To ask what really combats misogyny? What can I do?

Well, spit it out then!

I agree that in this case, 'No, they don't, Jack is a total dickhead, everyone hates him' would have been a much better response.

I'm trying to raise my boy to understand the problem. It's hard to do without slagging off his misogynistic father (my ex).

It's depressing how many opportunities for discussion there are in media tv song lyrics etc etc etc etc etc.

I also lead by example. I left a misogynist. Told my kids as adults they will always have a home with me and will always be able to leave. I also stress how it's bad for men too- misogynistic men miss out on so much in life and often end up alone. Perfect example being my ex having women leave him. He gets a cushy couple of years treating a woman like shit then he's left alone. My son has said he wants to live with his kids when an adult- I've explained that will be very easy to achieve if he takes equal part in house and childcare and treats his partner well. Time will tell if I've done enough

Therein lies the issue, we don't equip and back each other to call it out at every chance.
in the case of the Hunt murders, Carol Hunt thought it kind to open the door to her daughter's abuser. We've got to stop being kind.
Discussions always concentrate on women and girls, but we've got to include men and boys. There are issues amongst lower class white boys that are being ignored and so they are ripe for the picking by extremist groups. During Covid, the potential of the new age of death was very much being discussed. It was considerably higher than the age that most lower WC white men In Glasgow and Blackpool live to and that's a direct link to the poverty faced by them. They feel no-one is listening. Hate speech needs to include sex, so the extreme views of the Tate brothers etc aren't given platforms. Like it or not, people coming into the country who see women as property and are used to child marriages, also needs investment in education. We have a way of life and religion shouldn't be able to ignore our laws. Be that over voting and working outside the home, or abortion. We are slowly weeding out the bad apples in our police, that needs to continue.

I don't think it's as simple as saying it's a problem for men to solve. That's wishful thinking. What we need to do is create a society where toxic views are unacceptable. And that's not a cancel-culture woke interpretation of what's "toxic" it's to create a uniform standard of what is acceptable that everyone can get on board with.

First of all, we need to accept that clamping down on misogyny means a change to our attitudes to religious and racial discrimination. Currently, discrimination against women is third in the pecking order of how seriously the discrimination is taken. The current PC/woke hierarchy is racism is most serious (excluding white people), religious discrimination second (excluding Christianity), homophobia third, misogyny fourth, transphobia fifth (although that is grappling to change position with misogyny), discrimination against physically disabled people sixth, ageism (when against elderly people) seventh and discrimination against people with mental disabilities eighth.

There is only so much "progressive goodwill" to go around and currently most of society's efforts are spent on tackling racism and religious discrimination. Discrimination against women is a distant fourth, I guess because of its unusual position in the hierarchy in that most of the "victims" of other discrimination make up a small proportion of society, women make up half. If we want more progress to be made on womens' rights, we need to take the focus of the "progressive goodwill" away from racism, religion and homophobia, and put ourselves first.

If we could do that we would be in a very dominant position given the strength in numbers to force changes through.

I realise this doesn't sound very nice and I'm not suggesting it could happen, let alone it should, but no progress will be made until womens' rights are seen as more important than religious rights for example.

A problem with the "ask men to speak up to their mates about it" approach is that the somewhat decent men and the potentially violent misogynists aren't necessarily moving in the same social circles.

I think your second point is really really valid.

So many kids growing up seeing toxic behavior from men, and seeing mum put up with it, to a more or lesser extent.

Don't have kids with assholes. Starve the assholes out. Don't expose a child to asshole behavior and certainly never let a child see anyone putting up with asshole behavior.

Teach our young girls to take absolutely no shit whatsoever from men, and to leave and ignore at the very first red flag

Teach our boys that all humans deserve equal respect. Point out sexism and be scathing about it.

Keep all kids off the internet as long as possible.

I'd be interested to hear your new idea. If you don't want to put it on here, pm me.

Make sure all adult relationships are equal and stop showing children unhealthy relationships

Think carefully before having children with someone

Be a fully independent financially responsible grown up

Demand that the men in your life lead by example - your husband, partner, brother. Make them think about how they treat women - and how their daughters may be treated in the future. Support and advocate for women fleeing DA. Model gender nonconforming female roles.

Keep men accountable for their actions and words. Mental health, difficult childhood, neurodiversity are NOT an explaination for abuse.

Dd and her friends are absolutely gorgeous but I have noticed their boyfriends ..now they are late teens are not conventionally good looking . Then I twigged. They are dating the nice boys. The handsome rugby playing misogynists are not getting the girls.

Help women grow their assertiveness.
Nothing will ever change until women speak for themselves.

It's not as simple as that. The whole of society would need to change radically to make it that easy to just walk away in every circumstance. The housing system, the NHS, "big pharma", welfare, the justice system, cultural norms, and about 100 other things. The women who stay aren't just pushovers who are happy to tolerate "men's bullshit".

Imagine a woman who is in a relationship, everything is OK. She has a baby and ends up experiencing crippling PND. She can barely function at home, let alone go back to work. At the same time, her partner has become abusive (it is not uncommon for abuse to begin around the time a woman becomes pregnant or gives birth). How does she leave? Where does she go and how does she support herself and a baby, both financially and physically? It's all very well saying women should leave, and encouraging them to LTB on every other MN thread, but it's not practical because the framework for them to safely leave a relationship and live independently is just not there.

Yep.

My husband takes a proactive role in typically female stuff like baking for the school bake sales, volunteering at that stuff, promoting stuff at work that his employer is doing to support women and actively mentors all of his staff (male and felmale).

I make sure to do some of the more stereotypical stuff like DIY and washing and servicing the car.

We send our kids to dance and football. We talk about how things are not for boys or girls.

I think this stuff is important not only in shaping our kids but for them and us to be seen by others doing this stuff as it challenges their world view.

I also correct verbal slips like "male nurse" or "lady electrician".

Encourage the men in your life to take a stand. Men listen to men. I can't stand lad culture.

I think it is built in to our biology but I think some things help, like communities that value everyone, good leadership and discipline, clear boundaries of behaviour, forgiveness, rehabilitation of offenders, valuing ourselves and having respect for others. Healthy societies healthy relationships.

Call out every single bit of everyday sexism you see.

Zero tolerance for men's bullshit.

You see so many women on this forum who sound like great human beings but are putting up with lazy, selfish, abusive, porn sick men.

We need to educate and support girls better when it comes to relationships and sex.

Raised by mothers, or raised by parents? No mention of the father at all here when apportioning blame. Do we really think that the average misogynistic incel teenager has a father who is A. present and B. respectful and views women as equals?

I hope one day your daughter and friends feel brave enough to push off the bonds of enforced politeness, and tell the mum that the good looks are wasted as he doesn’t have a decent personality to back them up.

It’s not a criticism but I do think the expectation on females to be kind and polite is one of our greatest battles, and even been a contributing factor to some femicides.

This would have been a wonderful opportunity to make that mother take notice of how very wrong she is.

I know it's a big ask for young girls to be so forthright with an adult. Especially at a party. But that's exactly what's needed in cases like this. There are so many parents who say "not my Nigel" when Nigel is actually a piece of work.

and see everyone is quick to blame other men, but I think women and mothers are a big influence too. These lazy useless men who think they are entitled to anything are raised by mothers who think the same. Perfect example.

Ethnic minorities are not an oppressor group so this comparison does not work.

If you were to compare, say, white people then actually lots of us do similarly believe that racism (that which is perpetrated by white people) can only end if white people as a group reject the behaviour from within their own ranks.

Absolutely right. We have moved a long way from the overt sexism (and racism) that I can remember growing up with in the 70s, but it depresses me that there is still so much further to go.

It is down to us men to support, encourage and listen to women, and to call out bad male behaviour.

Feminism in principle does as a whole, but I was referring to one specific model, which I feel doesn’t. It’s a ‘play them at their own game’ feminism, which is doomed to failure.