Feel this country has become rotten - benefits

Agree totally.
Government cannot make firms take people on, so they will choose for themselves the candidate they want.
It's nothing to do with the govt who somebody takes on...
What does this actually mean anyway, does it mean people who don't get pip will have to sign on for uc and visit the jobcentre.
Will they be sanctioned if they don't turn up?

Well, a state objective is cheap and means nothing. From what they have announced now, nothing will make work pay. They are just making changes around the edges making eligibility for benefits trickier but they are not changing anything fundamentally. They should start by removing all the cliff edges for a start - both for benefits claimants going into work and for higher earners who are hoarding hours to avoid the said cliff edges. For example, make childcare tax deductible (thus incentivising work and earnings) instead of limiting it to x number of hours and taking it away completely from higher earners. Invest heavily (potentially through incentives) into productivity improvements and retraining (Denmark is a great example on retraining). These are just tiny examples that are relatively low pain. Business rates are a joke and are killing SMEs. Etc etc etc that’s before we start talking about pension reform and NHS reform which are not on the agenda.

I’m not on benefits? I work FT, 40hrs a week and I’ve worked since I was 13, all through college and university
i don’t have the energy to retrain while i am working full time, I’m already struggling working 40hrs
what helps my health condition is WFH which is what I have and dropping my hours would help but I can’t afford to do that being single

That’s already a pretty big drop. Does it say what’s causing that? Visa changes?

The next gov may well run with a cap but a drop that big may help take some heat out of the issue.

As for past that long term hard to say but I did hear a good speaker from Oxford Institute on aging and director talked about people being worried about immigration and other groups concerned about AI and she pointed out the groups were too siloed.

She said the solutions may well come from a merging of those two things. I agree with that take, Sarah Harper I think was her name.

I have seen those threads too and I post on them.

Employers want the best candidate. They don't want someone who will be off sick lot, has lots of appointments, has lots of reasonable adjustments or adaptions. Or has challenging behaviour.
Yes a fair few disabled people on MN hasve said they have good and supportive bosses who pull out all the stops to make sure they can still do their job as they are valued.
I can guarantee that none of those people are on min wage entry level jobs. They are all corporate and WFH.

Maybe you could retrain in something that would be more accommodating of your health condition?

I'm not directing this at you in particular but there have been a few of these threads with people on various benefits saying they can't possibly work because of x,y and z, some without ever at least trying.

I've seen some very negative and defeatist attitudes and I this needs to change as we simply cannot afford to continue paying benefits at the rate we are. Especially to young people some of whom seem to say they can't work for the rest of their lives

I've heard doctors will be signing fit notes saying what people can do, rather than sick notes saying what people can't do, which I think is a very good idea.

I have suffered from severe mental health issues including being suicidal, have impaired sight and hearing, plus other issues I don't want to go into but work full time. Working has been the absolute best thing for me and my recovery.

The Minimum Wage has made things worse because it is being used as a 'maximum' wage in many cases instead, thus preventing realistic wages being paid appropriate to the person's experience and ability.

Yes the UK had a purple patch where there was more money than there is now but it was never going to last and a world where a government can support masses of unproductive people indefinitely is a fantasy land

Based on the above logic would you scrap the state pension?

Don't say people earned it because most will not have paid anything close to the tax needed to cover it plus it's paid forward.

Although Labours objective re their election manifesto is to
Make Work Pay

They've announced changes to benefits re disabilities as part of this
Just waiting to see what’s next now

Thatcher also sold off our infrastructure - so high travel, water, Telecon and power costs too.

There is way too much short term thinking in this country. We should never have done this.

It’s k to start on minimum wage or close to it if you can triple or quadruple that in 10-25 years but you’ll max out at 35-45k there’s no point -

Also inflation matters

40k today is the equivalent to 32k 5 yrs ago & 26k in 2010.

He'd probably die.

Your original post was ‘immigration is not going anywhere’ with a 30 year stat.

The statistic I posted was to highlight the changing demographics and why governments are pro immigration.

"Net migration into the UK hit a record 906,000 in the year to June 2023, and then fell to 728,000 in the year to June 2024.
The ONS projects that it will continue to decline until 2028, but after that will remain at 340,000 per year as a long term average."

The above is the only figures I have read on forecasted immigration & I don't expect them to be less than the below. As far as I am aware the current government has not put a cap on?

Over 30 years AI and automation will change things and I wouldn’t be surprised if immigration numbers go down due to that.

So when do you expect to see the reduction? How much reduction do you expect? 50%?

Some people have attempted to explain to you that addiction is a complex issue. I'm afraid I don't have the patience to offer further information to someone so ill informed.
In any case you can't pick and choose who gets supported by your tax contributions. As a childfree pensioner who is still working and paying tax, if I were that way inclined I might not want to support families with large numbers of children. I have a wider and more holistic approach to supporting society than that though.

Min wage jobs can be the start for some people, and for others it is all they can do.
I loved my min wage job and could not move up from it anyway. I knew a few people in my role go up to supervisor and drop back down again as it was a tiny pay rise for a lot more stress.

There shouldn’t also be the pressure to move on from min wage jobs because you have to earn more
People can’t moan about customer service then because all the staff will be new!

I can’t find anything I’m qualified for that will also fit with my health conditions so I’m stuck on just over min wage
I do have a degree. The ones that are paying more are longer hours (8-6) and not WFH and maybe 2k more than min wage

I will get slated for this but there’s absolutely no point working if you do not have significant potential to increase your earning capacity over time. It’s k to start on minimum wage or close to it if you can triple or quadruple that in 10-25 years but you’ll max out at 35-45k there’s no point - you’ll never be able to buy a house, have a “standard” family with two kids, enjoy little extras and go on holiday. You’ll be lining hand to mouth. So, yes, social contract is broken and you are better off on benefits, especially if you have children and your alternative would be a minimum wage job. I say this as a high earner whose taxes pay for guide benefits. In the current broken society, being on benefits vs minimum wage is the right choice. People respond to incentives. Unfortunately, massive reforms are needed across multiple domains that no party wants to pursue. So yes, this country is fucked.

I know a man in his early 70s who lives in an HMO. He spends all day in the pub as he hates being at home.
HMOs are grim. They might work for people in the short term, but they should never be someones forever home.
A NMW job should be enough for someone to have a home that they don't share and say the space is their own.
The people saying that NMW are just a stop gap are privileged. Some people will never achieve more than NMW.

Your original post was ‘immigration is not going anywhere’ with a 30 year stat.

Over 30 years AI and automation will change things and I wouldn’t be surprised if immigration numbers go down due to that.

I imagine rather than a HMO you would prefer workhouses.

Every single person should be able to afford a studio flat.

I think the problem is high rents caused by Thatcher selling off social housing and our rights to North Sea oil profits.

Thatcher also sold off our infrastructure - so high travel, water, Telecon and power costs too.

Imagine if our country wasn't spending £209 billion per year on civil service pensions (state pensions costs £168 billion). This scam was set up by Thatcher too.

Wonder why Finland is the happiest country?

Agree. Even the Ukrainian refugees that I knew secured jobs as soon as they got here.

This is not true. Economic studies have shown for decades that immigrants on the whole are a benefit to the economy.

Accepting not excepting, clearly. I must be tired 🙃

I totally agree!

A good book instead