How do I help my friend? (SC ruling related)

After a terrorist attack innocent people find themselves being searched on entering public buildings. It's not great but you accept it because the terrorists have made it necessary. After a bit it settles down again.

This will settle too once men have found that sneaking into toilets, changing rooms and cheating at sports will no longer be tolerated.

Of course this isn't going to happen very often anyway. The reality is that we can almost always tell the difference. If there's any doubt then speaking usually clears it up and walking around clinches it.

Carrying ID is meaningless since Trans supporters corrupted that system by allowing fake information to be entered.

For the most part those claiming it will happen routinely are the trans activists attempting a last ditch attack on women's rights.

Perfectly put

urg I have been called mate and sir so many times because I have short hair.
They somehow managed to miss the 36f appendages on my chest.

then you get the males who call me a lesbian (usually after I have knocked them back)

I am glad though for this ruling as I was asexual assault victim and seeing a male in a female space would completely trigger me. It’s the trans movement own fault as they took it too far to the point of being ridiculous. I think it’s telling it’s just the trans women making a fuss and not trans men. That to me says that a lot of people were getting a kick out of demeaning women and getting access to our spaces.

hopefully this is just a few arseholes doing this after the ruling and it will all die down.

My dds friend has been challenged in bathrooms, my dd has been told that she isnt allowed to bring her boyfriend into the women's bathrooms, one time in a shopping centre someone got security(a man ironically) and he squared up to her and asked her to leave as she was washing her hands after using the bathroom. Her friend is a 5'10" 16yo lesbian with a 'boys' haircut who wears tracksuits. Her friend doesn't use public toilets anymore, she very much does mind being questioned, she finds it horribly embarrassing as any teenage girl would. It's hard enough for her to be herself amongst friends who have long swishy hair and wear little crop tops and leggings without adults rejecting her.

I don't know what the answer is but I find it disappointing to see people downplaying the affect that being questioned like that can have on you.

I honestly don’t think it will be much of a problem. Half of my women’s rugby friends are butch lesbians and they are not usually mistaken as men!

I have no issue with lesbian women - however they present themselves - using the women's toilets because they are women. Likewise trans men. All she has to do is speak as it will be clear from her voice she's a woman even if she is dressed in what I assume is a masculine manner. All women, including your friend, will be safer because of the SC ruling.

Yes, there's entirely the need to be aggressive. Women do not need to produce ID (or some other such "solution" being suggested here) to strangers in public bathrooms. A sharp response might stop someone from going through life thinking it's ok to question someone else like that.

I hope the hysteria calms. It was a sensible ruling but should come with compassion. There are so many vulnerable people trying to navigate this change and shouting at them when they are hurting, is not the humane way forward. I truly believe that identifying as a gender different to birth should be labelled with trans before woman or man - this helps with understanding. There are so many trans people who genuinely mean no harm, but like the “not all men” statement it’s “not all trans women” but some mean harm and therefore we have to legislate accordingly. The reasons for single sex spaces is because “not all men…” so the reason exists for protection against those trans women who mean harm. That doesn’t mean trans people don’t need protection too. It’s not either or.

this!!

a man dressed in a woman’s clothing is all they are until they’ve had all the surgery and do not pose as a man in the private areas etc.

i would not feel comfortable for myself or my daughter in spaces like toilets etc if a man dressed as a woman came in. They have 0 right and as women we have fought for OUR rights for many many years and shouldn’t need to again.

Whenever anyone says “they just need to do xyz..” to avoid facing prejudice and discrimination it shows how privileged they are not to have experienced it. I really feel for your friend - that’s awful that she’s been challenged like that.

I feel sorry for what the OP's friend is experiencing. But it's just one of the many ways women are judged on appearance.

I don’t necessarily agree that the SC ruling has made people more homophobic. I genuinely believe that the ruling has given people the opportunity / courage to speak out more and to stand up for their rights (as women). Until now, almost everyone accepted that the sex based rights referred to in the Equality Act were biological sex and that human sex was binary and immutable. The likes of Stonewall made many who didn’t fall for gender identity woo woo too afraid to speak out because, if you did, you were a bigot and a transphobe and in some workplaces people could get into trouble. I will be very interested to see what happens in my own workplace - there'll be a fair amount of reverse ferreting by some very senior people (I hope).

Androgynous people of both sexes, LGB people, women, we're all just collateral damage to this aggressive male supremacist movement. The blue haired flag waving pronoun enforcers can just skip back off to wherever they came from, and leave us to deal with their mess.

Though I note the amazing number of both extremely tall, muscly transmen and butch lesbians who various posters have amongst their acquaintance this week. Most humans, especially women, are really good at telling sex. It's not just size or haircut its gait, stance, hands, loads of things which we aren't even conscious that we notice. So I hope and believe that anyone who challenges your friend will quickly realise their mistake.

Any need to be so aggressive?
The fuck off is hardly necessary (assuming this ever actually happens)

Of course not. Doesn’t happen.

Does anyone know a butch lesbian who is sooooooo butch she would be challenged? Naaah unless she’s 6 feet tall and 200 lbs with a 5 o’clock shadow and bald. We all know what a woman is even a butch one

I'm sure I'll get flamed but I think it's an unfortunate byproduct of trans women being allowed in women's toilets. Prior to this being a big thing I expect people may have thought "oh, a masculine looking woman." Now it's "they must be trans."

Your friend should practice the phrase "fuck off, I have a vagina" for the next time she's asked.

But on the bright side lesbian groups no longer have to include men.

I hope all those posters who just think someone should carry ID end up experiencing being accused of being a man in a woman's space. Maybe if they experienced that they would have more empathy.

I've never seen this in real life and I'm suspicious about all these alleged incidents that are suddenly happening women don't turn aggressive and challenge people overnight 🤔

Just how many toilets has your friend been kicked out of since the ruling?

I feel so sorry for your friend, but you and she have the fetishistic men to ‘thank’ for that, not that it helps.

I think it will die down quite quickly; tho I know we will still be ‘clocking’ TiMs in the Ladies’, but they’re now taking a bigger risk.

For me, the big ‘win’ will be keeping the men out of women’s prisons, changing rooms, women’s wards, shortlists etc (hopefully).

The WC thing will take longer.

I feel for your friend, OP. I’ve also felt for non-feminine-looking women over the past few years, as men started invading women’s spaces and women started becoming wary of anyone who looked like a man. Previously there was no reason to be suspicious.

Few women had the confidence to challenge them, since we were not allowed to ask to see a GRC. But the men’s presence destroyed the safety and comfortable atmosphere — and made life harder for women who didn’t conform to sexist stereotypes.

We now have the legal right to challenge male interlopers, and I hope the crybullies leave us in peace.

I hope things go back to normal soon and no more women fall under suspicion. But this is completely the fault of the men. I never previously turned a hair if a masculine-looking woman came into the toilets or changing room.

I suspect it's because one is about a sense that somebody's getting a free perk at Tesco's and one's about a fear of sexual assault.