the NHS has to pick up the pieces.

When I was at primary school all our lunches were made at the school and there was pretty much just one home made choice (roast, cottage pie, lasagne, etc). Everyone ate it. Then I moved to senior school and it was totally different. It was delivered by Brake Brothers each day. Lots more choice, but a lot of food that was very unheathly. Of course no one ate the healthy option, firstly because beige food is designed to be addictive/easy for our palette to love, but also because you would have been teased for it. Everyone on the table going “ewww! Look what gagamamas eating! It makes me want to vom!” Etc. Since when did children get so much power over something that should be decided for them? We don’t let them choose over going to school and learning, or staying at home and playing video games. Same goes for the food. We need to be adults who show them what to eat, and where an unhealthy version isn’t an option.

I bet the food in Japanese schools is tasty too!
Fixed Menu: All students are served the same balanced meal, with a “you get what you’re given” approach that leaves no option to choose unhealthy foods.
Same in Finland, one meal for everyone (those with allergies are given a version of the meal that fits with their dietary restrictions) so no option to choose something less healthy. But the children serve themselves so can take a small portion if its something they really don't like and fill up on salad and bread.

I often wonder about the lack of quality school meals too, but it’s such an emotive issue. You almost have to present your ‘poor’ credentials before anything you say can be considered on MN which is not helpful.
One issue is that we have devalued food and food production and stopped home economics type lessons. The percentage of wages spent on food is so much less than when I was young - yet we know more about the value of good food and nutrition.
Then there’s the issue of meals not being prepared in schools due to lack of kitchens.
I do wonder if suppliers can be brought on board more, if not by conscience then by tax breaks etc, to get more fresh fruit and veggies made available.
This is going to get me roasted, but I can’t help but wonder if someone like M&S could be partnered with so they supply quality sandwiches for breakfast clubs with therefore protein and not just carbs. Obviously at very subsidised prices to the schools.
Yes, to finalise, I did attend a failing lowest 10% achievement comp with foul school meals, but I genuinely feel food was more prioritised by parents over almost anything else in those days. Not good quality food, but not letting your kids go hungry. Uniforms (esp PE kits) and stationery etc often not supplied, UK camping hols only (if at all), walking everywhere, maybe no tv.
We do need to find a way for children to learn to eat healthier and prioritise food themselves.

Before retiring through ill health I worked in a school. Firstly as a one to one support worker and also in breakfast club.
our breakfast club has been running for 15 years and has always been free.
I live in a deprived area just outside the Rhondda South Wales.
The breakfast club is an essential part of the school day and is usually packed.
We are a small school with just over a hundred children and the breakfast club is attended by at least half of the children. Sometimes more sometimes less.
We serve weetabix, rice crispies, cornflakes, toast, yogurt and fresh fruit.
We don’t put sugar on the cereal and the toast is made from 50/50 bread. We don’t offer jam because of the sugar content.
We give them milk, sugar fruit juices, and water.
We did try porridge at one time but had so few takers due to not adding sugar that we stopped it.
Our lunch menus have been well thought out by dietitians and all the ingredients are measured for the best dietary needs of the children ie all the food groups are present in the recipes.
There is always salad and fruit on offer as well as nutritious sandwiches, rolls and wraps.
I was under the impression that this was the same all over the uk and am genuinely surprised to hear that this isn’t the case.

Look to Japan when we think about what feeding school children should look like
https://www.ordo.com/articles/why-japans-school-nutrition-program-sets-a-global-example

Rather than enriching catering providers and setting up a lifetime of illness for another generation, it would cost the country far, far LESS in the long run to reverse the tide of eating badly in this country if we ensured that food which actually supports health is what is served to everyone in our schools...

It’s just so very very sad that the issue of free breakfast is even a thing in a country that is the 6th largest economy in the world. Yet as many as 30% of our sweet children live in poverty 😞
I just pray for governance that succeeds in raising families out of such poverty and provides them with the means to feed their own children. The state feeding them is all very well as a temporary measure but what is the plan going forward?

A few years ago, sugar was the evil everyone was obsessed with, before that it was fat, now it's UPFs.
None of the above are good, obviously but they really are not the be all and end all of life.

Children need a degree of fat in their diet so yes fat is good for them in moderation.

On the other hand, the campaign to get rid of sugar has resulted in them being replaced with dubious artificial sweeteners that are also much sweeter than sugar, encouraging a sweeter tooth.

You can take that argument a long way, but shouldn’t parents have responsibility for their children? Is it always a good idea for the state to remove that responsibility?

It is a complete mystery to me why people fall for every food fad going and seem to think it is the definitive way of eating .
This year's buzz word is UPF - posters are throwing it around, presumably because they think it makes them sound as if they know what they are talking about.
It doesn't, it makes the sound as if they are just jumping on the latest bandwagon and will stay there until the next one comes along.
A few years ago, sugar was the evil everyone was obsessed with, before that it was fat, now it's UPFs.
None of the above are good, obviously but they really are not the be all and end all of life.
Proportion needed I think

Sadly, a lot of the parents of very deprived kids won't bother getting them up earlier.

The breakfast clubs will be used by parents quite capable of giving their kids breakfast, but they can't be bothered because they'd rather fob the cost and responsibility onto the school.

Most people do feed their children - often at the expense of other essentials including feeding themselves. If free breakfast/lunch makes money available for other things that’s good for families who don’t have spare money. Not sure that ‘I fed my kids’ is really an argument! Yes we all feed our children, some at greater sacrifice than others.

If it’s that or hungry children then I absolutely will. You continue to look down your nose and sneer

No sneering from me. I want better for children in the UK. I want them to have what my DD has.

This!

On Mumsnet, fat kids are far worse than starving ones 🙄

If it’s that or hungry children then I absolutely will. You continue to look down your nose and sneer…

Yep.

Plenty of children at my child's school would have never tried avocado before, probably not even know what it is. That's just the reality at the majority of schools in deprived areas.

Cereal and toast is cheap, familiar, easy to serve and guaranteed that children will eat it.

I think school food is awful because most schools now employ outside caterers who are only interested in making a profit.

The first school I worked at employed their own kitchen staff. It wasn't gourmet cuisine but pupils were served generous portions of proper food with plates and cutlery.

School caterers serve tiny portions, no where near enough for a 16 year old lad and of really really poor food. And for higher prices. The food in my current school is atrocious..the portion sizes are scandalous.

plus the children actually eat it

You can’t just impose a whole new culture of food on children and expect them to eat it - porridge, wholemeal sourdough, avocado, fruit etc (nut-butters of any description are out for allergy reasons) is a whole different culture of food for many deprived children. And I am not talking about immigrant communities for whom breakfast foods will be different again.

Honestly what a sanctimonious post that shows no understanding of the constraints of staffing, the pace of the curriculum the government set and the size of classes

OK dole out the pre-packaged shit and cartons of fruit juice.

Not on mumsnet. If you can’t provide hand crafted organic muesli and a selection of freshly made organic fruit salad on bone china its better to let them starve.

The primaries around our way lost their kitchens in the early 90’s when central school meals services were abandoned in favour of government prescribed outsourcing to the lowest common denominator firms who provided poor quality (often inedible) packed lunches for FSM children and the rest brought in their own lunches. Kitchens were repurposed as more classroom space for the rising numbers with less cost than building work.

When your “equipment” is a hall, a couple of toasters and the sink which the staff use for tea and coffee and the good will of staff giving free time your options are limited. Never managed to cook porridge in a toaster myself and anyone who thinks its as easy to wash a dried on, half left porridge bowl as a toast plate hasn’t done much washing up.

Most of the shoestring breakfast clubs do manage wholemeal toast (but standard sliced so obviously not approved wholemeal) with some jam or marmite, some cereals based on availability. What they all have in common is shelflife and minimal waste plus the children actually eat it. That last being the point.

In principle I’d pay taxes to have better breakfasts provided in schools - the problem is as soon as its “free” any comments about quality are shut down because is “free”. Possibly subsidising with some payment is a compromise option.

I completely agree, OP. Taxes in the UK are incredibly high, if they were managed appropriately, kids wouldn’t need to settle for crappy UPF breakfasts. And they are crappy. White bread, margarine and cheap jam?! Why do we put up with this? Places like Japan have dedicated nutritionists in each school making sure children have proper, healthy meals.

Free breakfast is nice but it must be nutritious. These children are our future. We need to teach healthy eating habits and nourish them properly so they can grow up healthy. We need to think long-term. If we don’t, we will end up with obese, unhealthy adults suffering with chronic diseases. Also, they’ll be putting pressure on the NHS so if it’s all about the bottom line, it’ll cost us all more in the end.

It’s a damning indictment on society if advocating for nutritious, non-UPF meals is seen as snobby and privileged…