To think that people pretend not to understand obesity

I did. I had lost four stone with everyone's favourite eat less and move more. Then I had my gallbladder removed. I was a few pounds off my goal weight so carried on eating exactly as I had been (lots of salads, fish with veg etc) to lose a pound a week but within a couple of months was regaining at the rate I lost and put it all back on.
Having read a lot more about insulin resistance l, since WLI have been in the news, I think it's likely that the operation triggered that in me. At the time I just felt like my body had broken, that a 500 cal daily deficit was now seeing me gain weight.
But you know best obviously and no doubt I'm just a lazy fatty making excuses.

I’ve been on MJ since August. Started at 25st 8lbs, am now 21st 7lbs. The weight is coming off slowly but consistently. My goal is 12st. I’ve been fat my whole life - I was a fat child, a fat teenager and now a fat adult. My appetite has always been huge and have always desperately craved sugar. My parents (mum is a bit overweight, dad has always been slim) were at their wits end as they always fed me a healthy diet with limited treats but when I did have access to sugary stuff I just binged on it. I’ve always felt like something has been wrong with me/my hormones as to why I crave sugar and junk so much.
since starting MJ I feel like I’m eating normally for the first time in my life. I have said to friends no wonder lots of thin people can be so rude and unkind about fat people - they must think “well, just eat less?” which is a mindset I understand now my appetite and cravings are so reduced. Before, it genuinely wouldn’t have been an option. My cravings were all consuming and overwhelming. I lost 3 stone in 2020 by fasting 3 days a week and exercising for 2 hours a day every day - not sustainable and I was miserable.
For me WLI have been a miracle and I imagine I will need to be on them for a very long time as I genuinely believe there is something wrong inside my body that the medication balances out. I still fancy chocolate and biscuits etc and eat them when I fancy it, but the all consuming cravings and food noise are gone. That’s the difference.

Today I made veggie soup to take to the office. Ten minutes work for a tasty, healthy, filling, hydrating lunch with eight different veg. 250 calories, about 40p.

I'm impressed. Can you share the recipe? I don't think I could collect, wash, peel and chop 8 different veg in 10 mins, never mind cook, blend and transfer to a flask!

Aren't you amazing.
You should write a smug book.

To address the “it’s an addiction” comments.

For me, it wasn’t and isn’t an addiction. It’s literally just being hungry. Physical hunger. Not mental hunger.

For some other people I’m sure it’s true it is an addiction.

For whatever reason, and there are many, her body isn't getting satiety signals to stop eating.
It's actually very difficult not to over eat, when your body doesn't know that it has eaten enough and is telling you that you are still hungry. There is more to it than being a greedy bastard patting their belly.

It is virtually impossible to ignore " you are hungry, eat" signals from your body because it is a primal drive for survival. Just as being thirsty makes you crave a drink.
You are absolutely confirming the OPs point with your ignorance.

@Mumtumtastic thank you for your posts. What you say resonates with many of us.

I can feel sympathy for someone who struggles with an addiction yes, especially a substance as addictive as nicotine — but having never had a nicotine addiction, no I can’t empathise with how hard it must be to stop. Same with an eating addiction.

I recognise that there are medical conditions that cause some people to struggle to lose weight, but let’s at least be frank here, most obesity in the UK is caused by people eating too much of this ultra processed food and becoming either addicted to it or choosing it because they prefer it. At its most basic level, it is calories in vs calories out, I have in the past managed my own weight to be a little smaller or in some cases larger based purely on caloric intake and energy expenditure. It can be done, for most people. Excluding the medical anomalies.

(I am working on this, but the depression makes it harder)

I am quite tearful writing this so will say no more for now and check in later.

Wishing you all a lovely Monday, it is crazy beautiful out there today! Spring sunshine in all its glory.

Please remember kindness costs nothing. People are very good at reading non verbal communication so when I get judgemental looks and side eye because of my size, it hurts. When the symptoms get really bad (especially fatigue, pain and brain fog) my emotional resilience lowers and it actually makes me feel worthless.

That is far too simplistic. As a child your parents control what is put into your mouth and your tastes can get locked in. . Lots of people feed their children things like Ella's baby food pouches thinking through the marketing that they are healthy. School dinners reinforce some other bad choices made by parents.

How we respond to food and food cravings is hardwired. What your mother eats when she is pregnant and her emotions during pregnancy impact how you respond to food.Advertising is powerful (or else companies wouldn't spend millions of pounds on it). Emotional trauma, as with most addictions, can be linked to food.

I will add that my battles are completely invisible to the outside world.

All you will see is a big lady with a smile.

I nearly took my life last year, despite having 2 beautiful children and DH I love with all my heart, when the suffering became more than I could bear (chronic pain and other diseases I suffer also worsened, needed 2 operations and was bed bound for a period)

but all you will see is a big lady with a smile

Despite it all, I didn’t lose my smile 🥲

I agree but I think there are huge swathes of the country who actually don't know how to eat healthily or cook healthy meals. I'm thinking of people I've known since childhood. In the 70s and 80s they grew up eating ready meals and take aways or things out of tins. Their parents never cooked nutritious meals from scratch. Now they are parents or even grandparents themselves and they've raised their own children on similar foods. It's generational ad cultural - this lack of understanding about nutrition and how to cook. My in-laws live in southern Europe, originally from Asia. When I go to their countries (in Europe and Asia), I see the poorest people eating real food. Healthy meals made from vegetables and pulses. Here the poorest people tend to eat absolute crap. I'm really not surprised we have an obesity problem.

It also drove severe depression where I was depression free and happy before.

When hormones are out of whack it can literally change life as you know it

Please see my message above, yes for me it did.

An undiagnosed disease progression drove my weight gain. I was eating less but gaining 😢

By blaming the food industry you’re admitting that the problem is the type of food that people are eating. What you put in your mouth is entirely within your control. Nobody ever got obese eating the correct quantities of real food.

My calories in calories out is broken 😞

Hypothyroidism has chemically lowered my metabolism. It has also chemically caused depression whereas I was a very happy and ‘glass half full’ type person before.

The cals in out argument does not fit in every case. I eating less and the weight still piled on, all attempts to shift it failed (I worked hard and am still working hard)
I am still 4 stone overweight and obese as I am short.

I’m sorry you’ve also got thyroid problems too @iamnotalemon . Have the meds helped you? Yes, I am with you on that, the brain fog and crushing fatigue have been the worst.

The cognitive symptoms became so bad I was scared it might be early onset dementia (prior to thyroid diagnosis) as the fog got severe with location disorientation and confusion. Sometimes didn’t recognise what room I was in and forgot where I was going when out. Could not follow what people were saying, confusion with simple processes (like getting dressed) and memory shot. In the final few months before diagnosis I had slurred speech and was so fatigued I couldn’t walk properly (shuffled) and couldn’t stand up more than 3-4 minutes.

It was devastating, going from being a healthy normal adult to this and obese to boot.

We cannot always control the hand we get dealt in life.

(This goes for lots of things not just weight, but disabilities, predisposition to genetic traits, addictions etc)

@eggnog7

But it really is physics isn’t it, calories in vs calories out (with the exception of medical anomalies but I don’t believe that covers much of the large numbers of obesity in the country)

Obesity results from a calorie surplus, yes, but "just don't accumulate a calorie surplus then" isn't a helpful solution in itself. People with obesity are strongly predisposed to develop a calorie surplus because of genes, environment, and biology, in a way that people without obesity aren't. I can temporarily lose weight if I follow any diet that creates a calorie deficit, and I have done many times in my life, but the level of focus and obsession with food that doing this requires is not something that I can sustain over more than around a year, and the moment I take my eye off the ball the weight goes back on.

The only thing that has allowed me to live a normal life that isn't completely centred around what I have eaten, am eating or am going to eat next, is Mounjaro 🤷

Oh I don't know. I've never smoked, but I have huge empathy for smokers, who are desperate to give up but can't. No, I don't want to breathe in their smoke, but as long as they go outside to do it, I'm not going to judge them. No one would want to limit their life with smoking gladly.

Ironically, I know smokers that sit in judgement on fat people. 🙄🙄🙄

And as for this But it really is physics isn’t it, calories in vs calories out judgemental crap, you're are wilfully ignoring ignoring all the evidence to the contrary. And there IS plenty out there (some of which is in this thread) disproving this.

I would also question the wisdom behind a lot of the advice on 'healthy' eating.

The NHS eatwell plate advises 1/3 of our daily intake.comes from carbs.

We all know that excess carbs are converted into glucose (sugar) in the body.

We know about insulin. That insulin is released in response to glucose in the body.

Insulin is the 'fat storing hormone'. You can't lose fat efficiently whilst there is insulin present in your body.

Insulin is responsible for hunger pangs. Sugar highs and lows aren't necessary. Cravings aren't necessary.

People who eat low carb/keto (and do it properly) don't experience cravings, sugar highs or crashes. They also find that the food noise disappears and appetite is regulated.

But people regard low carb as a 'fad diet' claiming they don't want to cut put any food group but see low fat as common sense.

It is advice based on old science that believed eating fat makes you fat when sugar is the problem.

But it's hard to do because everywhere you go sells food that is absolutely laden with carbs, hidden carbs. Etc. It's practically impossible to buy any prepared food that doesn't contain any sugar. Even most shop bought pate and smoked salmon contains sugar.

What we actually need is real, independent, unbiased, up to date research done into weight gain/loss and an overhaul of the diet industry and the food industry in general. No research that is funded by the food industry or medical industry. But that won't happen because there's too much money to be made from junk food, junk food that presents itself as healthy and pharmaceutical companies selling expensive medication.

Eh, no. It improves your response to insulin.

In my case its meant instead of taking up to 90 (yes thats not a typo, and thats for a healthy diet of around 1200cal!) units of fast acting insulin + 34 units of long acting per day... I now take around 20 to 30 units of fast acting and 26 long acting each day.

So its dropped my fast acting insulin by two thirds, that is incredible. It's meant I don't now have visible, pitted, 'elephant skin' patches of lymphedema on various body parts, can move better, feel better etc etc.

For people who are not diabetic, being more responsive to insulin is still a good thing and will help them not put on weight and not have blood sugar swings/crashes that trigger them to eat.

That is its purpose, the 'it takes away food noise and slows digestion so you feel fuller for longer' is the side effect.

I don’t think it’s pretending to not understand, I think it really is difficult to empathise with something you haven’t experienced. I am a healthy weight and always have been and don’t struggle with addictions in my life to anything, so I don’t understand it. I can understand the basic principle of “it’s an addiction” but I can’t empathise with it or fully appreciate how the addiction even begins, iyswim. Anecdotally, I think a lot of diets seem destined to fail from the offset with too many rules and emphasis on “healthy” food. I eat junk food, I eat healthy food, sometimes I exercise, sometimes I’m lazy. But it really is physics isn’t it, calories in vs calories out (with the exception of medical anomalies but I don’t believe that covers much of the large numbers of obesity in the country). If MJ helps people, I think that’s a great thing, but I also think the mentality can be eased by not being so hard on yourself and just push in the right direction bit by bit.

But people don't have to eat them ! Humans have intelligence and independent thought. We have choice. Look back at the 1950s and very few people were overweight because there were few UPFs.

We know what to eat to maintain healthy weight. Basically grilled or roasted meat or fish with assorted veg. Or stews and casseroles with lots of veg. Eggs. Fruit. It's easy and cheaper.

It isn't about eating less. It's about avoiding

• endless sweet stuff
• Desserts
• Processed sauces and dressings
• Pastries, cakes, biscuits, ice cream, sweets, crisps, shop made puddings, and diet foods.
• Pasta, white over-processed flour goods.
• most alcohol

I'm a full time working single mum and I manage to cook from scratch. It really isn't difficult to provide fast basic food at low cost. I make my own wholemeal bread at the weekends. Cheaper and much better than tasteless, shop bought bread.

Today I made veggie soup to take to the office. Ten minutes work for a tasty, healthy, filling, hydrating lunch with eight different veg. 250 calories, about 40p. Better than the 500 calories and £4 for a flabby chicken mayonnaise sandwich in a nasty plastic triangle, & some crisps. £72 a month saving just on lunch !

@Mumtumtastic I also have a thyroid condition and whilst it’s treated and my results are ‘normal’, I definitely suffer with the symptoms (including not being able to lose weight). Worst for me is the fatigue and brain fog.

@JjaneEeyre

I could have written that. I’m good with money and not bothered by alcohol but food is a completely different matter.