Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor - you have blood on your hands

Have any of the men who had sex with trafficked girls, organised by Epstein, ever seen the inside of a court?

Jean-Luc Brunel:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60443518

I am so sorry for what you have been through. It is very sad that on this thread you have felt the need to describe your own horrific experiences to illustrate to certain posters just how much the odds are against victims getting justice.

None of it was tested in court.

Were there more pictures than the one where Andrew had his arm around her? I have a photo of me with my arm around Martin Kemp. It doesn't prove anything either than that we were both in the same place at the same time!

Who were the "countless witnesses" and what was their testimony?

I imagine he could provide medical evidence if he doesn't sweat but I'm not sure he would have been able to prove he was in Pizza Express years later?

It isn't unusual for people if Andrew's age, my age, to refer to meeting up with friends as "going out to play". It refers to not working and seeing friends. I often say to DH that I'm going out to play with the girls. I often ask thebDC if they have been out for a play with any of their old school friends.

It does not refer or relate to anything sexual. That, I am afraid, is your mind.

No it is not relevant. This thread is about PA his potential culpability and the connivance of the RF; the extent to which he & they tolerate sex offenders in their company is relevant to that. We are not discussing the Obamas here.

No it is not relevant. This thread is about PA his potential culpability and the connivance of the RF; the extent to which he & they tolerate sex offenders in their company is relevant to that. We are not discussing the Obamas here.

Clearly relevant if you want to expand the link beyond Andrew to the wider 'Royal Fold'. You linked Harvey Weinstein to Princess Beatrice’s 18th birthday party (apparently 400 guests were invited) - the Obamas trusted Weinstein with their 18 year old daughter.

If you are addressing that at me, which you are clearly, it's absolute nonsense because I have not said or supported any of those things.

Yes, there are many parallels. Thanks!

Many women experience the parallel situation of sexual exploitation in real life and are accused of being liars by society and other women experiencing internalised misogyny, despite whatever evidence they bring. Especially in the UK.

Long live the male self-entitlement! Don't we just love to support it? The women exploited can go kill themselves, but they shouldn't expect that that will persuade anyone differently.

Next victim please!
Repeat.

I don't see how HW's links to the Obamas are relevant to the situation here, of 3 sex offenders welcomed within the Royal Fold and invited to Royal residences.

But on the subject of the Obamas: what they did do as soon HW's behaviour came to light, was publicly denounce HW and show solidarity with his victims. Unlike Andrew who continued to maintain his friendship with Epstein after his conviction.

I don't see what your point is. Having your arm around a stranger is no proof of anything. You wasted a lot of time writing those parallels though!

He’s not a pedophile. Pedophiles are attracted to pre-pubescent children.

Assuming the allegations are true, then he did her damage for sure, but there isn’t one reason a person takes their own life and she had considerably more problems than him.

He should be retired from all public royal events. Whether they invite him for Christmas or not is up to them I’d say.

Did you make a serious allegation against Martin Kemp?

Was Martin Kemp friends with and doing business with a notoriously well known human sex trafficker?

Were you in another country solely at the behest of that trafficker when you met M.K and said photo was taken?

Was M.K caught lying in an interview about the length of time he remained in contact with your Sex trafficker? Caught lying about being in a Pizza eatery at the time of the alleged meeting?

Sure the picture in itself proves nothing, very strictly speaking. But the context adds a lot of weight to the balance of probabilities that what was alleged happened.

Epstein was running a bribery cartel and if Andrew is an idiot, I don't believe Ghislaine Maxwell is as stupid. Especially with who her father was and her background. Yet she is openly in the backdrop of the photo, smiling in a very pleased manner. Why would she allow such a photo to be taken? One with her in it, and one with no other than Prince Andrew, her supposed friend with a lot to lose, with his arms around Virginia? I assume it was the done thing to have video footage or camera evidence of all high profile sexual liaisons with the women and whilst Epstein's mansions were kitted out with surveillance paraphernalia, the flat they were in at the time wasn't. So a picture had to suffice and that was the best opportune moment, when he's high on the thought of soon getting the goods and is being ridiculously incautious. Ghislaine is in the background as authentication.

So if you or anyone here, had come with a photo of any celebrity and the details were the same as in this case I would weigh it up and fall down on the side of believing you until I see persuasive counter details of the same strength and magnitude.

After all, there was never any possibility of Andrew getting into a court room, and whilst that may protect one in the letter of things because, after all 'you cannot be found guilty in law, if no law is set to bear' it leaves him without the protection of exoneration from doubt. It leaves him open to speculation and being judged in the court of public opinion. That is the open court arena he has deliberately chosen. People with reason will do a probability ratio, speculate and arrive at conclusions that tie in with the known facts. How likely is it that PA would have refused sex with a young attractive girl put under his nose to entrap him by a sex trafficker that he was repeatedly exposing himself to? How likely is it that the photo is actually, in fact doctored?

Having endured, like so many women, inappropriate sexual encounters with men without a tenth of the power and entitlement of PA and taking into account the background context. I believe he did it.

Thank you for saying this. The Windsor’s have a history of protecting known pedophiles. Pedo Andrew is no different.

It’s always the same things people say “the age of consent is 16” (no, not for sex trafficking victims it isn’t) and “he lost everything” (he lost nothing - he still has his house, his title, his security and he’s present and family functions in his full dress).

Good for you mainecoon.. I think we all know who the rude one is. You are continually saying Bollocks and Bullshit to anyone who has a different point of view from you. And yet I'm rude?! Don't make me laugh!
I suggest you stop replying to Every Single Post of mine with your abrasive rudeness.

She didn't go after any of the bigger players who've been named in connection with Epstein - just the stupid buffoon of a royal, and it makes me wonder why.

I've thought about that, and my conclusions are:

That suing Andrew would make the most noise, nationally and internationally. Rich businessmen, politicians - what do you expect? But a Royal...

That because he's royal and who his mother is, he was the one most likely to pay up to make it go away. She'd been told much earlier that Epstein had the police in his pocket, some of the men (if the stories are true) were very high profile politicians. They too would have the money and influence to fight it and make sure the result went their way. Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky anyone?

Things such as text messages, recordings, video evidence etc. People have had cases where it was filmed and the police have NFA'd it. Cases where he confessed and it was NFA'd.

I was raped and my rapist text me after gloating about how he loved forcing me to do things the night before. He admitted to raping me. It was NFA'd it despite proof.

My friend was raped and he confessed and she had recorded him. He then murdered her because she reported it and the judge NFA'd it saying she was dead now so no point trying him for rape.

Many have lots of evidence. Without it it wouldn't even go to CPS because of the quota. Sadly the quota prevents it to ensure the data is fudged. Thankfully the CPS have admitted they do this.

The trouble with name-dropping Harvey Weinstein is that Weinstein was also a good friend to the Obamas and their eldest daughter worked as an intern for him. Weinstein was very much part of the Obama fold as well.

Well maybe they tried to step in & PA ignored/overruled them. Just speculating of course....but I find it very hard indeed to believe that they wouldn't have known.

I don't accept the suggestion that PA was just foolish and naive. This is a highly privileged man who had had access to the best education that (our) money could buy.

Of course Ghislaine Maxwell was at that party. Oh and Harvey Weinstein was there too. 3 perverted sexual abusers at Windsor Castle attending a party at which other family members were present, very much part of the RF fold.