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Person with MH problems should not be better off no working

581 replies

YourTidyScroller · 13/04/2025 16:54

Just that really. Someone working a minimum wage job full-time should not be worse off than someone not working due to mental health problems and claiming benefits.
I know several people in this situation claiming UC for housing benefit, council tax, ESA, disability top up and PIP. They all have no work record and few qualifications so would probably only get a minimum wage job. But their income would reduce. So they have a financial incentive not to recover.

OP posts:
WeylandYutani · 13/04/2025 22:26

ChickenBananas · 13/04/2025 22:24

On what planet is anyone recieving £600 a month as council tax reduction?! Make that make sense???

Is bull. No one is paying that much on CT to start with.

ChickenBananas · 13/04/2025 22:26

Council tax doesn't work like that. Say you would pay £100 per month, you might instead pay £60. They don't give you hundreds of pounds 🙄

ChickenBananas · 13/04/2025 22:24

On what planet is anyone recieving £600 a month as council tax reduction?! Make that make sense???

Happilyobtuse · 13/04/2025 22:23

TheBuffetInspector · 13/04/2025 22:04

I'm sure your children love their carers.

What is bcoz?

Stop being ignorant! My children don’t need carers as all the care they need is provided for them by both their parents who work hard daily and are higher rate tax payers! You can make fun of an abbreviation but it doesn’t make you smarter! 🤣 I have a masters degree and I am totally confident in my abilities. I speak more than 4 languages and english is a second language. If you still want to be a judgemental pain in the arse, then go ahead!

Flytrap01 · 13/04/2025 22:21

What Companies Can Do Better

Introduction: The Corporate Delusion

Let’s get one thing straight: you don’t have to wait for a government policy shift, a populist uprising, or a Daily Mail headline to realise something is deeply broken. The people are angry. Not because they hate welfare—but because they no longer trust work to be the route out of poverty.

And where did this breakdown begin? Not just in Westminster.
But in your boardrooms.

I. Stop Acting Like Minimum Wage Is a Virtue

Let me be frank: paying the legal minimum is not moral rectitude. It’s economic cowardice. You squeeze wages to cut costs, then complain when taxpayers pick up the slack in the form of benefit top-ups. That’s not capitalism. That’s corporate parasitism.

What Companies Must Do:

  • Implement living wage structures not because you’re legally bound, but because you understand that resentment is poison—and your frontline workers are drinking it daily.
  • Audit internal pay hierarchies: If your CEO earns 250x more than your lowest-paid worker, you’d better be delivering profits that justify Roman tributes. Otherwise, it’s not a business. It’s a Versailles cosplay.

II. Rebuild the Social Ladder—One Rung at a Time
You claim to value "upward mobility." But in most firms, the only thing moving up are executive bonuses.

What Companies Must Do:

  • Create genuine progression pathways from entry-level to management. Apprenticeships that don't dead-end. Training budgets that don’t vanish in the third quarter.
  • Kill the degree inflation myth: Start promoting from within based on performance, not paper. Talent doesn’t always wear a mortarboard.

III. Be Honest About Mental Health—And Honest About Work
You’ve all plastered your walls with slogans like “It’s okay to not be okay.” But when mental health issues begin to impact productivity, suddenly it’s all policy memos and quiet exits.

What Companies Must Do:

  • Invest in structured return-to-work programs. Mental health support isn’t about permanent absence—it’s about functional recovery.
  • Redesign roles to reduce burnout: Flexible hours, hybrid models, role rotation. Make it easier for people to stay in the workforce, even when they’re struggling.

IV. Become Stakeholders in Society, Not Just Shareholders in Profit
The average citizen no longer sees a difference between multinational corporations and absentee landlords. You extract value. You don't plant roots.
What Companies Must Do:

  • Reinvest locally: Stop outsourcing everything from janitorial staff to IT to save 3% on your quarterly report. Invest in your communities, and they’ll invest in you.
  • Publicly back policy reform: If you know the welfare system is unsustainable, lobby for responsible change—not just lower taxes. Get your hands dirty in the policy kitchen, or don’t whine about what’s served.

V. Rethink the Culture of Reward
Let me ask you something: when did your bonuses become divorced from reality? When did “shareholder value” become a euphemism for “executive enrichment”?

What Companies Must Do:

  • Tie executive pay to social impact metrics: retention of low-income staff, wage uplift across the bottom quartile, measurable community investment.
  • Kill the myth of meritocracy at the top: If your senior hires are all from the same five universities and golf clubs, you're not hiring for merit—you're just replicating privilege.

Conclusion :

The future of business is not simply about cutting costs, boosting margins, or flattering shareholders with another empty ESG slide. It’s about restoring a broken contract—between labour and leadership, between vulnerability and value, between mental health and economic participation.

If mental health challenges have become a major fault line in the benefits debate, it’s because our systems—corporate and public alike—have failed to provide a dignified route back into the world of work. We’ve built institutions that medicate suffering but do not rehabilitate purpose. That is not compassion. That is containment.

YourTidyScroller · 13/04/2025 22:19

uncomfortablydumb60 · 13/04/2025 22:17

Forgot to add..I’ll gladly swap my monthly income of PIP and ESA on condition you take my moderate Cerebral Palsy and bipolar 1 disorder???

I will swap my job with you if you take my psychosis managed by medication and fucked up lungs that mean I have COPD?

OP posts:
uncomfortablydumb60 · 13/04/2025 22:17

Forgot to add..I’ll gladly swap my monthly income of PIP and ESA on condition you take my moderate Cerebral Palsy and bipolar 1 disorder???

uncomfortablydumb60 · 13/04/2025 22:15

FFS.. Get a hobby, and a life to go with it
signed.. A disability benefits recipient

WeylandYutani · 13/04/2025 22:08

YourTidyScroller · 13/04/2025 22:06

LCWRA £416 a month.
Housing allowance £548 a month
UC single person £368 a month
Council tax allowance varies but about £600 a month
Lower rate PIP without mobility, some will get more £312
Total = £2154

I only gte LCWRA. I still have to pay towards CT. I don't get PIP and I don't get housing.
Stop comparing benefits claiments to workers, becasue we are all different
My grand total in income is a tiny bit over £800pm. On what planet is that *more than someone on NMW?

WeylandYutani · 13/04/2025 22:06

Happilyobtuse · 13/04/2025 21:59

Well most of us would be happier if we didn’t work and were given money for nothing. And totally agree some work places can really mess with your mental health. I quit my last job exactly bcoz it was a toxic workplace and was giving me panic attacks, something I had never faced before. But I took some time off and then found another job and I couldn’t be happier. My DH supported me while I was off work. Currently I love my job but it is busy, stressful and I hardly find time for anything! Most days by the time I get to bed it is close to 11pm. But it is important to me to set an example to my children.

Working and not having time for anything else, and going to bed after work at 11pm.. come on, that should not be the norm. That sounds like a shit work and life balance. If you accept that as the norm, then you are part of the problem.

YourTidyScroller · 13/04/2025 22:06

IOSTT · 13/04/2025 21:53

Benefits are nowhere near as HIGH as someone receiving minimum wage in a full time job! £450 a week??

LCWRA £416 a month.
Housing allowance £548 a month
UC single person £368 a month
Council tax allowance varies but about £600 a month
Lower rate PIP without mobility, some will get more £312
Total = £2154

OP posts:
TheBuffetInspector · 13/04/2025 22:04

Happilyobtuse · 13/04/2025 21:59

Well most of us would be happier if we didn’t work and were given money for nothing. And totally agree some work places can really mess with your mental health. I quit my last job exactly bcoz it was a toxic workplace and was giving me panic attacks, something I had never faced before. But I took some time off and then found another job and I couldn’t be happier. My DH supported me while I was off work. Currently I love my job but it is busy, stressful and I hardly find time for anything! Most days by the time I get to bed it is close to 11pm. But it is important to me to set an example to my children.

I'm sure your children love their carers.

What is bcoz?

TheBuffetInspector · 13/04/2025 22:02

Thanks @YourTidyScroller for outing the ignoramus'

WeylandYutani · 13/04/2025 22:02

Emanresuunknown · 13/04/2025 21:55

If you are in receipt of housing benefit, plus UC plus PIP etc you can absolutely be on that sort of money.

But everyone is on different benefits. I am not on PIP and don't claim housing benefit.

Happilyobtuse · 13/04/2025 21:59

WeylandYutani · 13/04/2025 21:47

Being disabled can be expensive. Why should disability benefits be capped below what someone on NMW earns? The person on NMW does not have the extra costs that come with disability.
That is what PIP is for - to level the field. A disabled person should not be out of pocket due to their disability.

And I hate this whole "work will improve your MH" thing. Some of us were made more ill by working. Not working keeps us safe and well.
Look at all the threads on here about workplace bullying, crap work conditions, zero hour contracts etc. Tell me how work is better. Work is good IF your MH is good too.

Well most of us would be happier if we didn’t work and were given money for nothing. And totally agree some work places can really mess with your mental health. I quit my last job exactly bcoz it was a toxic workplace and was giving me panic attacks, something I had never faced before. But I took some time off and then found another job and I couldn’t be happier. My DH supported me while I was off work. Currently I love my job but it is busy, stressful and I hardly find time for anything! Most days by the time I get to bed it is close to 11pm. But it is important to me to set an example to my children.

TheBuffetInspector · 13/04/2025 21:56

TheBuffetInspector · 13/04/2025 21:51

Indeed it's your attitude. Marvellous.

The facts that you have quoted are true to you, yet you continue to upset others trying to defend themselves against this government and arsehole posts.

Your truth is not the only truth. It's far from it.

You've created a shit show of a thread and you know it.

I'm off to bed. You'll never get a rise from me with your wanky threads and incomprehensible titles.

You're trying to engage a posse of nastiness. It may well have worked.

I'll sleep well tonight.
.....

Emanresuunknown · 13/04/2025 21:55

IOSTT · 13/04/2025 21:53

Benefits are nowhere near as HIGH as someone receiving minimum wage in a full time job! £450 a week??

If you are in receipt of housing benefit, plus UC plus PIP etc you can absolutely be on that sort of money.

Mumble12 · 13/04/2025 21:54

YourTidyScroller · 13/04/2025 21:47

No they are not faking their need for PIP.
But they have very little extra associated costs.

So what is their need for pip then? The payments are to compensate for the additional costs associated with living independently?

Emanresuunknown · 13/04/2025 21:54

Overtheatlantic · 13/04/2025 17:06

How do you know so many disabled people? Serious question.

Around 5% of the UK population receives disability benefits of some sort. If you know 20 people 1 is probably receiving disability benefits. Most people know far far far more than 20 people between family, friends, neighbours, work colleagues etc.

IOSTT · 13/04/2025 21:53

Punzel · 13/04/2025 21:42

I just think from basic fairness and common sense you should never be better off on benefits than you are working. Someone’s total benefit package should always be capped at just below the rate of working FT at minimum wage.

Two thirds of responders to your poll agree, but the majority of posters are doing the usual aggressive, belittling, spiteful posts disagreeing and calling everyone who questions benefits a murdering fascist etc. Without the poll everyone would think that was the majority opinion. But it isn’t. People who want more and more benefits for more and more people in more and more circumstances are in the minority. Most people agree with a safety net for those who need it but that essentially people should be working as much as they can and that the staggering increase in people claiming benefits for MH problems especially is not supportable and many of those people can work (and in the past did work) and actually need to work because it will improve their MH if anything.

Honestly, if you are all over the Internet telling everyone they are arseholes for questioning benefits and in an echo chamber where everyone agrees with you and patting yourselves on the back for saying “but what about the MILLIONAIRES” you need to wake up.

Benefits are nowhere near as HIGH as someone receiving minimum wage in a full time job! £450 a week??

Iwishicouldflyhigh · 13/04/2025 21:52

Violetmouse · 13/04/2025 16:59

Why do you specify mental health problems? Your implication is that mental and physical health problems should be treated differently, is that right and if so why?

I think it depends on the issue and regardless, more support needs to given.

i don’t think that people should be on DB for anxiety, no (unless crippling).

Punzel · 13/04/2025 21:52

People claiming benefits because they cannot work because of theme MH is increasing rapidly. As is poor MH. Giving people money so they don’t have to work is manifestly not improving the nations MH.
Of course there are lots of people
who can’t work, temporarily or permanently, or who could work but the job doesn’t exist. Nobody wants anyone in poverty. But however much individual stories are shared, it doesn’t change the fact that the numbers are increasing in an unexplainable way. Not everyone claiming can not work. It’s not logical. And it’s not worldwide - this is specifically a UK problem, even when compared to countries with similar benefit systems.

TheBuffetInspector · 13/04/2025 21:51

YourTidyScroller · 13/04/2025 21:43

You can say you think that is my attitude. But the facts I have posted are true.

Indeed it's your attitude. Marvellous.

The facts that you have quoted are true to you, yet you continue to upset others trying to defend themselves against this government and arsehole posts.

Your truth is not the only truth. It's far from it.

Emanresuunknown · 13/04/2025 21:51

faerietales · 13/04/2025 16:59

You're right, disabled people should just be left to rot in a corner.

Do you think people working full time on minimum wage are being left to rot in a corner?

Do you think those people working full time on minimum wage deserve to be poorer than someone not working at all?

Hastentoadd · 13/04/2025 21:48

Mumble12 · 13/04/2025 21:37

If we take anecdotes as “well known facts” we could prove anything we like.

I really can’t be bothered discussing this with you any further because it seems quite pointless