Too harsh on ND child?

It's not abusive to get angry and tell a kid who is being rude that he is acting inappropriately.

He was clearly able to change his behaviour when he realized he'd crossed the line.

Some things are just normal kid stuff.

Catch 22, you’re all feeding into each others behaviours and trigger ring each other . I agree with ignoring him once he’s been sent off to shower. If DH can’t manage this he should go for a walk till he is calm, then return.

You need to stop comparing your children. And try to pause and think what decisions you want to make in the moment. And you need to have a plan to put into action during these times. Maybe if you model it, your DH will see the benefits and copy it.

You're scared he'll grow up into a prick, I get it. But right now he's 10. It's kind of prime prick age 😂 and he's shown that at school he can behave well.

I would try stepping in with distraction or changing the scene as soon as a whiff of antagonism starts rather than expect him to follow rules he's not followed 1000 times before and maybe even gets a kick out of not following.

Also longer term: How can you give him more responsibility, make him feel good about himself, show you trust him? Do you get much 1-1 time?

If my child calls me a name, says I'm stupid or for example tells me to shush, I lean into that. So I might say "oh I'm too stupid to make you pudding, too bad" "oh I'm too stupid to take you to your friend's house in the car" they apologize immediately and say I'm great 😂 if they shush I might go silent and mime that I can't talk. It's a playful way of moving on. I do get stern with mine, don't get me wrong, but I try to give them ways of making it right without anger first. I'm trying to think of the long game, self esteem and connection with them.

😰

I honestly think you sound to reactive .

My D’s has ADHD/ASD ..

you escalate punishments … I rather than saying this will happen , that will happen - there will be be a consequence once I have considered it . Your dc does not sound like the kind of child who backs down so no point pushing .

Don’t debate - simple statements later .
you can discuss what he could have done done differently.

make sure he gets plenty exercise on meds off days - my Ds doesn’t have a break - if he ever missed a dose because he was ill took a few days to get back to his norm .

Also if watching Tv it is hard to sit still fidget toys or other activities he enjoys so he can be part of the family without having to do it your way .

After all that said it’s hard trying to get it right but hard for him to function in a NT world .

Sorry OP, I do think you’re too harsh with him.

Things like this
It’s more along the lines of, this iPad is a privilege, for boys who can be sensible and mature, and until you can behave like that, you’re not sensible nor mature enough to have the iPad.

I mean…people with adhd have issues with impulsiveness. I think you said he may have asd too and that’s very often associated with emotional immaturity.
You seem to want him to be someone he isn’t, instead of helping him be the best ‘him’ he can be?

I know it’s hard on you and his sibling too.
I know it is. But it’s hard on him too and I don’t think you’re approaching it the right way, sorry.

@Itisalwayspossibletobekind
Awesome post. A must read.

Hello again. Imagine one of those days when you are at your most stressed out, perhaps with some additional worries about anything that can really tip you over the edge, push every one of your most tender buttons.

You are coiled up so tightly, you can't really think rationally, you're under pressure to do a million things 'right now / by 8:15am' etc, and you then are bombarded with other things that you usually can tolerate but on this particularly day just feel like someone scratching nails on a blackboard x 100 decibels louder than you can bear. [Add in anything else you can think of to make this day worse.]

You've now gone over the edge.

You're spiralling, you're being irrational, and you are losing it. You might be shouting, but you're not even really sure what now.

People who love you have tried to show you compassion, but it just can't work right now because you can't handle it ... and if any one else could "see" everything you were buckling under, they would IMMEDIATELY totally just get WHY.

You basically lose your rag. You know you shouldn't - by goodness, you really DO know how you OUGHT to behave / be / how you WANT to be, but you just really can't. It is - quite frankly - beyond your coping abilities in any shape or form right now.

Imagine you being videoed at this point, and it played out publicly. Imagine the shame you would feel.

Then along comes your boss (or any other human you really respect, love or value.)

They proceed to point out - in an irate manner - all the horrible, negative things you have just done, with really great justification, and wowwwwww, they really have the upper hand now. Not only are they seeing you at your absolute worst, but they're seeing you when you're most ashamed of how you're behaving too, and on top of this, they even get to eloquently elaborate this and make you feel a gazillion times worse! Pretty snooty tone they're using too, righteous and pompous, boy that really is just what you need right now too (!).

You actually already knew you have behaved far below the standards you aspire to, but given the perfect storm, you are actually - it turns out - fallible.

Nevertheless, your boss goes on to publicly announce (in front of people who you would feel great shame about hearing this) in clear and hideously frank terms how utterly awful you are, etc etc - and to boot - adds in a financial penalty which feels to you catastrophic at this point.

But what feels worse is the horrible words used to describe you, when you were literally at your lowest ebb, barely coping and ... being fallible. They cut like knives. They sting, they hurt, those words are unbearable, and not least because - well, yes - you were being like that at that point. Must you really be such an awful individual? Does your boss (or other person inserted here that you love/ crave the approval of / would hate to see you at your lowest and most shameful behaviours) REALLY only see this awful side of you? Did they have to react like that? Could they have adopted even a tiny bit different of a stance?

Could they have perhaps thought "nowwwww then. Hmmmmm. I know itscoldplay. I know she's a fab person. I know she's funny, kind, has huge expectations of herself, and really values everyone around her. She must really be having something tough to handle here for her to react that way. Jeesh, she's probably feeling awful underneath this! I'd never want to embarrass her, nor point out that she's really clearly lost it here, that is plain and evident. She's pretty smart, I know when she calms down, she'll probably realise this too ... I can certainly give her grace and bite my own tongue because no wayyyyy am I having even 1 millionth of such a bad day as she clearly is right now. I wonder what I can do to be of assistance? Perhaps if I just back off a little, stay close enough so she knows I'm here, and keep myself calm and regulated, she will be able to reach for me however she can - she might not phrase it nicely right now, I can certainly see that - but I'll be a source of compassion and calm, and her biggest ally, cheerleader and supporter by showing her that I'm simply ... here. Uncriticising. Unjudgementally. Calmly. Once she can perhaps hear me, I'll take some of the pressure of by offering her some flexibility, perhaps I can extend my deadline past 8:15, or offer to drive her to her meeting instead of walking ... or ... quick, quick, let me think of something else. Maybe she'd like to jump on this beaten up old mattress I keep stuffed behind the sofa for exactly this kind of meltdown time to jump on or pummell out my own frustrations. Perhaps I'll start doing that myself and maybe she'll join in jumping with me, who knows!"

Maybe going ballistic finally gives them the dopamine hit they’re craving.

No, losing your shit

• terrifies the child
• makes them think you hate them
• and makes them think it’s ok to lose your shit at a child when you’re an adult

This morning escalated as well unfortunately, I don’t think his latest medication is working all that well, and he then went on a spiral about how his friends aren’t good friends (it wasn’t even in context) so I have to admit I was quite harsh and pointed out that he’s rude to us, awful to his sister, if he claims his friends aren’t also a problem, perhaps it’s in fact him who is the problem.

Fuck me, that’s abusive. You write you KNOW the problem is his medication isn’t working but you TELL your child who is struggling with friendships and looking for a shoulder to cry on that HE is the problem? Why the fuck didn’t you tell him, hey it’s probably because your medication sucks and I want to get you on to something that has no breaks…

Fuck me, this kid’s self worth and self esteem must be in the toilet. To have your own mother not in your corner and basically say you deserve to not to have good friends because you’re rude and awful…

And he is 10!!!

This isn’t a stroppy NT teenager, this is a disabled child being told he’s a piece of shit because of how his disability affects him and his ability to make and keep friends.

I am diagnosed with ADHD and medication is a lifesaver. This “break” thing you speak of is only good for people that can cope without it when at home. Your DC obviously is like many of us and needs a slow release version that is not stopped, no breaks. Starting and stopping medication every week is going to put his emotions, and cause his control over impulses and focus to be wildly inconsistent….so yeah he’s going to impulsively blurt something rude because he has NO stability in medication. You can’t punish ADHD out of someone. You can’t withhold their medication and expect them to behave as well as they do while medicated. That’s like knocking an amputee out of a wheelchair and then punishing them because they take too long to drag themselves up a ramp and they’ve been rude and grumpy about having to do it by dragging themselves up with their eyelashes.

He’s 10, and just really hard work on the weekend especially when not medicated. Give the kid his meds.

We went through a really lovely patch of behaviour before half term but the break from medication over the holidays was tricky and we’ve actually just had to up his dose as it wasn’t working anymore (maybe he has had a growth spurt, not sure). Give the kid his meds.

Finding a way to regulate his emotions and teach him how to do so is probably going to be the best thing you can do….. This poster has the problem spot on, and the answer is his medication! He can’t retain and apply your advice to modify his behaviour without the medication.

My DS has ADHD. He us D to wind us all up but I'd breath deeply and if he lost something as a punishment I'd offer him something else instead. Eg if he lost his game boy I'd take him to the park to play football.

God am I pleased it’s not just me! Solidarity 💐

Simple as that, hey?

The op has actually said that extended time without the iPad makes his behaviour improve. It’s the same with my son and his console.

I take it for narcolepsy. It is absolutely better for me to take a day off and sleep all day than to continue taking my full dose 7 days a week. If I hadn't been doing that for the previous 10 years I'd have reached the maximum dose long before now and would be looking at the prospect of no quality of life 7 days a week for ever more rather than for one or two days a week.

Removing the iPad for that length of time is far too long!

The punishment needs to be proportional

’please don’t speak to me like that’

’if you continue with this attitude I am going to remove iPad time today’

3rd time - iPad removed

My son is about to be assessed for adhd and he is just like this.

its so tough but try not to get into a back and forth with him.

interestingly (and I’m not proud of this) my son only responds when I finally lose my shit and properly yell at him to go to his room.

Not so much that stopping every weekend is beneficial if behaviour is much worse.

Depends on which medication it is. Dexamfetamine absolutely has a tolerance factor to it

Tbh, apart from one single tutor (ND herself so didn't try to change the inherent autism traits), the whole field from SALT to OT to EP are full of the ridiculous advice.
Child cannot cope with more than 3 people in the group? Send him to mainstream to 'get used to it'.
Child doesn't make eye contact? Make it a target.
I obviously reject this, which makes me a troublemaker and I bear the consequences of it all the time.
No one would ask wheelchair user to try and walk. I have no idea why professionals just don't get it.

The caseworker needs a kick up the arse with her ablist bollocks. She may as well write “be less autistic” as a goal. Awful.

Reminds me of EHCP review today and 'targets'.
Caseworker thought it might be a good idea to add as a target 'will be able to engage up to half hour in a group chat'.
He can currently do 15min, but knows when he is overwhelmed and takes himself off to 'process' the conversation.
I get it from NT perspective it would be 'nice' to have bc then box can be ticked, but I can't ask my child to stay for extra 15 min to appease some nonsensical conversation rule.
He will get there on his own time eventually.
Mine has ADHD too and just can't stop talking if excited about subject. Not that we aren't trying but because of his condition. Some things they just can't do yet.

I guess I would say don't send him off to these events if he can't handle them because often teenagers don't get second chances. Some ND kids are better one to one than with a group. Neither of mine could do clubs for example - it always went spectacularly wrong.

Anyway, the cinema outing is a very specific example. I'm talking more about an overall approach. I guess I mean don't set kids up to fail by forcing or encouraging them to do things they can't do, even if it looks like sth you really want them to enjoy.

Concretely what are you saying? Not to put him in the difficult situation as he might never be in a position to encounter it IRL?
We are talking about watching a movie with people he knows, my DS is about to start secondary school (mainstream), is invited to playdates/parties etc so this is an activity he might very well encounter. Isn’t it better to be able to ‘rehearse’ at home first?

I’m not saying put him in a difficult situation on purpose, though. Just not avoid situations that he very likely will have to handle on his own later on.
Does that qualify as ‘tough love’??