Unintended Consequences

"Not everyone who voted for Brexit is a racist, but every racist voted for Brexit".

You (as doesn’t any singular person) don’t represent the entire UK electorate in your opinion of immigration. The implementation of Brexit was applied as shambolically as its referendum. Whichever way you look at it, it’s failed.

Not true. I understood fully that the UK is a country of limited resources getting poorer every day with no capacity to endlessly allow immigrants who can’t be net contributors. (think our population has grown by 10m in the last 10 years or so?).

I also understood that we would have passport controls and restrictions on time in Europe. I think political independence is more important than mine or anyone’s time showing a passport (which we always had to do because we were never part of Schengen).

I do admit that I did not expect such a shambolic implementation of Brexit and lack of hard negotiation. But again that was scuppered by anti/Brexiteers who didn’t respect the electorate and hampered any meaningful negotiations by their disgraceful behaviour and tactical voting in Parliament. Despite this sabotage they and every other remoaner likes to complain Brexit is a disaster. I don’t think it is, but if it is then it was caused by Remoaners not allowing effective hard balled negotiations with EU, an organisation of 26 countries who were more aligned than the UK and 650 MPs. It the MPs who shouldn’t be allowed to vote.

Look what Trump has done in little more than 100 days. Ursula said yesterday she wanted a tariff free trade deal with the US, but stuffed the UK a neighbour out of spite.

"Just last week the elderly parents of a Slovakian patient moved here, and have had 6 outpatient referrals between them.
OP it seems unfair that your colleague can’t move to an EU country, when people from EU countries move here all the time." If I go to the GP or the hospital in Belgium the first thing I am asked for is my ID card to show I am eligible for (free) treatment. The UK seems to have discovered no way of managing this. It doesn't mean that EU countries are wrong because they do. Treatment is not free, it is covered by my social security payments, annual fee to a mutuelle and hospitalisation etc cover paid by my employer.

Fimofriend
Before Brexit there was a lack of teachers, doctors, and nurses. After Brexit, the UK has lost even more employees from those three groups

NHS England employs around 1.3 million full-time equivalent (FTE) staff, data from February 2024 shows, including 140,653 doctors and 353,969 nurses and health visitors.
That’s the highest number of FTE doctors, nurses and health visitors since comparable figures began in 2009.

Free movement won't last within the EU for much longer anyway.

Not in my experience. As a GP we have many new patients who have moved here from European countries and have multiple medical problems. Their first appointment consists of them asking for referral to several hospital specialists for their ongoing conditions. Just last week the elderly parents of a Slovakian patient moved here, and have had 6 outpatient referrals between them.

OP it seems unfair that your colleague can’t move to an EU country, when people from EU countries move here all the time.

I'm not flabbergasted in the least. I regularly listen to stupid people expounding their ill informed political views with no real concept of their outcome.
The Brexit eejits who voted without informing themselves of the consequences, deserve all they get. It's just a pity that the enlightened were dragged down with them!

It's a shame but she's in the Find Out stage of F around and Find Out!

Yes, the UK does this. We try really hard to prevent "health tourism" and will refuse immigration to people unlikely to be able to pay in more than they take out. It's part of the screening process.

They want immigrants who bring value and won’t be a “burden on the state”. My uncle lives in Australia and has lived there for years but a number of years in was diagnosed with ME. He’s been able to access support to supplement his income which enabled him to work part time and manage his symptoms.

Yanbu. My mum is aghast at the prospect of visas for Europe, that she can't use the EU queues at the airport etc. She seems to think it should be total freedom of movement for us but not for others.

they didn't discriminate because of the disability as such. They discriminated on the basis that the family would immediately be taking out of the system without ever having paid in.

No country in the world would disagree with that.

They discriminated bc of a disability??

Does the U.K. do this?

Not everyone can read between the lines. The referendum was a right mess.

to be fair - and i have long said that leave were way way too vague and should have been pressed on all the points.

But. Becoming non-EU country meant that the non-EU rules would be applied to travel etc. So if anyone had bothered to look, they could have seen what - worst-case, hard brexit - would have meant in terms of visas, length of stay, ownership of property, etc.

I could have lived with a soft-Brexit tbh. But. It is what it is.

Stupid choices win stupid prizes.

Really? What do you think 'freedom of movement' meant?

This is true. It is illegal to not pay a minimum contribution for health insurance, which really only covers the basics and there is a co pay of around €400. Added to that, the tax rate here starts at 35% on any money earned and rises to 50% at €77,000.

In addition, it would be extremely difficult for a non-Dutch speaking fifteen year old to attend a state school and international schools are expensive! Home education is technically illegal, although there are some exceptions. And it is expensive here! So, it is definitely not the utopia your colleague thinks it is!

But you can’t. You can ask to, but the relevant nation’s government can say ‘no’. Before Brexit, you could just up-sticks and go. It really is a tragic loss. And I say that as someone who’s never had even the slightest desire to live anywhere but the U.K.

yes, i know - that was back in the 90s before the rules changed.

It is neither here nor there now, because the UK couldn't ever do that because they had no way of knowing who had arrived from the EU and where they lived.

I think all of that was perfectly clear?

Not having unlimited stays, not having visa free access and some EU citizens woud likely leave.

I think that was pretty obvious for anyone who had an idea of what free movement meant.

No politician is ever telling voters exactly what the consequences of voting for them mean. You need to read between the lines (like when the Tory were first voted in, it was in the back of ‘benefit scroungers’ but somehow people on benefits didn’t think they would be affected).
You can’t just say ‘but it wasn’t clear’. It was as clear as it is for ANY vote

To be fair, a lot of the Brexit voters thought they were voting for a soft brexit that would leave us with free movement etc…..

Not that was a good idea in the first place either.

I certainly wouldn’t nod politely and come here to vent, I’d tell her to her face she’s an idiot.