Do phalloplasties actually work?

Not so long ago, people undergoing extreme cosmetic surgeries in order to create a facsimile of the body of the opposite sex, had to sign forms to make it clear that they understood that the operation in no way changed their sex. They would always remain the sex they were born. Now many of these young people genuinely believe they can change sex and that these surgeries are somehow getting them closer to the point that they ‘become’ the opposite sex. Not really surprising when they have had this drummed into them since school and my TRA and TikTok.

I’ve explained that’s not possible though.

A trans forum is heavily policed and no one is able to speak freely and detrans forums don’t exist.

This is in no alway equivalent to men talking about abortion!

Try and see it as more women with some life experience, some with medical experience and a few transmen (you seem to have ignored missed the trans person on the thread?) discussing the blatant exploitation of young women with mental health issues and see if that helps your aversion to this thread?

Thanks for helping it stay bumped though.

Maybe men discussing womb transplants would be a better analogy.

I agree. But the best place to get "a solid grounding in medical facts" about abortion would not be a forum for men which is notably anti-abortion, just like the best place to get medical facts about phalloplasty is unlikely to be Mumsnet.

If a man wanted to get an answer to questions like "Do women regret abortions? Can they still have babies after an abortion? How long after an abortion can women have sex again?" you would be happy for them to ask a form of men and not involve any women? Really?

And obviously lots of men are pro-choice. But in this specific example, I'm comparing said forum of men to Mumsnet which is notoriously gender critical. So in the example, the form would be known for being anti-abortion.

That just made my blood run cold

I think men should talk about abortion, looking at the abortion bans in the U.S. we certainly heard from lots of men who seemed to have little factual knowledge of what was medically possible, or necessary or dangerous to the health of the mother.

If we start from everyone having a solid grounding in medical facts then it’s a much easier discussion.

If a man wanted to ask question of other men about abortion then I have no issue with that. Why do you think men will be hostile to those who have had abortions? Many men are quite pleased that it provides a way for them to avoid an unplanned child.

Exactly, who knows?

They can discuss it. But I think it would be horrifying if someone was asking specific questions about the experience of having an abortion to a forum of people who a) have never had an abortion and b) are likely to be hostile to those who have, and expecting accurate answers. Surely most women would find that idea abhorrent?

Yes. It occurred to me earlier - have some of these girls even seen a real penis?

Your first paragraph is a very good point, thank you. I still think it would be unfortunate if OP only asks these questions here, as it's not going to give her a range of views. But I do take your point about not invading trans people's space.

I asked the question because I was genuinely curious about the answer. OP might well have come back and said "actually I've also asked in X Y and Z spaces to get a range of views". Or she might have come back and said "I think phalloplasty is awful and actually what I wanted to do was talk about it in a place where I suspect my concerns will be shared". Both valid responses.

Me too.

This - was about to post the same.

Why don’t you think men should be allowed to discuss abortion?

Well. you'd be wrong. I know two. That may not be enough for you?
And I don't think you're posting as a disinterested observer.

I care because I think it is vitally important that discussions about trans people involve trans people / people who formally identified as trans. Particularly when the conversation was prompted by specific questions. I would be equally horrified to see a conversation about, for example, abortion taking place on a male-dominated forum.

If I were a post operative trans man, I think I’d find a woman with no apparent skin in the game coming on to a dedicated TM forum and asking these questions deeply invasive and intrusive. They don’t need looky-loos prodding at them in a space they deem safe to discuss their issues. By coming here OP can access clinical professionals and parents of TMs - of which there are plenty on these boards.

Perhaps you should ask yourself why you are invading this space to critique other people’s conversation choices. Perhaps you should pop over to Reddit and leave us to our discussion, especially given you have added nothing to it yourself?

Hilarious that you think a forum for surgeons making money from this type of surgery and who are very invested in maintaining their income, their ability to practice and avoid malpractice suites is the best place to get unbiased answers.

Tell us why you're so determined that women shouldn't be asking these questions, reading research and discussing it? Because your posts seem so similar to the original #nodebate so beloved of the proponents of this bullying ideology determined to gaslight the young and sell sex change as the cure for their mental vulnerabilities.

I do take your point, and certainly it would be best to ask the question in a variety of places where trans men / their HCPs would be in order to try to get an overview of opinions. But I still think those people are unlikely to be on MN in any great numbers, so there are better forums to ask those questions.

Success for peeing standing. Yes lots of complications. As I said, I don't know how those compare with other surgeries but it does seem very high with overall complications in 75%. My point was more that its best to look to the literature rather than look through reddit or on mumsnet. Perhaps my next post was more nuanced that it is difficult for us outside to define success. But I suppose reddit and even more, mumsnet can point to sources of scientific evidence

What is most concerning about all of this is the lack of clarity when it comes to expectations versus reality.

What are these vulnerable young people being told by medical providers when they have these conversations? If they think they can produce sperm then there's a significant problem with comprehension.

Now I hope that's in the minority, but are expectations being properly managed? Can a young person with little sexual experience even understand the implications of being anorgasmic for example? Are there being told about the level of complications and revisions these surgeries often require?

This is such a complex area with regards to medical consent and yet so many people don't even want us to raise these issues for discussion 🤯

Yes, it is quite revealing how desperate some people are to stop discussion of the horrendous outcomes of phalloplasty, the lack of informed consent given by the young girls undertaking it, the egging on of those young girls by influencers and TRA sites, the much higher post-surgery suicide rates, the fact that surgery has not been found to reduce dysphoria/improve mental health.

Or discuss the awful complications arising from this extreme cosmetic surgery.

There are several regular transmen users.

If you are not pro phalloplasty why do you care what answers the OP is getting? And again, why are you not horrified that your taxes (presumably) are being used to harm young women? (Regardless of whether they think they want it, the NHS knows they are too young).