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Feel this country has become rotten - benefits

392 replies

She11y · 20/03/2025 23:13

A studio apartment in my area is about £800 per month.
A minim wage job is around £1500 per month net.
After you've worked in a hard and demanding job - most minimum wage jobs are demanding - you've got £700 to pay for food, travel, bills, clothes.
You might end up with £100 left over each month. Working hard all your life with no hope of owning your own home or having any sort of financial stability.
No wonder people don't want to work. Make owninf a house affordable and over night 1/3 the people claiming benefits will stop.

My point is that a lot of people are on benefits because they're depressed at the hopelessness of their futures, and try to avoid working.

OP posts:
WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 18:50

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 18:47

I have to admit I'm not very sympathetic to depression/anxiety. I've mentioned on one of these threads, I lived with someone for years who used mental health and suicide threats to manipulate, control, and make me do what they wanted. Maybe this is why a seem to lack sympathy.

That is sad to hear. I have also had that experience with some people. They have used it to get their own way.
But I really don't think people that are expressing how low and desperate they are feeling after hearing about the benefit cuts are doing it as manipulation. I am one of them, and we are scared.

ThisOldThang · 21/03/2025 18:49

AlmostAJillSandwich · 21/03/2025 01:38

I'd love to but i can't. I'm disabled and live with a parent who is my carer in their home and they have said no to partner moving in.
My parent cannot afford for me to move out and lose my disability benefits being part of the household income, and both being disabled to the point we can't work me and partner couldn't afford to private rent, even if we could scrape it many landlords would turn us down for being on benefits. Neither of us have a working person who could be guarantor. As a couple with no dependents we would never be priority for council or social housing, and neither could cope in shared or emergency "temporary" accomodation with shared kitchens or bathrooms due to specifics of our OCD.
Everything was ticking along fine til last August when his housing situation living with a parent fell through as they couldn't afford their outright owned house anymore thanks to COL. They sold up and bought a one bed they can manage til state pension age and made him homeless.

Edited

Is OCD your disability?

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 18:47

Lyannaa · 21/03/2025 17:37

You’re not very good at empathy are you?

30 years ago, plenty of people were struggling but the stigma was even worse than it is now. So a lot of people suffered in silence and poverty as they hid themselves away. Not wanting to admit the extent of their problems even to themselves because of the shame. I know this because there were people in my family living this sort of existence and every week there were stories about what scrape or injury they’d got that week.

I find it disgusting that some people think that it should still be that way.

I have to admit I'm not very sympathetic to depression/anxiety. I've mentioned on one of these threads, I lived with someone for years who used mental health and suicide threats to manipulate, control, and make me do what they wanted. Maybe this is why a seem to lack sympathy.

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 18:46

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 18:40

Somebody on one of these threads suggested that people should qualify for PIP, as now, but the PIP payment should go to any employers they work for to help fund allowances the person might need. I thought that might be a good idea.

WHat if you are not on PIP?

RatedDoingMagic · 21/03/2025 18:45

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 18:40

Somebody on one of these threads suggested that people should qualify for PIP, as now, but the PIP payment should go to any employers they work for to help fund allowances the person might need. I thought that might be a good idea.

That's terrible. There's loads of things that people might need PIP for that have nothing to do with employment. By all means an extra payment to employers who employ people who get PIP but ffs the idea of diverting the PIP money to them is horrific!

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 18:40

RatedDoingMagic · 21/03/2025 17:41

Surely the next step will be different rates of National Insurance for employers based on what percentage of their payroll is going to employees who have documented additional needs for reasonable adjustments to help them be employed, with a weighting for how onerous to the employer those are. e.g. providing you with an extra bit of equipment as a one-off cost = low impact, high flexibility due to regular hospital appointments and regular episodes of being unable to work = high impact. Any employer who isn't doing their fair share of providing employment to people with additional needs has to pay more NI, and suddenly the autistic and awkward interviewee who can clearly do the job brilliantly but will struggle to integrate with the team socially looks a lot more attractive!

Somebody on one of these threads suggested that people should qualify for PIP, as now, but the PIP payment should go to any employers they work for to help fund allowances the person might need. I thought that might be a good idea.

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 18:03

RaininSummer · 21/03/2025 18:01

The young people entering the job market would be perfect

Not all young people will be able to progress.
What about older people who have been out of the job market? If the government are bumping people off benefits, then there will be a lot of older people looking for a first role.
So middle aged and young people after the same jobs.

RaininSummer · 21/03/2025 18:01

LilacPeer · 21/03/2025 17:50

If everyone just goes off to better paying jobs….who is doing the minimum wage ones?

The young people entering the job market would be perfect

Secretmeetings · 21/03/2025 17:54

Lyannaa · 21/03/2025 17:37

You’re not very good at empathy are you?

30 years ago, plenty of people were struggling but the stigma was even worse than it is now. So a lot of people suffered in silence and poverty as they hid themselves away. Not wanting to admit the extent of their problems even to themselves because of the shame. I know this because there were people in my family living this sort of existence and every week there were stories about what scrape or injury they’d got that week.

I find it disgusting that some people think that it should still be that way.

In an ideal world being caring and sharing would be the solution BUT there are not sufficient resources to go round. Excessive, spurious benefit claims are rampant and this is impacting the lifestyle of everyone else.

We have also reached a place in society whereby people appear to be proud of their difficulties, imperfections and life mistakes. People think it is their right to expect others to fund them. We need to unlearn that thinking.

Previously people acted with dignity and pride. Family, neighbours helped when they could and those in more difficult situations appreciated it and showed gratitude.

This is what we have lost.

LilacPeer · 21/03/2025 17:50

Waitfortheguinness · 21/03/2025 17:47

Oh good god, don’t be ridiculous……if you want to have a better lot than you have now, you’ll have to earn more!

If everyone just goes off to better paying jobs….who is doing the minimum wage ones?

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 17:48

Waitfortheguinness · 21/03/2025 17:47

Oh good god, don’t be ridiculous……if you want to have a better lot than you have now, you’ll have to earn more!

Min wage should be enough to live on. It used to be. What changed?
The ability for some people to earn more has not changed.

Waitfortheguinness · 21/03/2025 17:47

itsleviosa · 21/03/2025 15:58

There shouldn’t also be the pressure to move on from min wage jobs because you have to earn more
People can’t moan about customer service then because all the staff will be new!

Oh good god, don’t be ridiculous……if you want to have a better lot than you have now, you’ll have to earn more!

RatedDoingMagic · 21/03/2025 17:41

PassingStranger · 21/03/2025 16:35

Agree totally.
Government cannot make firms take people on, so they will choose for themselves the candidate they want.
It's nothing to do with the govt who somebody takes on...
What does this actually mean anyway, does it mean people who don't get pip will have to sign on for uc and visit the jobcentre.
Will they be sanctioned if they don't turn up?

Surely the next step will be different rates of National Insurance for employers based on what percentage of their payroll is going to employees who have documented additional needs for reasonable adjustments to help them be employed, with a weighting for how onerous to the employer those are. e.g. providing you with an extra bit of equipment as a one-off cost = low impact, high flexibility due to regular hospital appointments and regular episodes of being unable to work = high impact. Any employer who isn't doing their fair share of providing employment to people with additional needs has to pay more NI, and suddenly the autistic and awkward interviewee who can clearly do the job brilliantly but will struggle to integrate with the team socially looks a lot more attractive!

nearlylovemyusername · 21/03/2025 17:37

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 17:02

Both conditions are awful to live with. Do you think he has not tried all he can already?

I'm not familiar with his situation. But if you take the healthiest adult (or child for that matter) and put them to bed with no activity and make them browse/watch Netfix for months with no end they will end up depressed with severe MH issues. This lifestyle does not support mental health, it's vicious cycle.

Lyannaa · 21/03/2025 17:37

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 16:43

So, 30 years ago say, when we didn't have loads of people like your partner on disability benefits for mental health problems, were death rates a lot higher ? Or street homelessness ? I don't think we did (very willing to be proven wrong) so what did they do back then? I think the big institutions/asylums had closed by then so they weren't living there, where were they ?

You’re not very good at empathy are you?

30 years ago, plenty of people were struggling but the stigma was even worse than it is now. So a lot of people suffered in silence and poverty as they hid themselves away. Not wanting to admit the extent of their problems even to themselves because of the shame. I know this because there were people in my family living this sort of existence and every week there were stories about what scrape or injury they’d got that week.

I find it disgusting that some people think that it should still be that way.

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 17:02

nearlylovemyusername · 21/03/2025 16:53

or he'd find a way to deal with OCD and depression, esp given how advanced medication is

Both conditions are awful to live with. Do you think he has not tried all he can already?

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 17:01

FreedomandPeace · 21/03/2025 16:52

But if you are classed as disabled you will get PIP.

Not really. A lot of disabled people do not claim PIP. The whole process is stressful and some of us feel the risk to our mental heath is too much to even try. Some people earn good money and feel they should not apply, but they are still disabled.
We are still disabled though.

SweetPotatoWedges · 21/03/2025 16:59

BoredZelda · 21/03/2025 15:29

This is not true. Economic studies have shown for decades that immigrants on the whole are a benefit to the economy.

Well that doesn’t quite follow through according to this:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/03/17/more-than-one-million-foreigners-claim-benefits/

£7.5 billion in benefits a year to households comprising at least one foreign national.

The highest amount of disability claims from people aged 16+ are from Bangladeshi/Pakistani nationals - White British make up only 28% of claims.

researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-9602/CBP-9602.pdf

Still Starmer and his supporters will place the blame on lazy, workshy, native Brits because they are too cowardly to address the elephant in the room.

nearlylovemyusername · 21/03/2025 16:53

FoolishHips · 21/03/2025 16:13

He'd probably die.

or he'd find a way to deal with OCD and depression, esp given how advanced medication is

FreedomandPeace · 21/03/2025 16:52

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 16:38

Yes and then sanctioned for not being able to get job at all. All this pressure on top of living on fuck all and being disabled at the same time.
It is no wonder some people are talking about suicide.

But if you are classed as disabled you will get PIP.

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 16:47

itsleviosa · 21/03/2025 16:37

I’m on a min wage job WFH with adjustments which is the reason I can still work FT (just, there’s a lot of catching up on sleep and skipping meals to go straight to bed!)
Currently waiting on an operation which should massively improve things but I have a lot of sickness

I hope you get an op date soon.

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 16:46

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 16:43

So, 30 years ago say, when we didn't have loads of people like your partner on disability benefits for mental health problems, were death rates a lot higher ? Or street homelessness ? I don't think we did (very willing to be proven wrong) so what did they do back then? I think the big institutions/asylums had closed by then so they weren't living there, where were they ?

Does it matter? That poster is worried to death about her partner due to stuff happening right now?
What wold be gained about wondering about the past?

Kendodd · 21/03/2025 16:43

FoolishHips · 21/03/2025 16:13

He'd probably die.

So, 30 years ago say, when we didn't have loads of people like your partner on disability benefits for mental health problems, were death rates a lot higher ? Or street homelessness ? I don't think we did (very willing to be proven wrong) so what did they do back then? I think the big institutions/asylums had closed by then so they weren't living there, where were they ?

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 16:38

PassingStranger · 21/03/2025 16:35

Agree totally.
Government cannot make firms take people on, so they will choose for themselves the candidate they want.
It's nothing to do with the govt who somebody takes on...
What does this actually mean anyway, does it mean people who don't get pip will have to sign on for uc and visit the jobcentre.
Will they be sanctioned if they don't turn up?

Yes and then sanctioned for not being able to get job at all. All this pressure on top of living on fuck all and being disabled at the same time.
It is no wonder some people are talking about suicide.

itsleviosa · 21/03/2025 16:37

WeylandYutani · 21/03/2025 16:28

I have seen those threads too and I post on them.

Employers want the best candidate. They don't want someone who will be off sick lot, has lots of appointments, has lots of reasonable adjustments or adaptions. Or has challenging behaviour.
Yes a fair few disabled people on MN hasve said they have good and supportive bosses who pull out all the stops to make sure they can still do their job as they are valued.
I can guarantee that none of those people are on min wage entry level jobs. They are all corporate and WFH.

I’m on a min wage job WFH with adjustments which is the reason I can still work FT (just, there’s a lot of catching up on sleep and skipping meals to go straight to bed!)
Currently waiting on an operation which should massively improve things but I have a lot of sickness