Child’s Friend Calling DH A Racist Name

I didn't swear at you, as you well know. And there is no rule against swearing on MN. But if it's easier for you to use my choice of wording as a reason to bow out of the conversation because you can't find any other way to defend your position, I understand.

Anyway, it's fine. I've already said all that I wanted to say.

No but I’m not going to have a discussion with someone who thinks it’s ok to swear at me. Simple as that. I’m done 👍🏼

Amen.

Very well put. Your other post was spot on as well.

Oh op, I am really sorry to hear. Hope you get to the bottom of it

I find it interesting that @Changeminds20 chose to take issue with that one word in my post. That would appear to suggest that she thinks language is important and that it's the right thing to do to challenge language that you don't like.

And yet she doesn't think that anything should be done to educate a child who has made blatantly racist comments because we should apparently just accept that kids will be kids and we can't control what others say.

Without swearing at anyone in particular, I would like to suggest that that's mightily fucked up.

No one swore at you. No need to be so dramatic (and inaccurate). The other poster used the expression "fuck all" about an idea.

You're more worried about swearing than racism?

OK then.

Ok.
I would really appreciate it if you didn’t swear at me.
Good on you girl.

It really isn't as simple as that, though, and I fundamentally disagree with you that people should not attempt to address the wider issues. It has fuck all to do with being "the big I am" and everything to do with being part of a wider community and helping to shape the next generation and the kind of society that we want our kids to live in.

And even if you only focus on teaching your own kids, surely a big part of that is teaching them to stand up for what is right and to take action when they see things that wrong. I don't think children who are exposed to racism against themselves or their family members should be taught to just put up and shut up. They should be taught to speak out because they shouldn't have to tolerate it.

I also think you're wrong that the school aren't going to be interested in something that happened outside of school. Obviously, I don't know the OP's school, but having served as as a school governor for many years, I can tell you that many schools would absolutely want to know about stuff like this happening outside of school, they would take it seriously, and they are probably regularly involved in dealing with stuff outside of school already.

You're right, of course, that we cannot control every factor in their lives, but that isn't an excuse to just shrug it off and say oh well, racists will be racists. Attitudes like that are part of the problem.

Look I agree with what you’re saying in some sense but ‘ needs to be addressed’…. Us humans can’t not control what others say and we can have an opinion on what’s right and wrong, OP needs to educate her child and leave it at that, kids will be kids and if her child wants to still see this racist child then they will just have to set boundaries in their home. Also the school aren’t going to give two monkeys on comments made outside of school. Too many parents on here giving it the big I am, look after your own child and teach them. You can control other factors In their lives. It really is as simple as that.

Op, first of all of course it's racist.

Second, I do think you should talk to the school in case the friend has picked it up from there (or in case they inadvertently popularise it there and your dd is already having problems.) I wouldn't necessarily name the child if you do decide to talk to the school mostly because if you name the child the school might think that your issue is with the child (as so many posters on this thread do) rather than the school environment and the bullying there.

Have you asked your dd if she has heard this particular term before?

To be honest, irrespective of whatever this child has said I'd come down pretty hard on the school. It sounds like a fairly horrible place.

Also, I disagree that this is ultimately your dh's decision and about what he is most comfortable with. It is about what is best for your dd and your opinion is equally valid in that. Hearing racist things about her dad affects her directly. Besides, racism already is a thing. It won't become more of a thing by talking about it but I agree with you that the main people to talk to are the school. You don't have to tell the friend anything beyond asking her to call dh dd's dad. Having said that if I was the mum of that child I'd want to know if my child said something racist.

I think this is the best way to deal with it, at least the Mum will have a word with her after and hopefully that's the end of it.
I think at this age the child wont really understand the implications of what they are saying, they probably think it's a joke or not that serious (probably picked up from school rather than at home?)

Thank you for clarifying.

In answer to your question about whether i knew what racism was at that age, actually, yes I did, because I had parents that talked about that kind of thing. But I understand that many 5yos probably don't.

I don't think anyone is actually holding a 5yo accountable for making racist comments though... the OP and others have acknowledged that the child is not to blame as he was probably just parroting what he had heard from someone else without really understanding the implications of what he was saying. That doesn't change the fact that he made a racist comment, though, and it needs to be addressed as such while taking his age and likely lack of understanding into account. The most important thing in this situation is probably to ascertain where the child is picking up this kind of racist language or thinking and to deal with it at source.

No sorry didn’t mean for it to sound like that, it is racist remark. I’m just saying the kid is 5 and I feel like they say silly harmless things at that age. Did you know what racism was at that age?

Unfortunately it seems that racism towards East Asians is minimised where it certainly wouldn’t be towards some other groups. It should all be equally unacceptable.

OP, I must say that it’s a myth that any racism is dealt with that well in most schools. So it’s wrong to say it would be considered unacceptable if it were other groups. All racism towards people of colour is minimised in many schools unfortunately.

I say this as a former educator who has worked in multiple schools in England and seen abuse of Black, mixed and South Asian kids brushed under the carpet and had to advocate on behalf of parents and kids .

Are you in Scotland? A woman in Fife was telling me the awful racist violence her (mixed race black) son had suffered over a period of years including violent attacks . A friends mixed /black daughter from just outside Glasgow was badly bullied for years and was even on the news about it. in both instances the schools didn’t take it seriously.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-60928666.amp

Sorry, but I'm not sure if I have understood. Are you suggesting that it would be OK to call the OP's DH "karate chop" if he was Japanese rather than Vietnamese? Because that's how your post comes across.

Nobody needs to explain anything to you. If you’re that ignorant, I suggest you go and educate yourself.

Oh my god as if someone asked you this. I think you need to escalate and potentially get local MP involved because the school are doing nothing about racist bullying. This will all be extremely traumatic and impactful on your child.

And??????? Not sure I understand.

@Livelovebehappy, the simple test as to whether something is racist or "just" offensive is to ask yourself whether the offensive word or phrase in question would be targeted equally towards people from all races. If it is likely that a particular word or phrase would be aimed at people from certain ethnicities more than others, then it is racist. There is no room for debate on this.

In this case, it's pretty obvious that the phrase has been used because of the DH's ethnic origin. We can reasonably assume that the child would not have called him "karate chops" if he had been white. Or indeed, if he had been black. Hence, the use of the words was racist, even though a 5yo probably had a very limited understanding of the rights and wrongs of this, as the OP has already acknowledged.

By insisting that it is "just" offensive and not racist, you are seeking to minimise the racism which is obviously a factor, and you are trying to gaslight the OP. This is not just a matter of opinion. There is simply no argument to say that "offensive" language that is targeted at people from specific ethnic backgrounds is not inherently racist.

Please just stop.

I’m glad. @Livelovebehappy is a fucking disgrace. (I bet I’m deleted first though)

You need to put your concerns in writing to the head, be explicit, tell them its unacceptable behaviour (bullying) and you want it to be dealt with, name names. In my experience they only take any action once it is in writing because it goes on file and the inspectorate / ofsted expects the school to respond appropriately, they don't want something like that on file and they need to show they have acted on the complaint.

I’m of East Asian extraction and have heard it all, I did Goju Ryu karate when young so could have had a scrap in the style expected though then yiu would be the one in trouble.

It is racist but the child saying it is so young they will probably not understand this. Speak to the school.

The school sounds bad I wouldn’t have tolerated the violence and their handling of it was very poor.

East Asians tend to get on with stuff and are not that vocal about what they endure. I also had the horror of what number are you on the menu? Or are you number 69 on the menu ? countless times when being sexually harassed when young.

Beware that for your DD, yellow fever is a thing especially with anime being so popular now. I still get men being a bit weird towards me.

I’ve reported you for your racism and racist apologism. When someone clearly, calmly and consistently explains to you why something is racist and you continue to insist it’s not, then you are the problem. Stop being so racist.