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To what extent should an offenders background be taken into consideration when sentencing?

83 replies

Bobbyewingshowerscene · 08/05/2025 12:03

I have just listened to BBC Radio 4’s Moral Maze in which the above question is being interrogated by the panelists.
It’s a good listen (as are all the episodes, each considering a different subject) and I will try to post the link.

In my profession I see more than most, the impact of upbringing - or Lived Experience as we call it now- and understand the correlations between poor parenting, absent fathers, poor socio economic conditions, exclusion from school, material/ emotional needs not being met etc as well
as outright abuse and neglect etc.
For this reason we do already have pre- sentencing reports in some cases for judges to consider when sentencing.

However what worries me is if this argument is taken to its full conclusion and ‘Lived experience’ is seen as a mitigating factor in all cases how would this impact on he following :

Abuse of a child where the perp was abused themselves

Domestic violence against an intimate partner by someone who was systematically exposed to this in their own home growing up.

A rapist/ paedophile who was sexually abused as a child/ teen

A mugger of old ladies who has experienced extreme material deprivation all their life

A persistent stalker who has a learning need and attachment issues.

A house burglar/mugger who is funding a substance use issue due to self-
medicating childhood trauma

I mean apart from obvious way this would fail victims and the public at large in terms of reducing risk of sentences were shorter, what about free will and agency.

Would this not actually conversely suggest that people from a challenging background present more of an innate risk to the general public as are less in control than the general population?

OP posts:
Badgerandfox227 · 08/05/2025 14:00

I think once you reach adulthood, you need to be held fully responsible for your actions, however bad your background or upbringing has been. Only exception should be mental capacity.

People know the basics of what is right or wrong, whatever their circumstances.

TY78910 · 08/05/2025 13:55

minnienono · 08/05/2025 12:27

Remember that these lived experiences may also be used to direct the person once inside to appropriate services to try to work through the trauma thus preventing future offending. They do not reduce the sentence of child abusers because they were abused themselves, I asked this at a q&a and was told categorically no, it’s about directing towards therapy or placement in most appropriate facility eg a prison with specific facilities

This is something I’ve always wondered as it’s the explanation I agree with.

offenders need to be made accountable for their actions absolutely, but I do also believe that nobody who is ‘typical’ (I don’t want to use the word normal) would ever have the capacity to kill / rape / assault. People generally know right from wrong. So something’s gone wrong in someone’s brain to have the urge and will to do that. On that basis I do think that whatever specific therapies are appropriate to their time in prison or another closed facility.

I have seen a C4 programme though (I think it was called the jury) to see if two different juries would reach the same verdict in which the guy had murdered his wife but he wanted to bring sentence down to manslaughter arguing that her abuse towards him made him snap. It was interesting.

OlympicProcrastinator · 08/05/2025 13:48

Seventree · 08/05/2025 13:32

It's a really interesting topic. We know that life experiences, especially in childhood, make affect the likelihood of someone committing crimes.

But that doesn't change anything for the victims of crime, or for the risk someone poses to the public.

My view is that pre sentencing reports shouldn't routinely be used to reduce sentences (though in some circumstances it might appropriate if counselling or courses recommended). But that they should generally be used to provide instructions for extra support in prison to help prevent reoffending.

So, if someone is sentenced for domestic violence offences and it comes to light that they experienced/were exposed to domestic violence as a child, their sentence should include counselling and workshops to help them process this and understand healthy relationships going forward.

The judge can attach orders to a sentence, particularly community sentences such as alcohol reduction services, mental health interventions and drug counselling.

Once people enter prison, their offender managers or probation officers in prison (for high risk offenders) do take into account the different aspects of their life that may have contributed to their offending and incorporate it as much as possible into their sentence plan. So this is already being done.

However, it is much more effective in the female estate than the male estate which is seriously overstretched and funding for partner services have been cut.

Arancia · 08/05/2025 13:48

I also sat a very long rape case where the perpetrator only had minor offences on his record already, but because of the brutality of his crimes against several women, and all the evidence stacked up against him, he got the most severe punishment, without consideration for his childhood, background, otherwise okay criminal record and the fact he was in a good place in life with his own business and home.

SingtotheCat · 08/05/2025 13:47

Burntt · 08/05/2025 12:22

I don’t think it should be taken into account when sentencing. Many people suffer horrible childhoods and don’t grow up to perteptuate these patterns in behaviour.

i do however feel VERY strongly we should be tackling adverse childhood experiences as a matter of urgency so our next generations won’t have to have quite so much childhood trauma taken into account. This for me is better education, quality early years support, real robust protection for abused women and children. Reproductive education and access to contraception. Support for special needs and disability. Living wages. Initiatives to get children growing up in poverty out of poverty. Non resident parents being held to account more if they don’t provide financially for their children. And better mental health support for children and adults.

This.

Arancia · 08/05/2025 13:44

I'm not from the UK, and in my country you volunteer - and get elected by our national body of jurisdiction and courthouses - to become a juror. I have been a juror for about 7 years now, and in my experience people's background are considered to some extend - and, to some extend, impact their sentence. But, it very much, if not entirely, depends on the severity of the crime, past patterns, and where in life they are in the present. I recently sat a case where two young men, friends, had committed the same crimes together - one of them got off fairly lightly while the other did not. Same crimes, different sentences. Primarily because the first-mentioned man didn't have too much on his criminal record already, and because he had demonstrated succesfully that he had been in a good place in his life for a very extended period (years): he was in school, had a stable job, had cut off his toxic social circle, stopped doing drugs, etc.

The other young man, on the other hand, had a much longer sheet of offences behind him, showed no sign of remorse, and also did not demonstrate to the judge and jury that he had made any attempts at changing his life around for the better since being arrested. Nor did his past patterns indicate that he's likely to - on the contrary. So yeah, he got a prison sentence and a huge fine.

Seventree · 08/05/2025 13:32

It's a really interesting topic. We know that life experiences, especially in childhood, make affect the likelihood of someone committing crimes.

But that doesn't change anything for the victims of crime, or for the risk someone poses to the public.

My view is that pre sentencing reports shouldn't routinely be used to reduce sentences (though in some circumstances it might appropriate if counselling or courses recommended). But that they should generally be used to provide instructions for extra support in prison to help prevent reoffending.

So, if someone is sentenced for domestic violence offences and it comes to light that they experienced/were exposed to domestic violence as a child, their sentence should include counselling and workshops to help them process this and understand healthy relationships going forward.

OpalShaker · 08/05/2025 13:24

MyOliveHelper · 08/05/2025 13:16

If protecting the public was the primary motivation, only violent offenders would be jailed.

I didn't say it was the primary motivation, just that it plays a part.

And public protection doesn;t apply to only violent offenders, it also applies to non-contact sexual offenders, drug dealers, prolific shoplifters, fraud, scammers, and on and on.

MakingSpaceForJoy · 08/05/2025 13:22

I can give an example.

I was hit by someone who was high on drugs and a repeat offender. Each time he got caught he just got a sentence for that incident which was very lenient. In my case it was one years driving ban. No previous arrests and charges taken into consideration.

So, he’s already done this multiple times. It’s only a matter of time before he kills someone. So, with that in mind do you not think a judge should say “you haven’t learnt your lesson, you are reckless, and dangerous. You’ve done this 3 times and you are now going to jail”.

ilovesooty · 08/05/2025 13:19

Lavender14 · 08/05/2025 12:25

So for me, I think there's two prongs to the criminal system - one is justice ie, holding someone accountable for their actions or behaviours, the other for me is about appropriate intervention to reduce the risk of reoffending.

While I absolutely sympathise with any victim of crime (I've been a victim of a genuinely terrifying crime myself) I think the most important part is the second part because that's what creates a safer society and reduces the risk to both the victim and other people. And that is utterly dependent on understanding WHY someone has done what they've done. So in that respect, to me, the 'right' justice is the one that helps stop the same thing from happening again.

I also think free will is obviously very important, but we also can't pretend that everyone is starting on a level playing field and there are many perpetrators of crime who have done what they've done because they've actually been a victim of crime themselves. A perfect example of this is young people who grow up in care being significantly more likely to be groomed by gangs and exploitated into doing criminal activity that benefits the gang. Its highly targeted and extensive and there's only so much the system can do as it stands to protect vulnerable and traumatised children from falling prey to this. It's possible to be both a criminal and a victim at the same time and I do think it's crucial that's taken into account in sentencing, otherwise you create a system that is so focused on making examples of the people they catch that they miss the instigators, the cycle continues and the reoffending rates remain high. We know statistically that harsh sentencing isn't a good enough deterrent for many types of crimes.

Good post.

ilovesooty · 08/05/2025 13:18

Ablondiebutagoody · 08/05/2025 12:24

Nice try Kier

His name is Keir.

And that's ridiculous.

Snorlaxo · 08/05/2025 13:18

If you give lighter sentences as a result of organisations like social services not acting sooner then you are not going to raise people who have been damaged by say abuse to the level of society.

We will have a justice system where caring families lie that they abused their children to get them lighter sentences.

I know that people in prison are more likely to be abused etc but that’s the responsibility of social services and police to protect the kids before they are criminals. We have a system where those groups have a lack of resources so overlook what appears minor but acting when things aren’t serious is surely where you have a chance of changing things ?

MyOliveHelper · 08/05/2025 13:16

OpalShaker · 08/05/2025 13:15

Not entirely. It's also about punishment and protection of the public.

If protecting the public was the primary motivation, only violent offenders would be jailed.

OpalShaker · 08/05/2025 13:15

MyOliveHelper · 08/05/2025 13:11

It makes sense in theory, because in theory, criminal punishment is about rehabilitation. The way criminals should be rehabilitated will depend on their individual motivations for commiting crime and barriers to being a productive and/or harmless citizen, so you'd need a pre-sentencing report to determine how, where and for how long a sentence should take place.

But then you'd also have several settings where different types of rehabilitation could occur with different levels of restriction for the people sentenced there.

Not entirely. It's also about punishment and protection of the public.

MyOliveHelper · 08/05/2025 13:11

It makes sense in theory, because in theory, criminal punishment is about rehabilitation. The way criminals should be rehabilitated will depend on their individual motivations for commiting crime and barriers to being a productive and/or harmless citizen, so you'd need a pre-sentencing report to determine how, where and for how long a sentence should take place.

But then you'd also have several settings where different types of rehabilitation could occur with different levels of restriction for the people sentenced there.

SinkToTheBottomWithYou · 08/05/2025 12:51

Sentencing shouldn’t be impacted by circumstances - however support should be offered (in addition, not instead!) : therapy, help to get qualifications, help to geographically move away from a bad influence, etc.

Sentencing should always reflect the harm done - if I’m robbed or abused, the damage to me (and society as a whole) is the same regardless of the perpetrator’s background.

Bobbyewingshowerscene · 08/05/2025 12:41

On the road currently will read thread on break later.
x

OP posts:
JoyousEagle · 08/05/2025 12:37

minnienono · 08/05/2025 12:27

Remember that these lived experiences may also be used to direct the person once inside to appropriate services to try to work through the trauma thus preventing future offending. They do not reduce the sentence of child abusers because they were abused themselves, I asked this at a q&a and was told categorically no, it’s about directing towards therapy or placement in most appropriate facility eg a prison with specific facilities

I don’t think OP was saying that they do reduce sentences in those cases. She was presenting it as an hypothetical example for her question of how far do you take circumstances into account. I think

JoyousEagle · 08/05/2025 12:36

I think it would be better for everyone (victims and offenders) to put effort into mitigating the circumstances before, rather than reducing the sentence afterwards.
For example, people who were in care as children are considerably overrepresented in prison. I think it would be better to look into why and put much more resources into supporting children in care (and those aging out of care). But, let’s be honest, more resources for those children/young adults isn’t going to happen.

There’s also too many nuances to give a blanket answer. Your OP talks about someone who was sexually abused as a child - well if they are now 50 and sexually abuse a child, no, I wouldn’t consider that to be mitigation. If they are 13 and still being abused themselves, I’d consider that to be quite a different situation in terms of the best way to deal with it, despite them being over the age of criminal responsibility (although of course still horrific for the victim).

You also give the example of someone with learning difficulties. I would think that that should always be considered when sentencing.

driedgrasses · 08/05/2025 12:33

None really. Life isn't fair and some people are dealt a shitty hand, but that's no excuse not to take personal responsibility for your own decisions. These people aren't stealing bread because they're starving. Most of us can provide a bleeding heart sob story, but most don't go around committing crime. I'm aware that prisoners often need therapy, but people on the outside can't access therapy either so?......

Ohthatsabitshit · 08/05/2025 12:32

Justice is nuanced and cannot be applied in any real way without circumstance. I think it’s ludicrous to suggest anyone should be sentenced without all circumstances including those you mentioned being considered. Draconian zero tolerance hard line thinking is pathetic.

OpalShaker · 08/05/2025 12:31

I don't think it effects sentencing all that much.

Having worked in youth justice there were in my opinion, too many staff who thought a bad background or trauma meant the person shouldn't really be held responsible and it wasn;t 'trauma-informed' to suggest otherwise.

Which has contributed in my opinion, to the horrible rise in serious youth crime and knife crime.

I think the tide is turning now and David Camerons 'hug a hoodie' philosophy has been proven to be an abject failure.

TeenagersAngst · 08/05/2025 12:30

There should be absolutely no argument for sentencing guidelines to recommend lighter sentences for people according to their backgrounds. Judges already have recourse to mitigating factors when deciding on sentences so there is already leeway in the system. Any more than that and you really do have two tier justice.

But there is absolutely a place for prison to be a rehabilitating experience for all people. I agree with PP that personal background information could be used in prisons to evaluate prisoner need.

Lavender14 · 08/05/2025 12:27

Also I would say we need to be mindful of discrimination in the justice system and within policing. If certain young people are more likely to be stopped and searched because of appearance/ family reputation- they're more likely to be repeatedly done for offending while others may escape with no record. Is it fair to make examples of those people who have only been caught out due to discrimination and unjust structures? I wouldn't say that's ethical either.

minnienono · 08/05/2025 12:27

Remember that these lived experiences may also be used to direct the person once inside to appropriate services to try to work through the trauma thus preventing future offending. They do not reduce the sentence of child abusers because they were abused themselves, I asked this at a q&a and was told categorically no, it’s about directing towards therapy or placement in most appropriate facility eg a prison with specific facilities

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