Mayflower primary school - nappy changing facilities for school aged children

Our brother HATES us mentioning this (which is, of course, why we do!) but when he started school he still wore nappies because he couldn't be SURE to stay dry all day. We -myself, my sister, and our mother- had spent so much time with him and he was 90% "dry", but he wasn't guaranteed.

Oh and we are not a chaotic or struggle home

I am reading all the smug responses from mums whose kids were perfectly potty trained at 2 and it’s making me rage and despair

and as for the person calling me lazy , well you can fuck right off!

How can I be lazy scraping shit out of my 5.5 year olds child arse up to 5 times a day in a bad day and at least twice a day in a good day

it’s costing me a fortune in wipes, washing , pants , nappies at night and trousers and every-time he does it it breaks my heart and stresses me out , I have no idea what wrong
( seeing a consultant next month )

he does not have any SEN , I am following poo nurses advice and its not down to my “gentle parenting “

my elder daughter who has a EHCp sen potty trained like a dream , quick and easy no drama , hardly any accidents

its filthy , stinks the house out , expensive , embarrassing and now it’s the new shaming stick to hit parents with !
if you are lucky enough not to be dealing with this count yourself lucky and to those that are judging = shove your judgement up your judgy arses!!

Because a lot of parents nowadays are lazy feckers? Sorry but it's true - you only have to go out to a restaurant or cafe and see parents shoving their dc's in front of an iPad whilst they scroll on their phones.

I have 4 dc's and all needed toilet training before they could go to playgroup - it was a pain in the bum but there was no question of not doing it, it's just one of those things you have to do to help your child's development.

Standards are lower in general, and people are more selfish and entitled 🤷‍♀️

For those saying the issue is that we need a different approach to non SEND kids, the problem is that it’s impossible to tell at age 3-5 whether it’s inconsistent parenting, a physical issue or SEND.

My son’s school is currently running an adult literacy course, aimed specifically at parents of the school’s students. It’s to support those whose children have now surpassed the adult’s reading ability. There are 3 children in my son’s class who have a parent attending. These are very average 7 year olds.

Something went wrong a long time ago, those adults couldn’t read the book either. They need Sure Start.

There is a difference between children with SEND and those without.

Nursery and schools of course make provision, willingly, for children who require additional support.

My DGS, I would expect school staff to be not so willing with my ‘soon to be, no needs at all, nearly 5 when he starts school’, DGS. He isn't toilet trained because my DD ‘gentle parents’. He will go to the toilet when he has decided he is ready. She doesn't build a routine, doesn't encourage when he says no. He looks ridiculous running round the park, big lad, full communication, with a large smelly, sudden, baggy nappy.

Holidays are a great time to toilet train, running round our garden, no nappy or just a pair of sodden pants! They soon learn with parental help.

I dare say, but IMO it’s largely down to CBA parenting and the availability of disposable nappies and pull-ups.

I think that's a possibility. But people are saying the issue might be caused by undiagnosed needs at reception. If undiagnosed, the the children wouldn't have been in special school anyway

I guess it's true that most nurseries won't be using the no pants approach. I could not see the point either, it didn't seem to aid understanding anywhere near as much as the potty close at hand.

In the past SEN children were educated (or not) away from mainstream schools.

Exactly.

My son is also in a wheelchair and needs toilet assistance. He loves learning and is perfectly capable of mainstream.

A special school simply because he needs help with toileting wouldn't be suitable for his educational needs.

When was he diagnosed? I bet it wasn’t before he started reception.

My son is disabled but not disabled enough for special school. He is bowel incontinent and needs to be changed when he soils himself.

He has no learning difficulties and is capable of accessing a mainstream education but he needs toileting support.

What a cop out!

My mum had 3 children with an age gap of 1 and a half years and my dad worked full time
We all learned to use the toilet before nursery.

Lazy people.
How does being a single parent stop you from teaching your kid to use a potty and then toilet?!

There are beggars in India whose kids know how to defecate and wash and they don't even have an actual toilet.

Seems like a cultural issue.

Because in the past any children with delayed issues would be sent away to SEN dedicated schools where full care needs including changes absolutely would be taken care of as standard.

It would be completely discriminatory to disabled children for a start.

How would you intend to make sure it was only targeted at children with lazy parents?

Nurseries are usually keen to get toddlers potty trained ASAP as it is far less work for them once they are out of nappies. So I don’t think it’s that.

The nursery that we have DN at, and the one that we recently removed him from, don't get involved in potty training. They insist on nappies until two weeks of training at home before they allow them to be nappy free at nursery. They do allow pull ups, but don't guarantee toilet reminders.

I think staffing levels are part of the reason as DDs old nursery were very proactive in assisting toilet training.

This is the problem with these kind of discussions. I went to school with a disabled girl (wheelchair user) who needed toilet assistance up until she left at 18. Why should she be sent to a special school when she was bright and perfectly capable of accessing mainstream ? Why were her toileting needs “disgusting”?

Unless it's a special school, schools should not allow children that can't even wipe their own behind.
It's disgusting to expect school staff to do it.

Well I don’t expect my 3 year old to remember my mobile number.

This would be dreadful - so ableist and my ds would have missed out on education and become even further behind

OK, so we've established that there is a problem here with children who don't have special needs, and the issue is parenting.

So, MN policy advisors ... post your suggestions for government solutions and let's hope one of Kier's minions is reading this thread!

Nurseries might be keen but inconsistent approaches between home and nursery make it trickier

I wonder what the trend would be if schools were allowed to delay admission for children until they were toilet trained?