To have not known kids have to attain grade 4 in maths?

I don't think it's dull, far from it. I love to hear people talk about it, particularly the higher level stuff. I just can't do it.

What would really help is a drop in judgement from maths bods. Both IRL (which is why I hide it) and online, there's a tendency to ridicule. We've seen some of the attitudes on this thread.

It's much less prevalent in the 'good at English' community. There's a lot more sympathy and support for those who struggle with reading and writing. I have come across more scoffing and 'it's so easy my 5 year old could do it'.type remarks pertaining to maths.

I don't know why that is, but it would massively help the profile of maths if those of us who aren't the best at it weren't driven into the defensive position of either hiding it or wearing it like a badge because we feel we have to prove we can be, to quote a pp 'functional members of society'.

I agree. That’s what I was trying to say in previous posts. Schools tend to just repeat their ways of teaching, and if it didn’t work the first few times, it’s insanity to keep trying to explain it the same few limited ways using the same resources and language. More so if the pupil keeps getting the same teacher!

It’s why approaching it in lots of different ways is more likely to succeed, such as your grandad example. A teacher doing private tuition could fall into the same trap - doing exactly the same as classroom teachers but expecting different outcomes! Whereas time with “Grandad” who isn’t blinkered and restricted with formal study material and past exam papers can “teach” in a completely different way to get the person seeing a glimmer of light and gain a few competencies in the basics to enable them to move forward with a bit of confidence.

Like the classic example of Brit’s abroad who can’t speak the language so just repeat themselves getting louder and slower!

Also agree with another pp who could cope well with money and change, currency conversions, etc., - she CAN do maths,, but just not in the way it’s taught for exams nor answering exam style questions. Change the terminology and methodology and you’ve cracked it!

Good luck to everyone sitting maths GCSE -and other subjects as well.

Ask the school? Careers staff or head of sixth or similar. Check with 6th form college?

It wasn't on my radar at all until my children started their GCSEs either. Obviously now we're in the GCSE years it very much at the forefront of almost every homework, school work, future planning conversation. I now have English and Maths tutors booked in and it's costing a fortune but if they want to go to college and not have to resit I feel like I have little choice!

Having spent hours helping with homework (up there with the most stressful things I have ever done!!!) I can see the relevance of the topics especially Maths.

Good luck to anyone with DC sitting maths today.
And more good luck to anyone with a DC re-sitting.
And a whole tonne to any re-re-sitting.

Both my sons have ASD, ADHD and complex medical needs. Both went to special schools. Eldest is a maths whizz and very academic. Youngest is the opposite. He managed to pass functional skills maths at the second attempt whilst at college studying to be a personal trainer. Finished top of his cohort despite being the youngest. He is now a qualified tennis coach who earns more than I do, all at the age of 18! He still struggles with maths so needs help understanding basic bookkeeping and tax returns, which I'm happy to do and none of which are taught in school anyway. I couldn't be more proud of him for trying his best with academic subjects, and finding his passion outside of school, then making it his career.

Forcing kids with SEND to endlessly resit exams is damaging to their self esteem and awful for their parents too.

I use maths everyday at work as part of my job but I totally appreciate that people do find it difficult and they sometimes get a glazed expression in their eyes when I talk about some maths thing I find interesting.

There is so much more to maths than people learn at school - and it could be made so much more interesting for people.

I do follow maths people in YouTube - granted sometimes they get quite into their maths but there are some really interesting maths communicators who can make maths interesting without going too much into complex equations.

Hannah Fry is a great maths communicator

I am cringeing for you with your posts. Passing a maths exam requires so many different skills, and people’s brains are wired differently. There are also complicating factors like focus and concentration, social factors, stamina, confidence etc. I am astonished an adult doesn’t know this.

Perhaps you should have paid more attention yourself.

Yes, I have seen that. I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole unless I was desperate, yet people take out loans to buy holidays and run up massive debts on store cards. I'd sooner go without.

It helps that I was brought up to go without rather than borrow, the importance of savings, etc and living within your means. And ultimately, that really been all the 'life-maths' I have ever needed.

It's been nice to be asked. Thank you for asking how I managed without assuming I just rely on others, and my life is some terrible struggle. Some of the posts on here are frankly depressing.

That's really good to hear.

And yes, just because people understand maths doesn't mean they can use it sensibly.

APR being one example. I saw an advert on TV for a loan at 1001% APR yesterday.

It's surprisingly not as hard as you might think. The brain is quite good at adapting. As a simple example, some here have mentioned shopping. I know enough to make a damn good estimate about price differences on special offers, and I have been shopping for myself for 32 years. It's amazing how accurate I am now.

I used to always pay with notes pre cashless society, to avoid faffing with change, but as with everything else, experience means you find your own way to do it. There's only a certain number of coin combinations it could be. I know the combinations.

This will surprise you, but I used to work in a small resort shop. We used to accept Euros. We had the latest exchange rates on a sign on the wall. I could accept Euros and give English change where colleagues struggled, because I understood all I had to do was put the English value of the Euros handed to me into the till. I was giving English change. All I had to do was read the sheet. Others got into a right mess trying to work it out in their heads when everything they needed was in front of them. I have to think differently, find the 'cheat' if you will. Not being able to understand the way everyone else does things can mean I am not encumbered with an inability to find another method.

It's all about paying attention and using the skills I do have to compensate. Budgeting is actually really simple when you make it so. All I need to understand is receipts must be higher than outgoings. I am not completely number blind in that I understand that 9 is greater than 5 for example (some with dyscalculia don't). I am very good with home finance because I understand income and expenditure.

Mortgages somebody else mentioned, again, why do I need GCSE maths to understand what I needed to pay a mortgage and bills? My husband and I have now paid ours off after 25 years because we earned enough to meet the monthly payments between us. What more did I need to know?

I understand APR because unlike some folk who have got maths GCSE, I read the small print. I've never had a payday loan, but I absolutely understand the whopping number they put next to the letters 'APR' in the tiny print on the advert.

Same with credit cards. All I actually need to know is that I must pay it off every month. If I knew I wouldn't be able to do that, I wouldn't be using the card that month. It's surprising how many people with much better maths brains than me, and that GCSE we can't apparently do without don't understand interest on things like store cards. I do. I couldn't do the precise calculation but I understand the concept that if you run up a debt on it you will have to pay back more than you would if you paid promptly.

It's about maximising what I do understand IYSWIM. Of course, there's things I can't do, like people with other disabilities. But I have never been out of work, in debt aside from a mortgage, I have savings and a pension, like most people with that magic grade I haven't got. On the whole, it really hasn't made much difference. Let's face it, a grade C, or 4 as it is now wasn't exactly going to see me on the path to some Megabucks finance job, or get me on course to be a brain surgeon.

Luckily, I could still do a degree because they weren't as fussy when I was doing it about me having maths to study English Literature. I know that's changed now, and I understand why, but it's daft to close doors to bright people who excel at a subject because they can't do another.

I agree some things are easy for some people
Some people can do no.revision and ace exams purely because that's the way their brain works
Other ,s work incredibly hard but have to.put in a huge amount of efforts to do well in exams
And then you have others that work very hard but will never pass maths because they are just not able too.

Further comment - my DH used to teach Maths at night school to adults who had never got their O-level and most got decent grades. They said he had a way of explaining things that they had never had at school. Later in life he gave extra tuition to a friend's DD who wanted to be a music teacher but struggled hopelessly with Maths (essential for her course) and again said his alternative explanations were fantastic. She is now a music teacher in school. Just before Christmas our DGS (age 12) asked him if he could help with a maths topic that he didn't understand (and DGS is a very bright boy with no apparent learning issues) and within 20 minutes he was all smiles - "Grandad has a great way of explaining things" he said.

My DH has no training as a teacher, he's just good at explaining stuff.

So my advice would be to get some extra tuition to get your kids that elusive grade as an alternative approach might just do the trick for some of them.

My DH is available in N Derbyshire - free of charge for a cup of coffee and a home-made sticky bun!

DS is 20 and I'm not sure if it's the 4th or 5th time he's resitting. He just about scraped his English last year but he hasn't got a chance of passing Maths. He has learning difficulties and went to special school but has continued on to a adult learning college. He'll most likely keep resitting until his EHCP is up.

It's a complete waste of his and the college's time. He can read and write and has amazing digital art skills but he just can't do numbers. He can count out loud but can't get his head around a number relating to the amount of items in front of him. Its like trying to teach him a language he's never going to understand.

But that is what makes maths so hard - not only do you need to be able to understand the language of maths you need to be able to work out the problem itself which is an English language issue

If shes got time, she can sometimes see her mistakes. But she's slower than average at reading (due to her dyslexia) so she often doesn't have time.e to finish, let alone check her spellings...

Fortunately, it looks like she will have just enough wriggle room to get a 4 in English at GCSE.

Thanks for your reply.

How do you find it in real life - when everyday maths is useful. Calculators do make maths that much easier but you've still got to make sense of the calculation and to understand what the answer means.

I don't understand why some posters are so smug.

Bit of a stealth boast here. I passed O level French with an A with zero revision because it was really easy - for me.

Did the "I think GCSE maths is easy and only idiots fail it" get an A in French O level (or the easier GCSE) with no revision?

The differences is that I completely understand that not everyone has a natural aptitide for languages (I also have German O level and French A level).

I apologise for my smug post 😊

ODFOD. My DD may have struggled with maths and just scrapped a pass but she has compassion and empathy by the bucket load. She could probably give you some of it actually, balance out your smug attitude.

No you didn’t

And I am guessing she can't see what she has done wrong?

Yes, you are right. In a spelling test, your daughter would likely not pass. But in an essay answer or composition, the spelling is only a percentage.

In a maths exam, there's some room, as you get points for your workings out, even if the answer is wrong on some questions, but I couldn't do the workings out.

It's fascinating talking about this. I don't usually. It's been over 20 years since my dyscalculia diagnosis. I mostly hide it.

Thats sort of how my DD describes spelling. (She has dyslexia). She knows how to spell the word "the" as an example. But sometimes the letters just don't come out right, and she will write "teh".
Or she will put a random capital in the middle of a word.

The difference is she will only lose a few marks on any test for her spelling. But you would just get the whole question wrong as the numbers would be wrong?

Conceptually, yes, but almost as though it's separate from the actual computation. For example, I use the % button on the calculator (now I have found it and figured out how to use it) rather than doing the actual sum to get there because I can't remember it.

What I'm trying to say (badly, I don't verbalise this often) is that I understand in an abstract, disconnected way. As you present it there, and as I have understood it, it makes perfect actual sense. But I can't relate that knowledge in words to what that means I need to do with the numbers. So when I actually have to do the maths, in that moment, no, I guess I don't understand what I am doing. But if you asked me what the concept of percentages means ten minutes later, I could give you the words.

When I write it, I realise how daft that's going to sound to someone who gets it. No wonder my teachers didn't know what to do with me.