Fed up of reading threads asking how they can get out of paying care home fees.

Funny some interests in the press would rather direct people to look at LA CE salaries rather than aggregate funding cuts by government.

I know it's different as a LA has 'guaranteed' income and little exposure to market competition though the statutory functions responsibilities, complexities and legal risks can knock those of a private firm into a hat. That example of a LA with c£450m turnover would have three times the turnover of one FTSE 250 firm whose CEO has a salary of £1.2m. Different kettle of fish between a LA and a private firm but an illustrative comparison.

@Poppins can I ask where you live.
Interested to see how other countries manage

The figures for our local county council (Essex) show council tax raises only about one third of council revenues but Adult Social Care consumes 35% of all council income. Another 35% is spent on Education then 10% on Childrens Services (Safeguarding etc). That's 80% of all council income committed to statutory services. Is it any wonder that the roads are full of potholes when council revenues are so squeezed?
www.essex.gov.uk/about-council/spending-and-council-tax/what-council-tax-pays

That article is dated December. Another barrel scraped.

my council is relatively small with a budget of 450 million, employs 1400 people and has around 800 statutory responsibilities. Its ceo is on £170,000 which I have no problem with.

how much do you think a local authority chief executive should earn?

Council tax has gone up partly to fund high local authority salaries - the CEO of a nearby Northern city council is on over £200k, plus around £40k pension contributions. Also, local government pension schemes are very expensive, employer contributions costing about 1/4 of council tax receipts. I can’t link to the broadsheets due to the paywalls, but the Express reports the same.

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/1993758/local-government-pensions-council

Pensioners pay council tax too.

And income tax.

@Kandalama you aren’t making a simple
comparison though?

In the case someone is still using a 3 bedroom house when their spouse has gone into care, they get to keep using it. In the case that someone on UC is living in a 3 bedroom house they own, they get to keep using it. I truly don’t see the difference, and you are answering only in generalities.

Go back and read the full conversation.

How is buying a house for yourself a sacrifice? Am I making a sacrifice every time I shell out for a Sainsbury's shop for my family?

Also, you realise that renters also pay (NOT sacrifice) monthly for decades, right?

We are paying ATM and l couldn't care less about it. Mum is happy and safe and that's all that matters 58k and rising 😊

Agree
For everyone over the age of 18
Thats the age group that’s rising in applications
Plus that’s also much longer care than the average two years an elderly person lasts in a care home.

We also need more people in full time work. That’s full time!

We need more people paying into the system not more people paying significantly more of their salary into it.

We need to get the the bottom of the real need of adult social care.

Why do you think your council tax has gone up so much
Its the huge rise in numbers receiving adult social care
Thats everyone over the age of 18 ( see the numbers on graphs up thread )
land that number keeps rising year on year …..hence RR budget

We are all paying towards that. As we should. To care for those who need it.

Its not just tax payers paying either. Pensioners pay council tax too.

Those younger people are becoming the norm though.
In the future there won’t be any assets to sell off. Well not for 50% of the population anyway.
Now there’s a lot less saving, less guaranteed work and less home ownership.

Higher council taxes and LA funding will be the norm.

For 18-64 yr olds who have social care 97% are funded entirely by LA ( approx I did post the figures on a previous page ). Rising year on year!
That’s a huge cost which has led to the enormous hikes in our Council Taxes.

So everyone is already paying. Not just tax payers but pensioners at home as well.

So working age people should pay more tax to allow people to leave a bigger inheritance to their own children?

Agree
Either a tax rise or an increase in ni ( which was just recently lowered 🤣)

Thats this countries future anyway as less will be able to pay

Not sure why you are being rude- I was asked how people could get cash out of a home and there is clearly a demand for these products otherwise they would not exist. And I think many people choose to use them as it’s the only way they can get money out of their home without moving.

I don’t think social care should be means tested. I think it should be funded maybe by an NI rate rise. Thankfully I don’t live in uk so if I ever need elderly care it will be provided at a high level.

Obviously working age people paying taxes. That’s how the welfare state works

Im happy to pay to support all elderly people who can’t care for themselves
Just as I am happy to pay for education even though I never used it
Im happy to pay for cancer patients and all disabled and ill people

There is a difference between NHS medical care eg chemotherapy for cancer and social care needs for those who are too frail to care for themselves. That's a service, not a medical need.
It is clearly unfair to make younger, poorer people to pay for social care (not medical care) of those who have (often) hundreds of thousands of £ worth of assets. It is also clearly unaffordable when many young families cannot afford a homes. It is economically destructive to suppose that the UK government can keep borrowing to fund this as well. This would only hasten the complete destruction of the £. We need to think and behave rationally, not just come up with a never ending list of wants.

It’s worth noting again as no one has made suggestions
What happens in the future when there are less owner occupiers.

People can’t afford to buy now so what happens when this generation of WAP need care.?

The current system of getting self funders to keep care homes going won’t last much longer

Any thoughts?

Who do you propose pays for the care?

I suggest everyone who needs care gets it.

We don't ask people to pay back their cancer care or any other treatments.
Why are we asking dementia patients to pay their care?

I don’t agree that people should have to sell up in order to release money to live off before they qualify for UC ( or in fact all benefits not currently means tested including PIP etc etc )
I don’t actually agree with this

My agreement or not is irrelevant though

I was making a simple comparison that
underused assets for the elderly are means tested in order to assess LA support
underused assets for the non elderly are not

If we are going to truly treat everyone as equals we should be doing exactly that!

What are you suggesting instead?

Do you suggest that those without any assets receive no care? This may happen in the future but it hasn't yet and would seem inhumane.
As far as the differing fortunes between those with smaller amounts and those with very large amounts, that is just life. It has never been fair!