You scumbag You maggot you cheap lousy…

TeaAndToast8 · 2025-05-20T20:51:23+00:00

My second AIBU Of the night, husbands being very argumentative! Anyway, I’ve screenshot two examples of what the Kirsty MacColl might have meant in Fairy Tale of NewYork. Who is correct.. My opinion is the description underlined in red and my husband’s is blue.

JumpingPumpkin · 22/05/2025 10:12

CurlewKate · 21/05/2025 10:15

I find the idea that it’s a “much loved Christmas song”utterly bizarre.

Why? It very much is. Do you just not like it?

OneCalmFish · 21/05/2025 21:34

I think your DH read this x

Anonymouseposter · 21/05/2025 20:33

One of my Aunties used to call her sons lazy faggots (Manchester late 1950s, early 1960s). It wasn't a nice way to talk to kids but she certainly meant useless/lazy and nothing to do with being gay.
I think that it had already become an offensive term for a gay person by the 1980s, not sure what meaning was intended in the song.

Justchillinhere · 21/05/2025 20:09

It's common back in the days language meaning useless, good for nothing

Valeriekat · 21/05/2025 20:03

GenderFluid90 · 20/05/2025 22:11

It's primarily known as an offensive gay slur now. No matter the original meaning

Not in the UK

MatildaMovesMountains · 21/05/2025 16:03

TeaAndToast8 · 21/05/2025 13:27

No, We were watching a program set in Ireland last night and it just came up (I mentioned how much I like the Irish accent) I genuinely thought I’d come back to this post and have people agree with me that the meaning of the word faggot in the song is offensive and homophobic, not as my husband suggested a useless/lazy pile of sticks. Seems most people disagree with me though.

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Most people have jumped on your invitation to write slurs they aren't normally able to.

AstonUniversityPotholeDepartment · 21/05/2025 14:03

My preferred alternative is You scumbag, you maggot, it's Kevin the Carrot

Original poster

TeaAndToast8 · 21/05/2025 13:54

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 21/05/2025 13:47

FWIW I agree that it is a slur

I mean come on, they're not singing "you scumbag, you maggot, you cheap pile of fire sticks" are they 🙄
Context

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I don’t think so but lots disagree. I had no idea it was a common term used in Ireland but like I said to my husband, he didn’t know that himself until he googled it. I’m of the opinion that if this word offends people it makes no difference to me to change it when it’s played on radio.

OP posts:

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 21/05/2025 13:47

TeaAndToast8 · 21/05/2025 13:27

No, We were watching a program set in Ireland last night and it just came up (I mentioned how much I like the Irish accent) I genuinely thought I’d come back to this post and have people agree with me that the meaning of the word faggot in the song is offensive and homophobic, not as my husband suggested a useless/lazy pile of sticks. Seems most people disagree with me though.

Show quote history

FWIW I agree that it is a slur

I mean come on, they're not singing "you scumbag, you maggot, you cheap pile of fire sticks" are they 🙄
Context

Original poster

TeaAndToast8 · 21/05/2025 13:27

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 21/05/2025 13:21

It's nowhere near Christmas and you're arguing over the lyrics to fairytale of New York?!
Is this just another rage bait post along the lines of "can't say nuffink nowadays!" 🙄😁

No, We were watching a program set in Ireland last night and it just came up (I mentioned how much I like the Irish accent) I genuinely thought I’d come back to this post and have people agree with me that the meaning of the word faggot in the song is offensive and homophobic, not as my husband suggested a useless/lazy pile of sticks. Seems most people disagree with me though.

OP posts:

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 21/05/2025 13:21

It's nowhere near Christmas and you're arguing over the lyrics to fairytale of New York?!
Is this just another rage bait post along the lines of "can't say nuffink nowadays!" 🙄😁

Platespace · 21/05/2025 13:18

U think faggotts are traditionally a West Country/Welsh thing, they're certainly still sold in the proper butchers where my sister lives, and delicious they are too, I always buy some to stock the freezer when we're there.

All supermarkets sell Mr Brain's faggots still though, which although vastly inferior are still faggots.

They're made from offal and offcuts, with herbs. Literally whatever's available, the point being to use up what you have.

randomchap · 21/05/2025 12:14

MelOfTheRoses · 21/05/2025 12:11

@randomchap
Instrumental. It is a reel - Northumbrian I think.

Edited

Thank you

MelOfTheRoses · 21/05/2025 12:11

@randomchap
Instrumental. It is a reel - Northumbrian I think.

randomchap · 21/05/2025 12:10

MelOfTheRoses · 21/05/2025 11:40

My dad's traditional fiddle tunes book had a tune called "Queen of the Sluts". I doubt it was a slur on a woman's housekeeping skills.

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Do you remember if that had lyrics? Or was it just instrumental?

I don't want to Google that phrase

MelOfTheRoses · 21/05/2025 11:40

CoffeeCantata · 21/05/2025 09:26

Yes!!!

I wish people knew the original meaning of 'slut'. The related adjective is 'slatternly', which isn't used much now. Still misogyinistic, but let's be accurate!

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My dad's traditional fiddle tunes book had a tune called "Queen of the Sluts". I doubt it was a slur on a woman's housekeeping skills.

MelOfTheRoses · 21/05/2025 11:33

pinkstripeycat · 21/05/2025 07:32

I think it’s silly when we are told to refrain from using words that have been given a new, offensive meaning.

I know someone called Gay (in her 70s), is she still allowed to used her own name?
My Nan used to say queer all the time. It means odd.

Gay Search used to be a BBC presenter - Gardener's World.

krustykittens · 21/05/2025 10:43

I'm Irish, knew faggot was used as an offensive slur against gay men, but had no idea it was a type of meatball in the UK. We moved to the UK when the kids were little and we were on a bus one day, the girls had gone to the back without me. We stopped for a couple of minutes as the bus was ahead of schedule and they had a good chance to look around. One of them shouted, "Mum, what's a faggot?" I froze and took a second to think how I was going to explain, in front of the whole bus, what that word was and why she shouldn't use it, when she pointed to the window of a butcher's shop. I have never been so relieved in my life!

wineandcrispsplease · 21/05/2025 10:27

I’m Irish, early 50’s and my mum would regularly refer to me and younger Dsis as “ little faggots” when we played up/ got on her nerves!

CurlewKate · 21/05/2025 10:15

I find the idea that it’s a “much loved Christmas song”utterly bizarre.

Vroomfondleswaistcoat · 21/05/2025 10:09

CoffeeCantata · 21/05/2025 09:26

Yes!!!

I wish people knew the original meaning of 'slut'. The related adjective is 'slatternly', which isn't used much now. Still misogyinistic, but let's be accurate!

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My mum regularly used to call me a slut. She meant that my bedroom was a bit untidy, but I couldn't understand it because I was fourteen and didn't even have a boyfriend. She was insulting me at cross purposes.

MmeChoufleur · 21/05/2025 10:06

ShamrockShenanigans · 20/05/2025 21:57

Faggot meant lazy long before Americans started using it as a gay insult.

Just as 'slut' used to mean a lazy/slovenly woman rather than a promiscuous one.

I remember being horrified as a kid in the 80s when Roald Dahl used the word ‘slut’ in Revolting Rhymes. 😂

Serpentstooth · 21/05/2025 10:03

"She keeps a dirty house. There's slut's wool under the beds". Over the garden fence chatter c.1950.

CoffeeCantata · 21/05/2025 09:26

ShamrockShenanigans · 20/05/2025 21:57

Faggot meant lazy long before Americans started using it as a gay insult.

Just as 'slut' used to mean a lazy/slovenly woman rather than a promiscuous one.

Yes!!!

I wish people knew the original meaning of 'slut'. The related adjective is 'slatternly', which isn't used much now. Still misogyinistic, but let's be accurate!

JumpingPumpkin · 21/05/2025 09:06

Boomer55 · 21/05/2025 08:58

Word meanings change. Gay used to mean happy, and nothing to do with sexuality. 😉

This is true. It would be bizarre to go back through old songs and change the word gay to something else.

The whole tone of FoNY is two angry people trying to hurt each other with words because they’re frustrated at life. So having a few offensive words in there is fine. When it clearly isn’t a gay slur by context. It sounds right.

Please avoid the Pogues “Rum, Sodomy and the Lash” album if you find FoNY a bit much.