To find this outlook irritating? Ageing and looks

A great deal of that pressure comes from other women though.

What about accepting your appearance in general? If someone wants to get a tweakment to look better (with the added benefit it may make you look younger). Do you do nothing to make yourself look better?

There is taking reasonable care of your skin, hair and body, taking care to be presentable, and there is being absolutely bloody obsessed with appearance. Whenever somebody starts a “I hate how I look” thread and posts a photo they are invariably gorgeous.

I'm in my early 30s and a lot of my friends are getting Botox. I think it's a shame - we aren't 20 and don't need to look it! Being able to accept ageing is important.

@PeggyMitchellsCameo . Wise words.
The point is that, for women, it's still a crime to age. We're not accepted as wise with grey hair and wrinkles. The pressure to use Botox etc is increasing. "Looking young for your age" is the ultimate compliment.
I agree with you, deaths of contemporaries do give pause for thought.

I actually think it’s a helpful way of thinking about it. Aging is a privilege. It’s not to say you can’t try to look ‘good’ as you age, but a relentless pursuit of looking young and feeling bad for getting older is an unhealthy outlook. Aging gracefully, with help if you want it, is fine.

I think its very normal to feel better when you look better. Dont think that's a mindset that needs changing. If your having a good hair day for example it lifts your mood compared to an awful hair day. Obviously if your just hanging around at home it makes no difference but if your out and about then these little things make a difference.

Its completely normal for people to change their appearance from dying hair, getting rid of grey hair, wearing makeup, gaining or losing weight deliberately, botox, surgery etc. All very normal human behaviour.

Yes improve is subjective. I personally don't think filler in lips 🐤 and cheeks improves a face, its awful. Fake. Those awful huge teeth that glow in the dark 😂 obviously those people have massive problems with self-esteem.

Completely different from a decent haircut and some make up

While I wouldn’t outwardly disparage anyone for having Botox/work done etc, I do find it extremely sad and I do wish none of it existed or wish that women would turn their backs on it.

There seems to be an eradication of being human in the practice. And not just with ageing, but for simply what we look like.

I have been thinking increasingly for a while how I miss women on television and in film looking different, looking like normal (albeit still conventionally attractive) women.

They all just look entirely the same, and it’s incredibly sad.

I like that perspective dictators beauty everywhere, just not the unrealistic Instagram kind.

Everything in life is surely better dealt with by acceptance, looking toward the positive, and an inner calm rather than frantically working against the natural order of things because culturally we are told that older people have no value because of their looks?

If you look around, extremely few people in society look like the representatives we see in the media. We all mostly look average and going through life with this level of angst about our looks is really not healthy, and a waste of time, because you'll never win this battle.

The older I get the more beauty I see in the average, especially older women. I notice beautiful eyes, warm faces, lovely smiles, a nice outfit etc. There is plenty of beauty there although we are told there isn't.

YANBU to be irritated by the 'You're lucky if that's all you have to worry about' type responses (on any threads, not just aging/beauty ones). However, I don't think there's anything wrong with thinking that the pressure to 'improve' your appearance, or the increasing normalising of botox, fillers etc are a bad thing. I think it would generally be a good thing if people were less preoccupied by their appearance.

It's not unreasonable to want to look as good as you can - rightly or wrongly we are judged on appearance and it can have real, material effects on career/finances in certain circumstances. We live in a society that values youth and beauty highly! At the same time, we do have to accept that we are ageing and won't always look the way we might choose, so do have to reframe our thinking and learn to appreciate the process.
So both things can be simultaneously true.

Yes, it’s ridiculous. It’s condescending and it’s irritating. Women must not care about how they dress look but at the same time they must always look good.

On style and beauty someone always says that they don’t care how they dress. I have to say that I often look at their posting history and they have always posted something that is akin to whatever it is they are deeming so vacuous.

Aging v death : is a shutting down the conversation option, which is sanctimonious and heavy handed.

Its good to put aging into perspective, it's a privilege that not everyone enjoys. Also if society went back to respecting experience and life wisdom and not promoting the youth culture above everything else, we might all be more content.

I am post menopause (or whatever the correct term is!) and after a lifetime of looking great most of the time, and not naturally I put a lot of effort in, I suddenly look awful. It’s like I’ve gone downhill on a skateboard.
Have given up on Botox, gave me terrible headaches, had fillers once and I got a huge lump. I try everything else.
A really good friend of mine died in her sleep recently. I have never lost anyone so quickly before.
It has really shocked me as I have realised the value of actually being here.
However, it doesn’t mean I’m delighted to look in the mirror. I’ve still got a beard.
I can remember my mum at my age and she had none of these issues and neither did her friends. It was just accepted that they were in their 50’s, they looked older than they did before. My mum was a really smart dresser, too, but she never looked younger than her age. She was actually really content at my age.
She died at just 70, which now feels young to me, and I think if the same happened to me I don’t want to spend this next part of my life feeling sad because of how I look.

Because we are all ageing all the time - it is not an optional activity. The only alternative to ageing is death.

I find the posts saying “I’m 32 and looks like cack” kind of annoying - this is probably as good as it’s going to get, so you need to reframe NOW or you are going to depress yourself big time.

if someone having botox or a facial or other treatment makes them feel good about themselves then why not? This is bigger question than you're making out really. Is it better to have the treatment or to adjust your mindset to not mind so much about appearance?

Questions about appearance/treatments often lead to deeper discussions.

improve your appearance this again prompts debate on threads as 'improve' is subjective.