Should a Brain Surgeon be up at night with a baby doing night feeds ?

Doctor here (although not a surgeon, but understand how doctors job plans work), and assuming you are talking about UK.

Surgeons do not operate "every single day", they have planned theatre lists and then intermittent on calls where they will be operating on any emergencies.

The rest of the time they will have - ward rounds, clinics, admin sessions, delivering teaching, meetings.

I'd like to hear the context of the query: I don't believe that you are a surgeon, as you'd already know this. If you are a patient, it's odd that you know this level of detail about your surgeon.

Where I live (not in the UK) there is one brain surgeon for our larger area. He is a private surgeon and our govt health system is not to be relied on. We have unfortunately had to deal with this guy with two separate family members in the last few years and know a few other people in our area who have needed him. I am always astounded at the hours he works and often find myself questioning how he functions at work, sees his family and manages to run a few marathons. Often he will still be doing hospital rounds late at night and to get a consult with him for anything other than an emergency is almost impossible. His rooms have 3 consult suites so he moves between them where the patients have been setup by his nurses to avoid delays between seeing patients (ie he moves rooms rather than patients being seen into his room individually). He has a good reputation and is evidently a good surgeon but I do wonder how long someone can maintain that level of attentiveness to his profession before he burns out. Some people are superhuman and called to it.

How much do you think a brain surgeon earns?? They’re not the Kardashians 😆

No, and in my opinion nor should lorry drivers, construction workers, heart surgeons, welders etc. Anything that is already a semi dangerous or high risk job (to them or others). This goes for both men and women. If the mum was the brain surgeon and baby was up in the night when mum was back at work, then it should be dad

No but if the other partner is working as well, they should hire help.

I don't want ANYONE massively sleep deprived operating in ANY safety critical role!

I delayed important orthopaedic surgery (on me😬) when I discovered the surgeon was only just off the plane from New Zealand the previous day.... (this was a luxury as my work at time gave me private medical insurance)

I went back to work as a hospital consultant (not neurosurgery) when my babies were both under a year. I worked full-time and it was so tough. However, my husband was working full time too. We shared the night wake ups. It never crossed my mind not to work and I did my best.

I am from the generation where we did 56 hour shifts. So at the weekend I could potentially go three nights in a row with very very little sleep. And that was not just me, that was everybody in my firm including registrars and consultants.

You do just get on with it. I remember assisting with operations as a junior after having not had sleep all night. The consultant was often very sleep-deprived too. It was hideous but we accepted it.

None of this is ideal, but you’d be surprised how much adrenaline gets you through the day. Though when it’s a chronic state, I am sure mistakes are made and it is not ideal at all.

However, I do not think you can get out of working because you have had disrupted sleep, due to a baby or anything else. There are many jobs with responsibility. A neurosurgeon is just one of them.

I would love to know the stats on male versus female doctor parents who expect to be let off newborn night wakings because of their job...

I came on to say exactly this. A neurosurgeon is earning enough to buy in help or condoms so there no kid to consider at all.

If both of you are brain surgeons then you should easily be able to afford a night nanny.

Why should they?

And that’s the problem… I’m a surgeon and I operate on an artery to the brain. When I had DS 1 I was 33 and a registrar ( still doing surgery though) . DH had a bigger job than me. I went back to work at 10 months. DS was a toddler who slept badly during his second year. He would wake at 2 am and take hours to settle. We had a nanny / nursery place but there was no way we could afford a night nanny as well . I did on call at least once a week leaving DH sleep deprived. When I did a whole week of on call nights, my mum came down a few times to give DH a break .

We muddled through . DH would try to take the hit if we knew I was operating the next day. At one point I crashed the car on the way to work and took a week off. I was broken. You can’t take 2 years off during surgical training.

I’m sure there are loads of parents of young children muddling though the early years sleep deprived.
If I had a baby as a consultant when I am paid twice the amount I would pay a night nanny but women don’t have their babies in their 40s usually.

No but they should earn enough to pay for a night nanny

Absolutely bloody not. Of all the professions that needs its sleep, brain surgery is right up there!

Don't be ridiculous. Of course the brain surgeon should have slept well enough to do such an important job, unsure why their partner would feel disgruntled. It's getting to the stage I feel parents on MN aren't capable of doing night feeds on their own going by recent posts.

Tell your partner to quit their job so they can do night feeds, that way they're not risking their patients lives and everyone is happy.

'Brain surgery? It's hardly Rocket Science, is it?'

2 doctors takking about how people function on little sleep.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002b6rs?partner=uk.co.bbc&origin=share-mobile

Actually an awful lot easier, at least you are not required to make complex judgments at 3am with a new born, neither do you need to get dressed. Honestly baby care is a walk in the park compared to being a junior Dr.

I would expect anyone who wants to become a parent to figure out a way to balance the demands of their job and their parenting role. That doesn’t mean leaving all the responsibility to the other parent. If they can’t figure out a solution, then they shouldn’t have a baby.

I wouldn't worry about surgery, there are enough people in theatre to be watching what is done / not done.

The thing you need to worry about is when they are in clinic and making an error writing in your notes or giving you a prescription.

No, the brain surgeon should be paying for a nanny to make sure their husband or wife gets plenty of sleep, since they obviously cannot do their job safely if they are tired.

I’d expect you to have a partner who can support you or for you to have wraparound care. Surely once you’re not on maternity leave anymore you aren’t still BFing through the night every 3 hours. If you were I’d expect pumping would be needed so you could actually rest. I’m shocked a surgeon wouldn’t be able to afford any help with care?!

Perhaps in certain parts of the country. Doubtful in the South East with the high costs there and the amount of tax high earners have to pay.

You would hope that they would be on maternity leave if this was the case, although I know some people breastfeed until quite late on. I think they should seriously consider switching to expressed bottles or formula in this scenario.

No, I wouldn’t expect so in this case. However, I do think that on nights where they’re not on shift the next day (or however the shift pattern works), they should pick up their share of the parenting and catch up on some ZZZs in the morning/next available opportunity. Just not, for example, up 1-3am with baby and then starting an opp at 7am.