"Ipad Kid" ??

Exactly.

I'd love to sit and eat a meal in peace without having to play I spy, draw a car or have my arm covered in stickers, but I chose to have kids and that means I have to parent my kids

The only attitude i instill in my kids is wear headphones

Yep. That's how we do it.
I'm really looking forwards to the days they'll just sit there and chat but until then I accept I'll have to entertain them a little / keep asking them to behave and sit down.

Posted too soon.

We went out for a meal on Saturday. Seven children, all under 13. Three of them six and under.

Not a single screen between them. Just adults talking to them, playing quiet games, a couple of toy cars, a pack of stickers and a notepad of paper to make sticker pictures on.

No screeching, no iPad, no chasing them round other than walking the toddler (my nephew) around the pub garden for a few minutes not long before we left.

I've got four children, 13 years and younger.

Youngest has just turned five. I very much know what young children are like.

Have a look at this Russell Kane clip. So true….

www.instagram.com/reel/DHYX57Nt5X4/?igsh=MXBzdGFqYTJoM3hhMg==

We went to Spain last year and this was noted at every mealtime by myself and DH - whole families sitting eating attached to devices, whole families sitting at the pool on devices, kids at the children’s evening disco sitting on the dance floor on devices. It was really sad.

Ds 8 does have his ipad with him at all times but it's not to watch videos on he uses it to communicate with us. He's non verbal and the ipad has been a life saver for him he can now communicate with people he couldn't communicate with before.

Well I guess my kid and my friends kids didn't read those averages then.

6 year old 12 - 18 minutes? Ridiculous. But even so-

10m reading menu, choosing food, ordering.
15m chatting.
15m drawing.
30m eating.
15m nagging them to keep quiet.
10m quick walk around the block while waiting for pudding, order check same time.
10m eating pudding.
Leave.

It's not rocket science. We didn't always have ipads.

Honestly it's so depressing that so many have such low expectations for their kids. This coming generation has been fucked over by screens and parents who consistently chose to go for easy option rather than expecting kids to learn to regulate themselves.

You should have paid more attention to what the 4 years old was doing then. The normal attention span of 4 years is 8-12 minutes, it increases with age to - 5-6 years old: 12-18 minutes. This means they can only do an activity for that period of time, be it looking at a tablet, playing, talking etc So most generally what a toddler in a cafe will do is eat for 10 minutes, play for another 10 minutes, chat for another 10 minutes after which they will try go off and explore. And yet there will be so many idiots looking at them and thinking they sit and watch an iPad for hours. They do not have the attention span for looking at an IPad for an hour any more than they do for anything else, the iPads are one of many things utilised to keep them sat down so they don’t go off and bother the idiots criticising the iPads.

One thing is thread has reminded me is how utterly vile and judgemental other mums can be. I really don’t understand why there needs to be such hateful superiority between parents, especially mums. I genuinely would look or think twice if I saw a kid with an iPad, or a dummy, or a bottle with juice in it. Sure we all know these things aren’t ideal and we may or may not choose to do it for our own dc but to spout such vitriol and admit to being so judgemental is embarrassing. I do hope some of you aren’t instilling this horrible attitude in your own dc, I’d say it’s far more damaging than an iPad in a Toby Carvery for half an hour.

Some of you definitely never grew out of being mean girls in the playground.

I had a 4 year old recently and so do a lot of my friends.
Some of them would sit and chat and draw happily for an hour or more, some were much harder work, worst case scenario a quick walk around the block or leave early.

Ipads are not necessary although obviously they do make dinner more relaxing for parents. Call it what it is tho. You either haven't taught your kid to behave or you can't be bothered to entertain them.

If the younger one's "can get left out"
It's a classic case where, and I'm sure there's more than one in any area, a person should be getting a sitter.

Unless the adults want to talk to each other as well. We find that if just our nuclear family that's fine, but if lots of other adults as well in more of a catch up scenario it is harder for the younger ones as they can get left out.

I don't understand all this "if a DC is on a screen it gives the parents a break"

If you're out with your DC it's family time, you conversate with each other, spend time interacting, surely if you want a break you get a babysitter in and go out as a couple leaving little one at home where they can be on their devices with the volume at whatever level they choose.

I take it you don’t have children or they’re adults now and you’ve completely forgotten what an under 4 year old is like.

Absolute bollocks.

Kids under 4-5 who have had a screen shoved in front of them since birth might not be able to, but an average child can absolutely sit and talk for an hour if the adults are engaging with them.

"And electronics manufacturers have a LOT to answer for removing the standard headphone jack too!"

Yes, but USB headphones are not that expensive (less than a meal) and a connector from a standard headphone jack to USB-C, less than a glass of wine :-)

Yup. Also teaching him ‘Don’t want to = Don’t have to’. That’ll be really handy later in life. 🙄

@NoSoapJustUseShowerGel to be honest I don't care if a child (or adult) is on a tablet or phone - just volume OFF or headphones ON.

Absolutely, and importantly it still allows for interaction and conversation where a screen does not. A person can colour in and hold a conversation at the same time whereas generally a screen will capture their full attention and they’ll zone out from whatever is happening around the table.

A colouring book generally isn't at a high volume that the entire place can hear.
That's the difference.

Motor skills, pen control, patience, discussion about achievements. Etc

I’m not sure why everybody thinks that using a screen is the only alternative if a child can’t sit quietly. We used to play I Spy, talk about things, generally do our best to keep toddler occupied. If she couldn’t sit still and it was taking a while I’d walk her up and down to look round the restaurant, or take her outside, or over to the window to count cars or something. It’s just what you have to do if you take children out to eat and they can’t settle.

I’m autistic and we suspect the kids are too. All of us are noise-sensitive; we can cope with background talking but add in secondhand video noise and it stresses us all out a lot. I can’t concentrate or hold a conversation if I can hear someone else’s video. General rule of thumb should be you do you so long as it’s not affecting anyone else. If it is, do something about it. (I don’t include screaming children in this - if a child is having a hissy fit and the parents are clearly trying to stop it, I’d have 100% sympathy for them).

In an ideal world, everyone would be able to do everything, but sometimes you just have to accept that at certain stages in your life (such as when you have young children) you’re not going to be able to. It comes with being a parent, and you just have to suck it up and wait til they’re older to do those things.

Handing your child a colouring book is the same as an iPad. Keeping them occupied whilst you have an adult conversation. It’s not better than an iPad because it’s low tech.
It definitely is better, no question.