Child's friend parent on sexual offender register

Why does anyone owe a criminal help to reintegrate?

He chose to break the law, It's now up to every parent whether they want him around their kids.

If I had an older daughter, I absolutely would not allow it.

I wouldn't want him in my home, either.

An adult committing sexual abuse against a child is reliant on naive, ignorant, self absorbed adults around said child

There are some very naive people on this thread.

hence the existence of sexual abuse against children

I’d be clear that for my child’s party their child is welcome but Dad is not. For their child’s party, I would not leave my child unsupervised if there was any indication the dad would be there. Age 4 drop and go is fairly uncommon anyway (or is round here) so you have time to assess the situation.
I totally understand not wanting your child to even know this man exists

There are some very naive people on this thread.

It's all very well to instruct others to 'do better' or to 'be kind'.

I remember worrying that I'd been unkind by warning other members of my family to keep their children away from the 'rehabilitated' chap who was a friend of a relative. He really did seem like a nice bloke...he'd been very young when he was imprisoned and I didn't know exactly what the charges there, because they were spoken of in such vague terms.

I was in my early 20s when I became aware of it all and not very worldly.

Then 40 yrs later he had to be tried in another part of the country to get a fair trial and was convicted of raping two girls, years after the first offences had taken place. Then he was given an additional sentence for other historical offences all of which took place after he'd been "rehabilitated".

I nodded along to your post, then came to the last line. It saddened me. That someone can post this much common-sense on an issue like child-safeguarding, then recognise that they are in a minority on this thread, is frankly unbelievable.

On Mumsnet. Of all places.

Sorry what, have I misunderstood?
You would be more angry at OP than you would be at the paedophile?

I'm absolutely astonished at some of these responses.

This is how abuse gets normalised.

The fact that 'there's a lot of CSA about' does not mean that we have to shrug at it.

Child abusers don't announce themselves to a child, or a parent. And the reason children are so vulnerable is precisely because they are groomed by society, before any abuse is enacted, to trust and defer to adults.

In having that man in her home, the OP is giving him a seal of approval. Her children will learn that he has the status of all the other to whom s/he must defer.

It needn't be a question of it happening there and then - it will lay the groundwork for future interactions.

Though in fact - as any reader of the many accounts of women who were themselves abused as children on MN knows - there are a million ways to get a child alone when 30 seconds is long enough. And many abusers do it in plain sight of other adults, who are conditioned not to believe their own instincts (or eyes).

OP, you have to say to the woman (who has herself betrayed her own child and is therefore absolutely not to be trusted) 'We're lookng forward to seeing Tommy, but unless you plan to drop and run please make sure that it's you that brings him."

She will know what you mean - and if she can't be grateful for your humanity towards her child, then she's even more contemptible. She is the one who has isolated her child by maintaining ties with an abuser. Seriously, fuck her.

I’d guess your partner wouldn’t feel the same @Gymmum82

so would you overrule?

Amazing how some of you would be happy to have him in the vicinity. Utterly gross.

It’s not safe. The wife should be openly saying that he won’t be there for obvious reasons. Integrate, my arse. He can fuck the hell off and stay home for the sake of his child.

the really sad thing here is people judging the mum. you have NO idea what is going on behind closed doors

No, you're right and nobody knows. Although it's perfectly natural not to want your kids at a house or being around somewhere where you know one of the parents is like this child's Dad.
Why should anyone put their own child at risk just to save someone else's feelings?

i don’t give a flying fig about what is going on behind closed door.

young girls have suffered terrible
and she still remains close to and quite possibly with him
end of

I disagree.

Say this creature is in the vicinity of OPs kid. No direct contact or communication, fine. But just watching the kids. Can you think what he might be thinking? Where his mind will go? I’m clearly not about to type a scenario of his possible thoughts, but would you be happy with someone leering at your child, taking detail of their clothes, hair colour, smile etc, for their own pleasure later that night?

I wouldn’t give a flying fig about her circumstances

appalling judgement of character
hence I’d want nothing to do with her.

sadly their child suffers for it, but I’m not to blame for that.

Invite the child, it's not their fault.
I don't think Dad would come. if he does, tell him to leave and to get mum to collect child at the end of the party.

the really sad thing here is people judging the mum. you have NO idea what is going on behind closed doors.

Vast numbers of men are being arrested for these offences - it's being driven by disgusting porn habits etc - the women generally don't know - and this mum may be traumatised, weak, abused - trying to keep her kids from having to go to the dad 50/50 - you don't know

the families of offenders/ men in prison etc, are always at risk of being shamed and judged - do better as a neighbour, a friend - you can keep an eye out for your own child without judging others.

I would let her go to the girls birthday as-well but I would need to know that he would not be present

How would you know that he wouldn't be present though? I certainly wouldn't be taking the mum's word for it, especially when she's clearly alright still being around him.

I don’t think YABU at all.

If the mum still chooses to have this man in hers and her child’s life then in my eyes, she is just as bad as him. It’s so unfair to the child to not be actively distancing this man away from them.

I understand where you are coming from OP.
You don’t want your child to ever meet him so that he can never recognise the man as his friend’s father and therefore as somebody trustworthy.
I think that is very wise at this early education stage.

Could you send a more formal style invitation out with ‘By Invitation Only’ printed across the top.
Then you write in exactly who is invited. For this particular family you write in…eg Ellie and Mummy. For every other invitation you write in eg Joe and parent.
I know it feels pompous to have a more formal invitation card style for a child’s party, but I think all concerned parents would understand your objective by doing it that way and you could soften it by saying you don’t have room for two parents.

Take note of what other mums are doing to get round this problem. With the first round of parties, I think the unwritten policy will evolve naturally between you all and then everybody will get the hang of how to handle it without it being a risk to any child and without it affecting the child of that family.

Why can you tell her straight? I am aware of jonnys dads criminal activity and i dont want him near my kids. I would like to invite Jonny to Bob's party. However, I only feel comfortable doing that if you will be bringing him. If his dad brings him he will be asked to leave and I wouldn't want Jonny to be upset./ disappointed.

Yes, I would question her decision making skills.

I would still invite the child to your daughters party as even if he drops her off at the door he will have no contact with your daughter

I would let her go to the girls birthday as-well but I would need to know that he would not be present

His daughter shouldn’t be punished for things that he has done, what if no one turns up at her party…..the poor kid

There is zero risk if you are supervising a situation properly. Absolutely zero

One other point OP - even if no harm came to your child if they heard that Dave’s dad was a convicted sex offender when they were older and realised you knew and let him around them, imagine how they’d feel.

I agree, I know I'm not aware of her circumstances, blah blah, before anyone starts.
It's just if she thinks it's ok to be around him knowing what she does, how do I know for example he wouldn't be at a party of their kids?
Her thinking's completely fucked up if she'll allow her child to still be around him. Wouldn't trust her around mine either as a result.