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To appeal sister’s benefits?

113 replies

toappealthisdecision · 10/04/2025 07:22

Younger sister (in her 30s), I am her primary guardian as parents are incapacitated themselves unfortunately.

She has complex diagnoses - autism, ADHD, dyspraxia, dyscalcula, mild/borderline learning disability (IQ 70), a lot of mental health stuff (on 3 psychotropics including mood stabilisers) but no concrete diagnosis. She has epilepsy (generalised since childhood), asthma and IBS. She was queried for a genetic syndrome, they think possibly fragile X via my father - but not sure.

She has never worked or earned a wage. She lives in supported living scheme with 24/7 on site carers, although overnight they are not in her flat but are just down one flight of stairs on a sleeping shift - no waking staff overnight.

I can’t see her coping with a job. She does a voluntary thing 2 hours a day,, and she has a 2 or 3 basic qualifications (ie about the level you’d expect of a 11 year old) and can to an extent do kitchen portering and handle a till, again to a very limited extent. But she can’t do any of this to a level she would get paid for. No one would employ her. Reading age is about 9, writing is far lower.

She has zero idea of value of money or impulse control. Socially she is years and years behind and can be very disinhibited. She struggles to keep relationships and doesn’t know what is and isn’t appropriate. She really needs someone with her all the time who knows her and can help her - if she gets upset or overwhelmed she can go into sabotage mode and has been sectioned on 136 a few times because she’s a danger to herself and others. A lot of self harm and violence towards others. She’s also doubly incontinent for psychological reasons and struggles to keep herself clean.

She will never not need care. She doesn’t see it this way and believes she is going to find herself a neurotypical girlfriend and get married and have a lovely house with pets.

Her benefits have changed recently and she’s been told she’s losing £400 per month as she’s not allowed ESA anymore; so will lose severe disability payment - also has to change to UC. She will possibly have enough to live off but only just - ie she will struggle to pay for utility bills, will have a very, very basic standard of living.

I don’t know if that also affects council tax and housing benefit but suspect it will. she also has to pay a chunk towards her care that goes up every year.

Our local council have just made the step of closing down vast majority of learning disability and elderly care services - 70% of all council employees have been let go, most sheltered housing, care homes and similar are gone, no care at home workers, and there are now no day services either. Sister no longer has a social worker, he’s been made redundant as he only worked part time. I don’t know anyone is going to take over but I doubt it - because she is borderline IQ and has some family around she is not classed as highly in need.

I work full time but I only just earn enough for my own bills despite being band 5 NHS, I can’t afford to pay for her too much as I wish I could. One parent is in a care home and exists on £45 per week for personal spends, the other wouldn’t and couldn’t for various reasons.

She is however, only getting the lower rates of PIP, which makes me think we should appeal? Their argument is she can walk, eat and wash but she can only do these things with a trained adult or often 2 adults.

I’ve talked her through what I can and have explained I am prepared to try and appeal. Is it worth trying? I can’t believe her benefits can just drop by that amount so quickly.

There doesn’t seem to be any real support or advice out there for anyone in this boat, it’s not what I expected at 34 to be trying to sort out! I’ve got a couple of relatives who are my rock at the moment but just trying to find independent opinions on what to do

OP posts:
Hol12 · 10/04/2025 21:57

When moved over to UC, ensure she gets the LCWRA element which is roughly £420 per month so this may be what you're missing?
Definitely worth contesting the PIP decision.

JaceLancs · 10/04/2025 20:33

Your local council or county council may have a free benefits advice service - our local authority welfare rights service are amazing but will only deal with clients who are most vulnerable including people like your sister who are in supported living or have a care package, social worker etc

Miley23 · 10/04/2025 20:23

As others have said she should not lose £400 a month by switching to UC as she will get transitional protection meaning she should get the same as she currently gets although this will erode over time.

Tricky34 · 10/04/2025 20:20

10000 percent appeal! Scream, shout, whatever you need to. As unfortunately those who shout the loudest get the most help and your sister sounds like she needs! It!

NimbleTiger · 10/04/2025 19:44

I understand ESA claimants are being moved to uc but don't lose the money ...have you completed her uc application ? If she cannot work she will be allocated that group on uc and carry on as she is just under uc and not the defunct ESA benefit.

Mypoorbody · 10/04/2025 19:14

You need to get some benefits advice. Call Citizens advice on Universal credit . If your sister needs to claim universal credit under managed migration there should be protection when she starts the claim. Challenges on the existing benefits are local Citizens Advice. Easiest will be if you can sister is there to give permission to speak. Have details of all decisions and dates. The link is England and Wales.

Contact us about a Universal Credit application

Get help making a new claim for Universal Credit, from the making the application through to getting your first correct payment.

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/universal-credit/claiming/contact-us-about-universal-credit/

AnotherEmma · 10/04/2025 19:01

TheFastTraybake · 10/04/2025 12:54

That's not great advice. CAB aren't specialists in applying for PIP. I would always advocate someone getting a specialist agency to assist with their claim/appeal. Apart from anything else, the tribunal process is genuinely traumatic and I'd never advise anyone to attend without a trained adviser accompanying them. Giving a percentage of your back payment/small fee to a not for profit organisation is preferable to being refused PIP altogether.

"CAB aren't specialists in applying for PIP."

Eh?!
As I said in my first post, I work for a local citizens advice. We literally pay benefit specialist staff to do PIP claims and appeals.
Local offices differ and some may have more benefit expertise and experience than others. But saying citizens advice are not specialists in PIP is just plain wrong. Many citizens advice offices will have specialist knowledge of all disability benefits including PIP, ESA, LCW(RA) on UC, DLA, Attendance Allowance.

Locutus2000 · 10/04/2025 18:47

Fairyladyonwheels · 10/04/2025 17:09

Definitely appeal. My sister's husband has dsypaxia and gets the highest pip and classed as able bodied. I am surprised he got the highest pip as he works, owns his place and can do things. Crazy system.

Edited

Sounds like there's more going on than you realise. No able bodied person with just dyspraxia gets a car unless they are making a fraudulent claim.

Cara707 · 10/04/2025 18:47

toappealthisdecision · 10/04/2025 07:34

The thing is she had a face to face assessment when the decision was made, she sat silently and glared at the floor the entire time but someone still pronounced her as being not that challenged and therefore able to work. I think because from the outside she just looks socially awkward and like any number of people you might see only a daily basis - she can type, pick up a coin, lift a pint of milk etc - it’s only once you are with her 24/7 that you realise actually, she’s not coping all that well at all and really does need someone with her all the time. Little things like if her bus was cancelled she would not know what to do at all and would be liable to scream and shout and swear at the bus office staff.

I’m not sure re MP, there’s been a big enough argument that the MP has done sod all about the en masse closures so I’m not sure - worth a try though. I’m going to take a few days in my AL to sit with her and go through everything that I can and try and get it all sorted.

Citizens advice is worth trying yes, I’ll see if they still have a local office!

That must be so exhausting for you both to cope with.

Yes, definitely appeal and provide a statement from yourself about the ways that your sister's conditions affect her, alongside medical evidence.

For Universal Credit, your sister should receive 'Transitional protection' for the Severe Disability Payment part of her ESA to UC migration to prevent her from being worse off on UC. It would be worth contacting Citizens Advice about this- they can guide you through the UC claims process.

In terms of PIP, yes, it definitely sounds like she should be on high rate care at the very least. The website 'Benefitsandwork.co.uk' has some really in-depth guides on claims and appeals for PIP and UC and I would definitely recommend looking at those.

Locutus2000 · 10/04/2025 18:44

TheFastTraybake · 10/04/2025 12:54

That's not great advice. CAB aren't specialists in applying for PIP. I would always advocate someone getting a specialist agency to assist with their claim/appeal. Apart from anything else, the tribunal process is genuinely traumatic and I'd never advise anyone to attend without a trained adviser accompanying them. Giving a percentage of your back payment/small fee to a not for profit organisation is preferable to being refused PIP altogether.

Problem is companies charging money to 'fill the form in' plays straight into the fraud narrative, especially when they boast of huge success rates.

AnotherEmma · 10/04/2025 18:26

ESA is much more pressing than PIP atm.
Plus when you are already on PIP we always warn against trying to get a higher rate without first talking to a benefit specialist about whether it's realistic and worth the risk of losing the existing award.

GreatPeachBeaker · 10/04/2025 18:24

Please look at the organisation 'fightback'. They can really help you. Your sister sounds like she absolutely should be on higher rate PIP and Fightback have best practice forms for you to look at, and can even do the appeals for you. There's a small charge for their service but no commitment - if you're all sorted in a month, you only pay for a month.

UnicornBubble · 10/04/2025 17:13

Definitely go to Citizens advice as they can help you with the benefits stuff. Might be worth contacting Adult Social Services if she isn’t already under their care.

the fact she needs supervision and assistance to do any of the criteria on the PIP application, she should be scoring high enough for the enhanced rate.

is she on enhanced for mobility? I’m assuming from what you’ve said about her needs that she likely cannot undergo journeys on her own let alone plan them.

Fairyladyonwheels · 10/04/2025 17:09

Definitely appeal. My sister's husband has dsypaxia and gets the highest pip and classed as able bodied. I am surprised he got the highest pip as he works, owns his place and can do things. Crazy system.

DazzlingCuckoos · 10/04/2025 15:46

Aknifewith16blades · 10/04/2025 12:43

OP, for support and guidence for you, you might find it helpful to check out https://www.sibs.org.uk/

Thanks for sharing this. I've just applied to join the facebook group.

I don't currently have any responsibilities for my sister as my parents are currently able to do this, but one day I will need to take over POA, etc, so I think this group will be a massive support and I'll learn a lot in the meantime.

AnotherEmma · 10/04/2025 14:20

Hi OP. I work for citizens advice.

First things first; are you her appointee for benefits? Do you have POA? If not you need to sort that first.

I gather from your posts that she was found "fit for work" after a work capability assessment. Based on what you've said about her, it sounds very much like the wrong decision and you should definitely challenge it. The first step is to request a mandatory reconsideration (MR):
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/employment-and-support-allowance/problems-with-esa/challenging-an-esa-decision/

You should include medical evidence when you do this. Get a Patient Summary Record for her - you can ask the GP receptionist for this and it's free. (Assume you have POA or other authority to talk to her GP on her behalf - if not she will obviously need to ask or authorise your request.)

At my branch of citizens advice we have limited resources and don't tend to help with MR requests as many are unsuccessful, unfortunately. However, it is worth contacting your local citizens advice to ask. If your MR is unsuccessful you can then appeal at tribunal and it is most definitely worth getting citizens advice or another benefit specialist organisation to help with it.

Assume she has been claiming Housing Benefit to cover her rent? This will stop now her ESA has stopped. You can contact the council and ask them to reinstate it; they'll most probably ask for more information including bank statements.

Given that her only income now will be PIP, she probably does need to claim UC. Unfortunately she will just get the standard rate unless/until she can get the WCA decision overturned. At that point they can then treat it as if she had a live ESA claim when she claimed UC, which means she'll get some transitional protection, and her "unfit for work" status will be applied without needing another assessment.

If she can manage without UC just until she gets the MR decision back, it might be worth waiting for that.

If you think your ESA decision is wrong - mandatory reconsideration

How to challenge a decision about your ESA, what is mandatory reconsideration, what to put in your letter, what to do if you miss the deadline, how to appeal.

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/employment-and-support-allowance/problems-with-esa/challenging-an-esa-decision/

Unpaidviewer · 10/04/2025 12:59

You've got nothing to lose by appealing. Citizens advice might be able to help you with the paperwork.

leli · 10/04/2025 12:56

She's very lucky to have you. I'm glad you do have supportive relatives yourself. Best of luck.

TheFastTraybake · 10/04/2025 12:54

TigerRag · 10/04/2025 11:50

Don't pay for advice. There should be someone within her local supported living scheme who can advise on benefits. Either that or someone like CAB

That's not great advice. CAB aren't specialists in applying for PIP. I would always advocate someone getting a specialist agency to assist with their claim/appeal. Apart from anything else, the tribunal process is genuinely traumatic and I'd never advise anyone to attend without a trained adviser accompanying them. Giving a percentage of your back payment/small fee to a not for profit organisation is preferable to being refused PIP altogether.

AnnaQuayInTheUk · 10/04/2025 12:53

BananaSpanner · 10/04/2025 07:29

I think I just voted yabu by accident so apologies for that. Yes, appeal. She sounds like someone benefits were invented to support and I’m very sorry for you they’ve been reduced. I don’t know how successful appeals are. Would your local MP get involved?

You can change your vote as long as the poll is still open. Just go back and click on the option you want

Mirabai · 10/04/2025 12:51

Trallala · 10/04/2025 12:50

Under Freedom of Information you should be able to get copies of all her medical notes from GPs, consultants etc. Be specific in your request for it to include ALL correspondence from specialists, social services etc. Also contact your local NHS trust and request all medical notes from hospital visits etc. You can do the same with social services and whoever provides her supported living. Again, be specific and ask for care plans and especially risk assessments.

Also, if she can't go out/ use public transport without support then you should try for the mobility element.

Lastly, your GP may also provide a supporting letter (but you may need to pay for this).

Yes absolutely, you need all the documentation you can gather.

Mirabai · 10/04/2025 12:50

First contact Scope for advice.

CAB is ok for appeals but hard to get hold of. If you can afford it it would be better to get an experienced benefits lawyer - appeal would cost around £1500.

There is no question that DSIS should be on highest rate care and mobility because she can’t do anything unaided.

The key to getting PIP is in the way you do the form and appealing on the right grounds.

For a start go to Benefits and Work forum, make an account and download their guide to form filling and appeals.

Then you must get all the medical documentation you have from your mum or request it from DSIS’s GP’s surgery/trust.

Then you or a CAB representative need to write a detailed diary to show how DSIS’s condition affects her care and mobility need. In the diary cover every activity on the form - eating, drinking, washing, self care, dressing, socialising, managing money and journeys etc to show precisely how her conditions affect her.

Obviously things have now changed and there will be major cuts to PIP and only the most disabled will qualify, however, DSIS should by rights still meet the new more stringent criteria.

Trallala · 10/04/2025 12:50

Under Freedom of Information you should be able to get copies of all her medical notes from GPs, consultants etc. Be specific in your request for it to include ALL correspondence from specialists, social services etc. Also contact your local NHS trust and request all medical notes from hospital visits etc. You can do the same with social services and whoever provides her supported living. Again, be specific and ask for care plans and especially risk assessments.

Also, if she can't go out/ use public transport without support then you should try for the mobility element.

Lastly, your GP may also provide a supporting letter (but you may need to pay for this).

NineteenSeventyNine · 10/04/2025 12:48

The system relies on a substantial percentage of applicants not having the time, strength, education, etc to appeal - it’s a sort of unofficial built-in hurdle that penalises the most vulnerable and it’s an absolute disgrace. Definitely appeal and contact Citizens Advice for guidance. You sound like a lovely sister. Good luck x

Kattekittt · 10/04/2025 12:43

This website will offer so much advice for you.
https://www.turn2us.org.uk/
It was so helpful when I had to appeal my original PIP decision.
It goes through all the criteria and also offers further advice on possible grants and other benefits that may be available.
I’d always recommend appealing a decision especially when it seems so unfair. Good luck

""

Turn2us

Turn2us is a national charity providing practical help to those of us facing financial insecurity.

https://www.turn2us.org.uk