The pope has died

I hope it happens one day PantyBear.

I’m no expert on these matters, and I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong, but as I understand it, the objection to women priests is not theological. Also, there were quite a few early leaders of the church who were women.

Nowadays, most intelligent Catholic women who have a vocation other than becoming a nun, have moved on elsewhere, and I find it terribly sad that women’s roles within the church in 2025 are still so subservient. Pope Francis did his best but the pace of change is infinitesimally slow.

For example, why don’t we see senior nuns and female theologians included in the conclave?

Well that's quite the Revelation.

So why are you defending it?

The RC church makes no secret that it bases it's doctrine as much in church teaching, guided by the Holy Spirit, as scripture. It was one of the cornerstones of the Reformation. I'm not wading through theology for you..go do your own research. I'm still on Easter Hols for one more day! Incidentally, if it matters, I'm an atheist. I'm not defending the church out of religious sensibilities.

The Vatican has affirmed the Universal Declaration of Human Rights so this is a legitimate argument within Catholic thought about how best to sort out the contradictions in that system of thought.

11 years of Catholic school, altar server for several years, 2 philosophy degrees that engaged a bit with some Catholic thinking. Enough to know that many of the doctrines of the church are based on custom rather than scripture, that the church has often adopted values and practices from outside the church and presented them as part of an eternal unchanging/unchangeable continuity. A female pope is going to happen. Probably not in our lifetimes but it definitely won't happen as long as we all keep silent and think it's ok for a majority female religious community to exclude women from all leadership roles.

Don't need to, I know what it is. My point is that the Church can change the rules as and when it suits, you will of course be fully aware that it was fine for priests to marry up to the 12th century.

"Occult" just means hidden knowledge, so we can argue semantics if you like.

Can you answer my question?

Dogma is used as a derogatory term but it just means teaching. Fee free to go and read the Catechism and the tomes upon tomes of theology on this subject. It's all out there. As above, the RC church is not for everyone, it holds many views that are hard to align with 21st C western values but that doesn't mean they must change to fit in. They don't mind not fitting in, and don't mind if you choose not to belong.

Apostolic succession, not genealogical. Look it up.

I'd like one good reason, beyond dogma, why women are still excluded from the RC hierarchy today. As it's so progressive and all that.

That would be the St Peter who had a mother in law.

👍thanks!

Just googled and it might be Pope Joan by Diana Woolfolk Cross. There's probably a few out there!

I'd like to read that novel if you can remember the name.

@YourAmplePlumPoster I've read such a novel about the alleged Pope Joan.Years ago now and can't remember the author or title. Incidentally , one can be made a cardinal without being ordained as a priest. Interesting...

There was allegedly a female Pope once elected who disguised herself as a man but historians are reluctant to give this credence. Makes an interesting read and would make an interesting novel!
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Pope-Joan

This isn’t the right place for your criticism.

I agree about subtitles. Films especially, even if I understand almost none of the language concerned.

I think a bit of consideration for sincere believers and RCs who are in mourning right now might be nice.

Fortunately there's no law that says it's not the right or respectful place to be unimpressed with adherents to a dogma that has brutalised, subjugated and oppressed half the world's population and a good number of their children to appease their "God".

No-one has to be a member of the RC church. If you don't like that it hasn't evolved modern views, you are free to not belong. Those that find adherence to a centuries old tradition and theology are happy to accept it's limitations. There are other Christian churches or atheism available. Not everything has to be for everyone. I also don't think this thread is the right or respectful place to discuss it.

I had the Funeral going on in the background - I always appreciate the choral aspects of such events. Seems only yesterday the Cardinals sent their little wisp of white smoke to elect a Pope. Hopefully they'll get on with it a bit quicker this time so Catholics can cease mourning - there's a lot of Catholics spread out worldwide - so I'd like to see them happy again.

Well, it bloody well should be by now, about equal rights I mean.

Nothing to do with safe space and everything to do with two thousand years of theology. A pope is chosen from cardinals who are promoted from bishops who have been promoted from priests. All priests are in the line of Apostolic succession from Peter. It's not about equal rights and 21st Century mores.

@PantyBear what do you know about the Roman Catholic Church?