To feel scared about having kids, especially boys, after watching Adolescence on Netflix?

I have two DS, 14 & 16 yo. They are great humans and have lovely friends, whom I love having around.

Parental controls are tight but I am aware they may see stuff from other kids phones.

We have dinner together almost every night and have often very interesting conversations whilst eating. We have talked about everything, Andrew Tate, incels, politics etc. And before anyone says it’s a middle class bubble, I’m not British and only have a vocational college degree. DH is from a working class home and went straight to work after A levels.

We use respectful language at home. My DH is a great role model and he never uses derogatory terms at home. My older DS when he was 12 called me Karen once. Well I made sure it was also the last time! He has not repeated since. Zero tolerance for any ageist, racist or misogynist language. We do take the piss out of eachother though! (Good natured one 😇).

DS2 now has a girlfriend. When he told me, I sat him down and said if anything intimate happens between them, he’s not to go and brag to his mates. Girl’s dignity is paramount. I also told him no means no and if he sees porn from someone’s phone (god he was squirming 🤣), it’s unrealistic and unreasonable to expect it to happen in real life. Also absolutely not to send any nudes. If the other party is asking for them, it’s a red flag. Luckily their dating seems quite innocent and so far not all consuming first love.

Reading this back, I sound like I think I’m a perfect parent 🫣 I’m really not, teen years are a minefield and I also worry about so many things that may or may not happen.

Don't be scared! I have two wonderful boys, a teen and an almost teen. Both have a lovely group of friends. My teen attends a v good comprehensive where internet safety and pastoral support is talked about often. He is well mannered and he and his friends are great kids. Both my boys spend a lot of time online, but we have guidelines and talk about everything they do and watch. Mainly they play online games with their friends. They keep their doors open (and the younger is only allowed to use devices in the lounge or kitchen, not his own room yet) and I hear everything! It's really fine as long as the communication with mum and dad is open.

My boys have lots of outside interests like cadets, football, athletics, guitar etc.. they spend time with their friends in real life as well as online! They work hard at school and are happy to discuss issues like the influence of Andrew Tate and other similar on social media.

Boys can be wonderful, polite, friendly, hard working, happy, individuals with great friends and good schools. It's not all doom and gloom. Really. I love my boys and am v proud of them and there is no reason at all that your boys wouldn't also be wonderful, polite, respectful young people who I am sure will grow into well rounded adults.

Chivalrous and protective are not dirty words

What does cultural decay even mean?

It is very rare you see masculinity mentioned as a positive and it is usually preceded by the adjective ‘toxic’.

Is it any wonder teenage boys struggle to find an identity?

In the old days they would have been brought up to be chivalrous and protective but now, to many, those are dirty words. So the likes of Andrew Tate fill in the vacuum. It is a massive mistake to think he is stupid. Many of the problems he identifies are very real and many of his ideas are positive. He just mixes it up with truly toxic misogyny.

It is no good moaning about the ‘menz’ and how good they had it for how long. That doesn’t help a 15 year old boy.

We need to stop what seems to be a war of the sexes and provide positive role models for both sexes and teach them how we need both sexes in society and about how the right kind of masculinity should be encouraged.

@Holdmeclosecooedthedove
fatal stabbings are not an everyday occurrence but happen a damn sight more than when I was a kid. That’s the thick end of the wedge granted.

The thin end of the wedge is more apparent and working in a secondary school I see and hear evidence of this everyday -
• misogynistic porn inspired language thrown around by boys casually,
• boys being open about accessing and watching hard core porn on a regular basis,
• boys expecting extreme sexual acts from girls as standard, again porn inspired

A few examples.

This programme explores factors which could influence a boy to commit this heinous act. These are some factors which encourage a disillusioned young man to see girls as objects for their use.

Im still not sure what it is you disagree with on my previous post?

Cultural decay and poor integration

I don't think the drama intended to be an infomercial on the Danger of Tate. It was, as you say, a work of fiction, inspired by the upsurge in young male VAWG, that explored the influences behind it. Tate and his ilk were only ever presented as one piece in a jigsaw of influences. If people have created a folk devil, it's because it's more comfortable to think misogyny in young boys is being 'created' by Tate, and if we just restrict online access they will be fine. This allows parents to avoid examining their own role modelling. My interpretation of the drama is not that Tate created a murder, or that bullying did, or upbringing, or mental health issues, but that it was An Inspector Calls and we need to be aware of all of these issues.

My dds are a little older than the kids in Adolescence however they have both been affected by the issues raised in this show and I wish ALL parents would just take some time aside to ponder the wider issues raised in the programme and not shut down any discussion on the basis of it being ‘fiction’ or because their child doesn’t stay out late and has their screen monitored.

In fact the whole thing would have been a lot more plausible if the crime had happened during the day because often these knife crimes do, often outside school or on the way home from school.

We live in a very middle class area but my dds have witnessed or heard of:

Sexual abuse, often at parties where boys have taken advantage of drunk girls.

A boy bringing a knife into school to threaten a girl who had pissed him off (while in Year 8. The boy was expelled immediately).

Frequent exchanges of nudes resulting in blackmail. In one incident a GIRL was making a bank of them to threaten other girls with (she was making the boys send them to her). Again, police were involved.

Boys as young as 12 playing Call of Duty and simulating rape on a prostitute.

misogynistic language. This is constant.

All girls are expected to shave their pubic hair and be open to anal sex.

This was all happening five plus years ago. I dread to think what some of these boys have become.

But this was a work of fiction. It was a drama, it is not real. It was inspired by true events, but interestingly the drama appears nothing like those events - because it would never have been aired and it would have been socially unacceptable to discuss the details of what happened. So instead we are all discussing this folk devil instead

And I have googled, nothing came up

Gareth Southgate hits the nail on the head when he talks about boys needing strong male role models and the lack of them can be when trouble brews
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ceqjpzg0qwno
I have a DS and a DD - I have different worries with each of them , however both do communicate well with me so I hope I would get warnings of anything untoward .
As PP has stated parenting is hard but very few kids go on to murder !

I agree not all young men are deviants, but i don't think any of us really know what our sons and their friends get up to in private

Have a 16yo son and don’t feel like that. I talk to him, we have great conversations and he has a lot of integrity, he’s not easily influenced. I’m unshockable though. He can say whatever and can swear like a docker if he likes, so long as he talks!

My daughter is far more of a closed book, she will be harder.

If you Google Tate you will see the stats on his influence yourself. Clearly he is not personally and solely responsible for the increase in VAWG amongst teens. He is merely the most prominent name associated with the movement that at least in part is. The drama itself showed the three influences of upbringing, peer pressure and online misogyny coming together in its most extreme manifestation of femicide. Arguably if any of the three were absent, the outcome may have been different.

I have one of each and am a lot more worried about my daughter - based on her personality. She is more outgoing, more influenced by peer pressure and more worried what people think of her. It’s not about what’s between her legs. It was eye opening how influenced boys are by their looks as well - this is much less spoken about. He was desperate to be loved.

I think Adolescence is a hugely important watch for all parents to look up from their mobiles. Yes, the irony.

Do you? Link me to the studies please, I've asked several times. I believe there are serious problems in society and schools and Andrew Tate is very low down that list. Do you believe Marliyn Manson was responsible for Columbine?

Furthermore. I believe attempts to counter Tates perceived influence are going to be dangerously counter productive

What utter tosh. Adolescence was brilliant but now the whole of the uk thinks every teenager is like this. That’s not the truth at all. I have a 16 year old, typical boy who tells me daily that he is trying to preserve his childhood for as long as possible 😂. You need to get your kids into something from a young age- mine have sports. It keeps them off the streets having that routine and discipline. You need to actual parent your child, don’t be afraid to turn off the internet and put those controls on tech. You need to be present, even if they are spending most of their time in their rooms you poke your head around too. Find the right balance between discipline and giving them responsibility. Welcome their friends, ask questions about them. Tell them straight that you won’t put up with any of this Andrew Tate shite. You could do all of this and yes they end up like adolescence it that really would be in the minority. What no one’s talking about today is how teenage boys are actually awesome. Mine came back from school today and spent a good hour in the garden with his sister as she was upset about something. He’s also an arsehole and he’s not revising for his exams 😂 but that’s as bad as he and his friends get.

@Holdmeclosecooedthedove do you know the influence people like Andrew Tate have on male youth? Do you know how that can impact the lives of girls and female staff in schools?

Teenage boys have always been disgusting and bit/very misogynistic.

Anyone remember the Inbetweeners? Literally all of their chat was made up sex fantasies about girls in their year group.

How often is this manifesting in real life consequences?

@Holdmeclosecooedthedove
What do you disagree on? When a young man can go on the internet and join a chat forum with uncle participants who will egg on and encourage him in those beliefs with absolute real life consequences then it’s pretty serious and needs discussing.

My post at 16.04 literally mentions 'intellectual capacity';

"The ability to even process ideas about concepts of morality, to think and believe in ideals is most likely completely absent in many of these cases as there has been no development of intellectual capacity to do so. So yes, be flippant all you like but I would say it as the cost of well rounded young adults and society as a whole"

Perhaps touch up on your comprehension skills....

The show would not worry me. It’s the sheer worry of how many young boys seem to be either groomed into gang life or victims of it (even if they play no part in it). I am terrified of my nephews heading to school alone.

It’s why I could never have been a solo mother by choice. It would be too big a risk had I had sons and had to work leaving them to entertain themselves….

It's far more scary having a daughter at secondary school

I have read back my post and you are being disingenuous as I have used, 'intellectual capacity'. You are right, I shouldn't have used, 'intelligence', I should have stuck to intellectual capacity. I think it is a bit of a leap to suggest that error totally invalidates my point. However, I get the impression you are being defensive, unsure why...It's ok to have an honest discussion, especially as like you I'm offering up a reason for the suggested issue, you belittling my argument is not going to convince me that it is somehow lacking 😂